http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Tag: bad inventions - Recent Posts en Mon, 18 May 2026 22:22:21 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141233 Wed, 29 Jan 2014 18:54:33 +0000 allebong 141233@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I had a pair of gripshifts that lasted 5 solid years of (ab)use on my old town bike, they were the really cheap plastic ones, but gosh the things just wouldn't give up. By the end of their life the internal cable winch/drum was barely synchronised with the outer twisty bit so you had to really force them past where they were meant to go to shift. With only 6 speeds the tolerances on the cable pull were large enough to get away with that, and though I did have some trouble shifting onto the largest/smallest cogs, I don't think they ever once let the mech slip once it'd settled. </p> <p>The right hand/rear shifter finally disintegrated inside and I replaced it with a similar but slightly better quality (so I thought) model from the bikestation drawer. Then something funny happened. The new shifter was excellent on my old bike, then when I transferred it to my newly built town bike a few months later the indexing broke. Literally all I did was take it off one handlebar and put it on another without even touching the cable but after that it was like a motorbike throttle, able to rotate smoothly back and forth, so it had to be used with the caution of a friction shifter. There's a bit of advice from Sheldon brown about 'never stand up to pedal on a mechanically unsound bike', I learned the value of this after the chain slipped under load and I was fired over the bars while going across a toucan crossing, while I'm grateful it was a green man and the cars were stopped, there was plenty of people to watch it happen. Worst injury was to my pride.</p> <p>There's some Biopace rings in the bikestation I seriously thought about buying, if only for the oddball quirkiness of them. I feel that along with parallel push V brakes, they're an idea that was unfairly maligned/ignored and stopped in development before their time. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141223 Wed, 29 Jan 2014 17:56:10 +0000 Focus 141223@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I actually thought they might put in Shimano's Biopace chainrings, even though I liked them. Then again, elliptical rings (albeit of differing specs and mainly for the road) are "in" so maybe they don't want to appear uncool! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141222 Wed, 29 Jan 2014 17:54:04 +0000 Focus 141222@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><strong>GripShift</strong>: (not x-ray, admittedly). Been fitted to my hardtail since I bought it and given me years of faultless service in all weathers without even having to replace the cables.</p> <p><strong>Elastomer suspension</strong>: Agreed, terrible idea. It was great for weight-saving but they did indeed seize up in the cold and I eventually replaced the elastomers in my full-suss bike's forks with springs. Night and day!</p> <p><strong>Bar ends</strong>: Maybe what's wrong is the <em>angle</em> some people use them at! 45 degrees (give or take) is the optimal angle, but I've seen some crazy and downright dangerous angles in my time, which can only reduce stability. I'd removed mine from my old rigid bike when it gave up the ghost and never put them on my hardtail when I bought it. Until last year when I decided to hell with them being less fashionable, they work!. Much nicer when honking up a hill or just needing to rest the joints.</p> <p><strong>Fingerless gloves</strong>: Really? Sure, for downhill or cold conditions, not so suitable, but the rest of the time they are fine for any type of cycling.</p> <p><strong>Toe clips</strong>: Spawn of the devil, say no more. Certainly unsuitable for MTBs and the first thing that came off my first true road bike.</p> <p><strong>Onza HO pedals</strong>: I still have a pair on my full-suss and I really like them! Also have an older pair in reserve. I don't take the bike out in colder conditions so I've never had much of an issue with the elastomers going stiff and I don't find them so hard to get in and out of. Sure, I'd replace them with SPD to match my hardtail (and therefore give me two bikes and two pairs of shoes using the same cleats) but until they wear out I'm sticking with them. Almost maintenance-free too. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141100 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 22:00:58 +0000 cb 141100@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@allebong, not the <a href="http://www.elliptigo.co.uk">ElliptiGO</a>?</p> <p>Or similarly the Me-Mover or Staircycle. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141090 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 18:34:12 +0000 Kim 141090@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Plastic hats and saying that they make people safer... ;-) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141084 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 17:33:28 +0000 allebong 141084@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I'm really irritated at the moment as I'm trying to recall the 'emulates walking' pedalling mechanism I was talking about, but I can't quite get it. It was definitely recently (90s I think) and it was the DIY work of one guy and a machine shop, he got his inspiration from an exercise machine and basically bodged that onto the frame with some complex linkages to the back wheel. It somewhat resembled this: </p> <p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeISifJ9OC8" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeISifJ9OC8</a></p> <p>I know I was looking at an info page on it last year, but darned if I can find it. Likely I'll come across it again years later when this thread is consigned to history.