CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Cycling Action Plan for Scotland

CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Cycling Action Plan for Scotland http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Cycling Action Plan for Scotland en Wed, 08 Apr 2026 15:40:22 +0000 Morningsider on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=4#post-185815 Mon, 13 Apr 2015 21:17:05 +0000 Morningsider 185815@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ The first edition of CAPS was published in June 2010, effectively five years ago. With a few honourable exceptions, especially Edinburgh, cycling modal share has remained static across Scotland over that period. I think we can see a decent increase in cycling modal share over the next five years, particularly if investment is made in high quality cycle networks, as suggested in the article. However, I think the 10% Scotland-wide target for 2020 is impossible to achieve in just five years. Such a change could be possible in a single city - but not an entire country, particularly one with a large rural area with very low population densities. It is worth remembering that in the five years since CAPS was published, the Scottish Government has tried to cut cycle expenditure on at least two occasions. It is only sterling work by PoP, SPOKES and others that has managed to stop this from happening. chdot on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=4#post-185811 Mon, 13 Apr 2015 19:38:25 +0000 chdot 185811@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ " Scotland currently has a cycling mode share — the proportion of journeys made by bike — of just one percent, a figure that hasn't budged since the 1980s. The Scottish Government's Cycling Action Plan sets out a vision for that 10 percent target. However, some cycling advocates have expressed scepticism about the achievability of the goal, and the Scottish Government's level of commitment. In a discussion on the City Cycling Edinburgh forum, poster Morningsider commented: "I'm certain the Scottish Government could ensure the 10% target was met. I'm sure they would like it to be met, just not enough to really do anything about it." Irving thinks it can be done. "I feel it is ambitious but achievable," he told the Herald. "There is no doubt it does require a step change in the amount of effort required to help achieve it. " <a href="http://road.cc/content/news/148185-head-cycling-scotland-calls-cycle-superhighways" rel="nofollow">http://road.cc/content/news/148185-head-cycling-scotland-calls-cycle-superhighways</a> Darkerside on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=4#post-159844 Mon, 21 Jul 2014 09:27:18 +0000 Darkerside 159844@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ It's that lack of ownership that really breaks it. Without a single person being accountable, a change programme will only succeed through luck. On blog summaries, hum of the city (<a href="http://humofthecity.com/" rel="nofollow">http://humofthecity.com/</a>) generally includes a six word precis at the beginning of each post. My homepage is just a list of headlines and article summaries, but the latter isn't carried through into the article itself (and most people come straight to the article from links elsewhere). Hmm. chdot on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=4#post-159835 Sun, 20 Jul 2014 23:09:34 +0000 chdot 159835@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @Ds Useful piece of work. I should find it hard to believe that anyone (committee?) wrote this - " the cycling vision is a challenging aspiration that requires clear and committed shared ownership by all its stakeholders, " but... sallyhinch on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=4#post-159834 Sun, 20 Jul 2014 22:50:34 +0000 sallyhinch 159834@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Agree with @Insto - as someone who has to read several hundred blog posts a week, ideally a blog post should be possible to sum up in a sentence (if nothing else it makes my life much easier) ... one topic per post is golden. Darkerside on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=4#post-159832 Sun, 20 Jul 2014 22:37:18 +0000 Darkerside 159832@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Just in case anyone needs to remind themselves about Caps but wants to avoid reading the entire thing, I’ve finally finished that summary: <a href="http://www.darkerside.org/2014/07/cycling-action-plan-for-scotland-summarised/" rel="nofollow">http://www.darkerside.org/2014/07/cycling-action-plan-for-scotland-summarised/</a> Instography on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=4#post-158484 Tue, 01 Jul 2014 22:51:29 +0000 Instography 158484@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Not me. I spend too long editing at work to spend my spare time doing it too. My one piece of advice, which everyone at work routinely ignores and which I then have to reassert later, is to start by writing your whole argument in no more than three short sentences. If you can't do it in three sentences, you're not clear about what you're trying to say. These days I'd probably say if you can't tweet it, it's too complex. But people don't want to plan, they just want to get stuck in and write so they literally lose the plot. Darkerside on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=4#post-158483 Tue, 01 Jul 2014 22:31:09 +0000 Darkerside 158483@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Volunteers...? :p Instography on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-158462 Tue, 01 Jul 2014 16:22:08 +0000 Instography 158462@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ No editor. Darkerside on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-158451 Tue, 01 Jul 2014 15:01:42 +0000 Darkerside 158451@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Morningsider: spot on, thanks. I'd found the Scottish Household Survey, but got lost in their website. Arellcat: thanks. I'd found the Spokes article (and then dug into the linked stuff like Carbon Scotland). The Charter of Brussels is a new one though. Why is it that blog posts intended to be short