http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Petition to ban pavement cycling Edinburgh en Wed, 13 May 2026 08:53:08 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-186750 Thu, 23 Apr 2015 23:24:15 +0000 neddie 186750@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>EEN comment from Alison Adamson of MacPherson Tartans and Kilts in the EEN PoP article:<br /> <a href="http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/fatal-crash-bike-rolled-out-for-road-safety-rally-1-3751951" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/fatal-crash-bike-rolled-out-for-road-safety-rally-1-3751951</a></p> <p>"""<br /> <em>On Monday evening I witnessed a cyclist nearly being killed by strangulation because of her own stupidity. A young lady turned into Grosvenor Street on her bike and her extra long scarf got caught up on the chain. A Taxi was turning into the street at the same time and narrowly avoided her. She was so busy trying to untangle the scarf, and straighten out her wheel, she did not even pay attention to the taxi and I don't think she knows how close she came to getting killed. When you see someone who should be old enough to know better, it does the cyclist's arguments no favours. I'm known for taking a petition to the Council over pavement cycling and was subjected to a lot of abuse from cyclists especially on one of the City cycling forums. I was pleased that the problem was highlighted, but I still think the cycling groups have to speak out about the rogue cyclists who do not care about their own or the safety of others. There has been a slight decrease in the number of pavement cyclists, but there are still far too many. Adults who want to cycle should stay on the road and let the pedestrians walk in safety on the pavements.</em><br /> """ </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124786 Fri, 13 Sep 2013 17:42:39 +0000 crowriver 124786@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Pavement parking epidemic on Nethergate in Dundee this morning. Regardless of double yellow lines, junctions nearby, whatever. Totally blatant disregard of pedestrians too.</p> <p>Can the all singing, all dancing brand new Police Scotland not do a wee crackdown on this menace? Start in city centres near shops and banks. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124761 Fri, 13 Sep 2013 11:44:05 +0000 PS 124761@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@splitshift That's interesting and, I guess, pragmatic. It does suggest that it's okay for HGVs to mount the pavement and crack all the flagstones. What's the HGV approach to that damage? Can the Council come after haulage firms to pay for paving repairs? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124756 Fri, 13 Sep 2013 11:11:27 +0000 Dave 124756@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Up near the house pavement parking is chronic. If you were in a wheelchair you'd probably have to wheel it down the road amongst the traffic. </p> <p>When those same drivers are out on their bikes, why do we expect them to respect the pavement more than they do with their car? What an unrealistic expectation that just sets people up to get annoyed with folk on bikes.</p> <p>It's a much more fundamental issue than Outraged of Edinburgh frothing in the EEN would like you to believe, IMO. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124599 Thu, 12 Sep 2013 08:18:35 +0000 splitshift 124599@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>being on pavements.also, while sitting my HGV test I was informed by my instructor, that if I need to drive over a kerb, onto a pavement, then as long as I inform my driving examiner that I am about to do so, and the reason , ie my vehicle is too big , then its ok and not afail. I did have to in my test, I did stop , infirm him and passed. So beware, bikes on the pavement are just the thin edge of the wedge !!!( tounge firmly in cheek !)were all doomed ! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124415 Tue, 10 Sep 2013 00:08:30 +0000 crowriver 124415@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I think somebody at the council has heard about all the cyclists falling over on tram lines. So they've rushed loads of shared use signs onto pavements near awkward tramline junctions, in the hope that cycling on the pavement will help prevent falls? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124400 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 22:06:10 +0000 chdot 124400@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"I was on St Andrews Square today and genuinely bemused by the new shared use signs that have appeared. It seemed to suggest that footpath on the North side of the square is shared use. Is it?"</p> <p><a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/chdot/9689381610/"><img src="http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5329/9689381610_ff83b57acd.jpg"></a><br /> <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/chdot/9689381610/">(not) Segregated not shared...</a></p> <p>All the bike parking that was there has gone.</p> <p>And there is a bit of building work -</p> <p><a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/chdot/9689390202/"><img src="http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5530/9689390202_c1790a4300.jpg"></a><br /> <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/chdot/9689390202/">Cycle route</a></p> <p><a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/chdot/9686140031/"><img src="http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5487/9686140031_273c94ac82.jpg"></a><br /> <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/chdot/9686140031/">Don't know if this sign is in the right place</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124396 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 20:27:56 +0000 neddie 124396@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The petition could work in our favour...</p> <p>If the council endorse it, they would have no choice but to convert all shared-use into proper segregated facilities. Otherwise cyclists will continue to be seen 'cycling on the pavement'* when they are using shared use.</p> <p>* I bet that many non-cyclists have no clue that shared-use even exists. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124380 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 14:45:48 +0000 PS 124380@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Speaking of which, I was on St Andrews Square today and genuinely bemused by the new shared use signs that have appeared. It seemed to suggest that footpath on the North side of the square is shared use. Is it?</em></p> <p>So it would appear, which is odd as the footpath is quite narrow. I'd rather ride down the metre-wide gap between the tramline and the kerb.</p> <p>Out of interest, where does that route come from before it bgets to N St And Street? Presumably clockwise around the square? or can you cyle in line wih the tramlines on the wast side of the square? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124378 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 14:30:26 +0000 Morningsider 124378@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Insto - if the Committee applied a bit of lateral thinkg to the problem, i.e. cyclists trying to get around the tram/road works, then I would argue the solution would be to make all the affected pavements shared use. No offences committed - everyone's a winner!</p> <p>I'm sure the petitioner would agree - unless (perish the thought) they just don't really like cyclists - or "lost customers" as I think she should now consider them. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124376 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 14:21:43 +0000 Instography 124376@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Presumably the petitions committee could only decide to endorse a petition calling for a ban on a banned thing. Which, to the petitioner, would be a great victory since it would get more publicity for the scourge of pavement cycling.