</p> <p><em>It would be great to have the world's top engineers work on making the bicycle something you get on and pedal, day in day out. </em></p> <p>It's been done <a href="http://sheldonbrown.com/english-3.html">decades ago</a> and the same applies today; you enclose all the mechanics of the bike away from the outside, and built it robustly to begin with. The modern take would be <a href="http://www.dutchbike.co.uk/Modern2b.htm">this</a> sort of thing, complete with hub brakes, dynamo lights, etc. Nowadays cartridge bearings, disc brakes, lighter materials etc should be able to produce something reasonably 'sporty' and agile that's also maintenance free. I've looked closely at dutch type bikes and the things that put me off are the too-relaxed riding position and the weight. I'm basically waiting for something like a flat bar road bike with discs, cartridge bearings all round, and a derailleur in a chaincase, but that doesn't seem to be coming.</p> <p><em>How about getting rid of the drive chain altogether and propelling yourself by pushing your feet off the ground? </em></p> <p>This is one of those great moments where you've said this in jest, yet there exists a serious and genuine attempt to do it:</p> <p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tH0yyYHir10" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tH0yyYHir10</a></p> <p>On single chainrings, they have been all the rage in mtb for a while now, they're usually used with a chainguide to prevent the aforementioned chain escape shenanigans. One of the best really innovative things to have emerged recently is <a href="http://www.pinkbike.com/news/Race-Face-Narrow-Wide-Chainring-Tested-2013.html">narrow-wide chainrings</a>, which does an excellent job of holding the chain on by itself.</p> <p>I've never personally found front mechs to be a problem on road at least, though my town bike and it's very up-to-date 3x6 speed freewheel transmission spends 99% of it's time in the middle ring. Though on occasions like going up Oxgangs road with a load on the back, into a wind, that's when having a delightful 22t granny ring pays off. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141082 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 16:34:26 +0000 amir 141082@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"On maintaining derailleurs I had an epiphany when changing from 3x9 to 1x10."</p> <p>My epiphanies about gears usually occur when ascending Redstone Rig. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141078 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 16:15:37 +0000 kaputnik 141078@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>On maintaining derailleurs I had an epiphany when changing from 3x9 to 1x10</em></p> <p>A third poster here did the same with his chain and derailleur and ended up semi-conscious on his face on the tarmac when the chain decided to go on strike and fall off the chainring*.</p> <p>* I'm not implying that single chainrings are one of the worst inventions, by the way! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110&page=2#post-141069 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 14:35:04 +0000 I were right about that saddle 141069@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"On maintaining derailleurs I had an epiphany when changing from 3x9 to 1x10."</p> <p>Yeah...my front mech died last year. Couldn't be faffed changing it, put the chain on the middle chain ring, took the front mech off and...never missed it in town. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141068 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 14:25:47 +0000 Roibeard 141068@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Kaputnik - old news on the <a href="http://www.gizmag.com/mando-footloose-ebike-alternator/24330/">crank driven alternator</a>...</p> <p>Robert </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141061 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 13:39:14 +0000 rust 141061@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>That list has been written a by a very particular subset of mountain biker - hopefully with their tongue pretty firmly in their cheek.</p> <p>On maintaining derailleurs I had an epiphany when changing from 3x9 to 1x10. Only having one derailleur makes everything SO much simpler. Like to the point of almost being idiot proof. It wouldn't take much of a design jump to makethem truly serviceable by anyone. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141058 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 13:19:13 +0000 I were right about that saddle 141058@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"Chains, derailleurs and sprockets are cheap, efficient, reliable and very user servicable."</p> <p>I'm caught here by the fact that I completely agree and completely disagree. They are reliable and they are user-serviceable....but only as long as;</p> <p>1) You're interested in maintaining them.