always end up enormous? Arellcat on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-158440 Tue, 01 Jul 2014 14:34:54 +0000 Arellcat 158440@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ This is perhaps a starter for ten: <a href="http://www.spokes.org.uk/wordpress/2013/02/1-by-2020-vision-or-target/" rel="nofollow">http://www.spokes.org.uk/wordpress/2013/02/1-by-2020-vision-or-target/</a> CAPS 2010 states that it's a vision, of 10% of all journeys taken in Scotland. CAPS 2013 states that it's a shared vision, of 10% of "everyday journeys" taken in Scotland. They also refer to Edinburgh's Charter of Brussels, which is "a modal share of 15% by 2020". There is a note that 'currently' (2013) the modal share is 7% – of journeys to work by bike. Morningsider on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-158439 Tue, 01 Jul 2014 14:34:50 +0000 Morningsider 158439@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ The 1.2% figure is from the Scottish Household Survey Travel Diary 2012. You can see the figure in Table 2: <a href="http://www.transportscotland.gov.uk/statistics/j285661-12.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.transportscotland.gov.uk/statistics/j285661-12.htm</a> Darkerside on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-158432 Tue, 01 Jul 2014 14:18:23 +0000 Darkerside 158432@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ *Dredge*. If everyone promises not to talk about the Niceway Code, might I ask a question? What metric is being used for the 10% by 2020 target (deliberately target, rather than vision)? CAPS2013 mentions several potential indicators, but then I read somewhere a figure of 1.2% in 2012, so presumably they've decided on one. Any ideas? I realise I'm a bit behind on this, but given SPT are starting to hide behind it I thought I'd bring myself up to speed with a bunch of dull documents... fimm on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115721 Tue, 25 Jun 2013 09:28:04 +0000 fimm 115721@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ We came up behind a bus with a "Give Me Cycle Space" ad on the back yesterday - I was driving, boyfriend in passenger seat. I asked b/f what he thought of the ad. He hadn't even noticed it, or registered that it was about cyclists, and having read it he didn't think that it would make any difference to anyone. This advert has a child's head in a helmet, no picture of a bike at all. chdot on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115708 Tue, 25 Jun 2013 00:29:45 +0000 chdot 115708@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ " “SEStran is looking forward to working with Scottish Government and the other partners in the Delivery Forum, to make reaching the target of 10% of everyday journeys taken in Scotland being by bike by 2020 a reality.” " <a href="http://www.sestran.gov.uk/news/146/sestran-welcomes-publication-of-cycling-action-plan-for-scotland/" rel="nofollow">http://www.sestran.gov.uk/news/146/sestran-welcomes-publication-of-cycling-action-plan-for-scotland/</a> chdot on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115656 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 13:36:41 +0000 chdot 115656@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ "£400,000 is a good amount of cash, could build nice bit of infrastructure for that. However, it isn't a huge marketing spend - particularly when it includes TV adverts." Yes. 'But that's a different budget/local authorities' responsibility'. "Cycling Scotland do claim that the campaign is a great success. However, they assess this by asking drivers and parents how they have reacted to the campaign - rather than trying to measure the actual impact." It's hard to imagine enough real world changes to be measurable. Of course we'll have to see what is actually released as the new campaign, but I'll take a lot of convincing before I think that it's a good use of SG/CS money. sallyhinch on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115648 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 12:55:32 +0000 sallyhinch 115648@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ meanwhile Glasgow's cycling tsar seems to have benefited from his trip to the Netherlands <a href="http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/columnists/agenda-creating-a-cycle-friendly-nation.21388251" rel="nofollow">http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/columnists/agenda-creating-a-cycle-friendly-nation.21388251</a> Wilmington's Cow on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115635 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 12:03:03 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 115635@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Don't *bleep*ing run over *bleep*ing children? Who the *bleep* comes up with this *bleep*? I mean are we going to have a *bleep*ing campaign telling the stupid *bleep*ers to *bleep*ing well not shoot their *bleep*ing grannies next? *bleep*ing *bleep* *bleep* Morningsider on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115634 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:59:38 +0000 Morningsider 115634@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ chdot - £400,000 is a good amount of cash, could build nice bit of infrastructure for that. However, it isn't a huge marketing spend - particularly when it includes TV adverts. I still marvel at the fact someone authorised an advertising campaign telling drivers not to run over children. I'm sure it would have made an excellent episode of The Thick of It. chdot on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115629 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:41:24 +0000 chdot 115629@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ "like the Give me Space campaign which suggested a child's arm width was enough room" Ah well - I think the intention was to indicate that the space required was BOTH arms lengths! Also I fear part of the message that gets across is 'give space to children' (only?)' holisticglint on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115626 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:35:37 +0000 holisticglint 115626@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I think it would be effective if there was a campaign which simply highlighted some of the advice from Level 2 Bikeability. <a href="http://www.dft.gov.uk/bikeability/wp-content/uploads/National_Standard_for_Cycle_Training_Level_TWO1.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.dft.gov.uk/bikeability/wp-content/uploads/National_Standard_for_Cycle_Training_Level_TWO1.pdf</a> If everyone cycled like this - in primary 80% of the time, and outside of the door zone, and not using cycle lanes under 1.5m (its all in there!) - then suddenly segregated cycle lanes would start looking like a good idea... minus six on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115624 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:29:25 +0000 minus six 115624@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Once you've got those conditions in place, it's time to talk about campaigns of mutual respect and encouragement. Not before... Keith doesn't do before or after. He does instead of. sallyhinch on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115621 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:14:59 +0000 sallyhinch 115621@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Keith has clearly completely misunderstood what's going on in those streets in Amsterdam. Yes, cars are 'guests' there - that's because you only drive down those streets if you're going to one of those houses or shops, because rat runs have been eliminated so you literally are a guest or a visitor, and also there are fewer cars. And the roads are designed to make it hard to speed on them, so the few cars there are behave better - even if they wanted to mow down their neighbour's children they're going to struggle to get up enough speed. Once you've got those conditions in place, it's time to talk about campaigns of mutual respect and encouragement. Not before... minus six on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115620 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:14:05 +0000 minus six 115620@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ there will be calls for cyclists to stay off the pavement unless the council say the pavement is a shared use path... in which case, DO stay off the road. chdot on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115619 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:13:11 +0000 chdot 115619@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @o_0 O so cynical. And more or less correct. Had a 'preview' Ad agency pretty told to think again. I don't think CS wants them to. @Morningsider - "Does he really think that a poorly funded advertising campaign is going to change road behaviour?" Depends how you define "poorly". New one due to cost £400k... Wilmington's Cow on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115618 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:09:38 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 115618@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I think we all know that that's not what the campaign will say. There will be calls for drivers to give cyclists room and so on; and there will be calls for cyclists to stay off the pavement and not run reds. But as Morningsider says, the effect will be negligible to nil (on both sides) as there will be no enforcement and probably a really poorly designed poster (like the Give me Space campaign which suggested a child's arm width was enough room). minus six on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115616 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:06:18 +0000 minus six 115616@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Ok, lets have that upcoming Mutual Respect campaign in full: Cyclists ! DO keep over to the left DON'T ride two or more abreast DO wear helmet and hi viz at all times DON'T expect any sympathy or protection from the authorities if you are involved in a 'collision' Motorists ! DO continue to regard the speed limit as the de facto lower end of your cruising speed spectrum DON'T expect to be unduly inconvenienced on your important journey by 'vulnerable' road users DO remember that its YOUR road, your taxes pay for it but DON'T drink and drive Morningsider on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115613 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:00:01 +0000 Morningsider 115613@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ SRD - you are correct. Cycling Scotland do claim that the campaign is a great success. However, they assess this by asking drivers and parents how they have reacted to the campaign - rather than trying to measure the actual impact. This is important - how many drivers when asked "Has the campaign encouraged you to slow down near schools" are going to say "No"? I would argue that Cycling Scotland's analysis of the campaign is effectively worthless. You have lots of experience of cycling to school and the traffic environment around it - have you noticed some magical transformation in driver behaviour in the last year? I know that is anecdotal evidence - but does anyone really think this campaign has made any difference? SRD on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115606 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 10:14:28 +0000 SRD 115606@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @Morningsider - couldn't agree more, but I thought they claimed given 'Give Me Cycle Space' was a huge success. Any insight into the data? Morningsider on "Cycling Action Plan for Scotland" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10500&page=3#post-115589 Mon, 24 Jun 2013 09:57:57 +0000 Morningsider 115589@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Keith Brown quoted in The Times "He said a “mutual respect campaign” would be launched next week and it would go “a long way” to ensuring both motorists and cyclists used the roads appropriately." Does he really think that a poorly funded advertising campaign is going to change road behaviour? I'd be willing to put money on the fact it will make zero difference - given the effectiveness of the Give Me Cycle Space Campaign?