<br /> 2) You've time to maintain them.<br /> 3) You're competent to maintain them.</p> <p>There's a whole parcel of bicyclists don't fall into all three of those categories. I'll spend a day rebuilding a bike and count it as leisure, but it would be great if there were bikes that didn't require you to understand them or get dirty.</p> <p>No one defrags the hard drive on an iPhone, no one adjusts the timing on their motor car and no one takes their holiday snaps to the chemist any more. It would be great to have the world's top engineers work on making the bicycle something you get on and pedal, day in day out. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141057 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 13:17:27 +0000 Cyclingmollie 141057@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Aluminium frames until they worked out how to do them right.<br /> Brakes with straddle-wires and nothing to prevent them catching on the tyre if the cable snaps.<br /> Wheels with big gaps between the spokes that wildlife can get caught in.<br /> Chromium plating which rusts and comes off in pieces like razor-blades.<br /> Solid tyres. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141054 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 13:00:21 +0000 Smudge 141054@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Min, you're doing it all wrong, you drive your SUV to the start of the gnarly/rad/hardcore/extreme off road path, erm sorry, trail, before getting onto two wheels and being a proper mtb'er. Roads are dangerous dontcha know?</p> <p>;-) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141048 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 12:07:39 +0000 Min 141048@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>It's probably only a matter of time before someone comes up with an electric transmission bike where the BB contains a generator linked to a motor in the rear hub, connected by wires, all in an effort to get rid of that pesky, efficient chain. </em></p> <p>Then all you need to add is another couple of wheels for stability and wham, the perfect bicycle. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141047 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 12:05:21 +0000 Min 141047@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Of course if we were "proper" mtb riders it would all be different... :-D </em></p> <p>Maybe! Or MTB riders that are so spoiled that they don't ever have to ride for a few miles on roads or landrover tracks, especially at the end of the day when you are tired and want to shift your position a bit.</p> <p>(I didn't even know what most of other stuff was mind you) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141046 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 12:04:16 +0000 wingpig 141046@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><blockquote><em>"...emulate walking..."</em></blockquote></p> <p>Except without the whole moving-forward-by-pivoting-off-your-back-foot-and-stopping-yourself-overbalancing-with-the-front-foot thing. The path taken by the feet when walking might be fine for walking but it's not massively easy to exert great forces in the directions in which the feet happen to travel. Pedalling as it stands at the moment is as good as anything for harnessing the big push downwards by swinging the leg backwards as when running.</p> <p><blockquote><em>"...where the BB contains a generator linked to a motor in the rear hub, connected by wires, all in an effort to get rid of that pesky, efficient chain."</em></blockquote></p> <p>How about a twin-hulled tyre protruding either side of a central toothed rim, driven by a gear mounted where the wheel comes closest to the seat tube, driven by a shaft going up the seat tube from the BB, via appropriate gearing? Perhaps with a brush arrangement so that pesky grime is brushed off the teeth before they interact with the drive-cog. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141045 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 11:46:47 +0000 kaputnik 141045@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>It's probably only a matter of time before someone comes up with an electric transmission bike where the BB contains a generator linked to a motor in the rear hub, connected by wires, all in an effort to get rid of that pesky, efficient chain. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141044 Tue, 28 Jan 2014 11:36:05 +0000 cb 141044@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"drive idea that was supposed to emulate walking, so your feet would be going straight back and forth on each side, linked to the back wheel by massive crank levers"</p> <p>Wasn't that Kirkpatrick MacMillan's idea?</p> <p>How about getting rid of the drive chain altogether and propelling yourself by pushing your feet off the ground? The next stage after that would be to get rid of the pesky bike and .... er ... walk. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141013 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 22:40:08 +0000 wingpig 141013@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Overly-ductile alloys.<br /> Zinc-plated corrodable hardware. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141012 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 22:34:56 +0000 Charterhall 141012@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>1970's suicide levers<br /> Kirk magnesium frames<br /> Long black socks </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-141001 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 19:48:11 +0000 allebong 141001@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>and what a lovely shiny chain lurks inside :) I'd put up a photo of my chain but I imagine we've all seen enough muck this month already.</p> <p>The z cranks are pretty sensible compared to some other proposals and attempts over the years. The great thing about the history of cycling is that pretty much any crazy idea that comes up today has already been tried with predictable results (or, sometimes unpredictable). I'm trying to remember this drive idea that was supposed to emulate walking, so your feet would be going straight back and forth on each side, linked to the back wheel by massive crank levers. It was the 'brainchild' of one eccentric bloke who was naturally convinced it would change the world, if only the rest of us fools would listen, save the people he did convince to try it and who (get ready for this) thought it both pointless and painful. </p> <p>Shaft drive is one of those ideas that is extremely simple and elegant on paper and then becomes a nightmare when you try to engineer it. Even fairly weak riders put out a surprising amount of torque into the cranks, which has to go through 2 gearboxes, both of which have to be small and light, the shaft itself is going to twist and lose efficiency in the process, then you have to make sure it all stays aligned so the gears don't wreck themselves. You can sort all that out, then end up with something still no better (and in many ways worse) than a chaincase. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-140990 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 18:47:21 +0000 LaidBack 140990@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Thanks for sharing that Allebong! Go faster cranks....<br /> <em><br /> I've been wondering why nobody has ever tried to make a lightweight plastic chaincase for derailleur gears yet, </em></p> <p>Arellcat's Quest Velomobile ;-) </p> <p>Chain is all inside and the rear mech even has its own inspection panel.</p> <p><a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/66067108@N08/8448539034/" rel="nofollow">http://www.flickr.com/photos/66067108@N08/8448539034/</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-140985 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 18:06:20 +0000 allebong 140985@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Before we worry about chain vs belt vs shaft drive, we need to sort the biggest flaw with the bicycle drivetrain, which is obviously the shape of the crank:</p> <p><img src="http://pardo.net/bike/pic/mobi/d.pmp-cranks/farm7.static.flickr.com/6088/6150562616_e2a0de8472.jpg"></p> <p>We've been doing it wrong all this time. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-140981 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 17:43:05 +0000 cc 140981@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I fitted bar ends on my last bike but one, and I loved them. They were invaluable in making my cheap mountain bike feel more like a comfy upright Dutch bike! (Just fit them pointing backwards and outwards instead of forwards and inwards...) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-140979 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 17:32:22 +0000 steveo 140979@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I'd still love a Klein Mantra, especially in the pearlescent green the high end ones came in, designed to be full suspension with a rigid fork, people just wouldn't believe it could work. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-140978 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 17:18:16 +0000 kaputnik 140978@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Chains, derailleurs and sprockets are cheap, efficient, reliable and very user servicable. </p> <p>I think replacement alternatives( belts, hubs, shafts) have some niche uses but will struggle to match their all-round appeal and therefore fail to displace them in a significant way. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-140976 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 17:16:31 +0000 Smudge 140976@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I quite liked gripshift on the commuter as well when it was flat barred, fewer sticky out breakable bits for the train and shifted fine when set up properly :-)</p> <p>Of course if we were "proper" mtb riders it would all be different... :-D </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-140973 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 17:09:33 +0000 Min 140973@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Wow, I didn't know I was wrong to fit and like my bar ends! I'm unlikely to get a flat barred bike in the future but if I did I would get bar ends again. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=12110#post-140968 Mon, 27 Jan 2014 16:41:11 +0000 wingpig 140968@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Tube-encased propshaft leading directly from the equivalent-of-the-BB to the rear hub?<br /> I still reckon a shortly-forthcoming Amazing New Expensive Thing will be frames custom-grown from bone, proteins and biological structural polymers. </p>