</p> <p>Speaking of which, I was on St Andrews Square today and genuinely bemused by the new shared use signs that have appeared. It seemed to suggest that footpath on the North side of the square is shared use. Is it? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124373 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 13:14:46 +0000 crowriver 124373@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>eddie_h: I would think if you found a list of members of the <a href="http://www.fsb.org.uk/eastofscotland/edinburgh/contact">FSB</a>, then found those based around Haymarket, that'd be a pretty good start.</p> <p>According to the FSB, their sole <a href="http://www.fsb.org.uk/scotland/pteam">policy</a> on transport is this:</p> <p>"Transport</p> <p><strong>The</strong> issue*<br /> Small businesses depend on their car/van to operate their business - 72 per cent of small firms said their car/van is crucial to their business. </p> <p>We have warned that more needs to be done to address the problem of congestion and the state of repair of UK roads, in order to get businesses moving and growing. <strong>A well functioning transport system incorporating all modes of transport, rather than looking at each mode individually is crucial to small rural businesses</strong>. **</p> <p>Our research shows that half of small businesses believe the poor state of the UK's roads has cost their business up to £5,000 in the past 12 months. This is a huge figure considering that the average turnover for small firms is around £500,000. </p> <p>Solutions<br /> We argue that more strategic planning and management of transport can help markets work more effectively. <strong>Rebalancing the funds collected from road users and the amount invested back into improving the road network</strong> would prevent the poor state of roads and high levels of congestion from costing small firms. "</p> <p><a href="http://www.fsb.org.uk/business-issues/infrastructure" rel="nofollow">http://www.fsb.org.uk/business-issues/infrastructure</a></p> <p>Maybe they should rename the organisation the Federation of Small-Minded Businesses.</p> <p>* - (my emphasis) ironically accompanied by an image of a massive juggernaut driving on the wrong side of an empty road.<br /> ** - then goes on to just look at one aspect of transport in isolation.....Doh! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124370 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 12:56:32 +0000 kaputnik 124370@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I did think to start a petition calling on petitions to ban things which are already banned to be banned. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124369 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 12:40:00 +0000 neddie 124369@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Is there any way to know which businesses signed the petition?</p> <p>So we can avoid them, or publicly shame them... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124366 Mon, 09 Sep 2013 12:07:52 +0000 crowriver 124366@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>So, I wonder what the Petitions Committee finally decided on this? Are the minutes online yet?</p> <p>EDIT - It seems not yet. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124267 Sat, 07 Sep 2013 14:28:27 +0000 gembo 124267@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>We were going round in circles </p> <p>Was his excuse</p> <p>But not up on the pavement</p> <p>I am with kapps that the petition should be scrutinised by the group taxpayers's Scotland to show that it was a waste of taxpayers' money which was the further water when the councillor claimed salary and expenses to play solitaire.</p> <p>I think we should tryntomraise a petition banning petitions (I would say all of them but happy to go with just those judge pointless as this one should have been) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124261 Sat, 07 Sep 2013 13:46:10 +0000 steveo 124261@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Well shows what he thought of the petition, I'd probably be doing the same... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124259 Sat, 07 Sep 2013 13:45:24 +0000 kaputnik 124259@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Front page of today's Chipwrapper. I'm not sure a debate to ban something that's already banned with such a small number of petitioners counts as "important" use of council time though. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-124254 Sat, 07 Sep 2013 13:37:52 +0000 chdot 124254@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"<br /> The former Conservative group leader was captured on the council’s in-house webcam engrossed in the game, while fellow members of the public petitions committee debated an important call to ban hazardous cycling on city pavements.</p> <p>...</p> <p>The camera has him in full view as SNP councillor Jim Orr, sitting next to him, launches into a passionate contribution, but he continues to play on.</p> <p>"</p> <p><a href="http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/councillor-caught-playing-ipad-solitaire-in-meeting-1-3081716" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/councillor-caught-playing-ipad-solitaire-in-meeting-1-3081716</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-123201 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 15:23:49 +0000 Greenroofer 123201@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@chdot. How about a campaign in pretty colours, with a witty and whimsical tone that says something like 'grow up and stop riding your bike on the pavement': that should really help with fostering good relations between people on bikes and people on foot.</p> <p>...or perhaps not. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-123199 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 15:07:27 +0000 Roibeard 123199@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@chdot 'Nope'</p> <p>Robert </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=3#post-123198 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:39:35 +0000 chdot 123198@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"Now, I'm sure that's all perfectly clear..."</p> <p>Probably...</p> <p>Thanks. </p> <p>Any advice on a catchy advertising campaign to get this across to 'everyone'? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=2#post-123197 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:34:12 +0000 minus six 123197@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Pavement cycling is all about bad infra.</p> <p>Every. Single. Time.</p> <p>How could it possibly be otherwise? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=2#post-123196 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:32:29 +0000 Morningsider 123196@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>chdot - I'd always assume that a pavement is a "footway" i.e. it runs alongside a road (carriageway). You are right though - most footpaths would have to be adopted by the local authority as a public road before their use could be restricted to pedestrians only.</p> <p>Dave - that's not the Scottish definition of a footway, which is set out in Section 151 of the Roads (Scotland) Act 1984 as follows:</p> <p>For the purpose of this Act, where over a road the public right of passage referred to in the definition of “road” in subsection (1) above—</p> <p>(a)is by foot only, the road is—<br /> (i)where it is associated with a carriageway, a “footway”; </p> <p>Now, I'm sure that's all perfectly clear... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=2#post-123195 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:15:53 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 123195@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>*my head hurts*</p> <p>@Morningsider - I was thinking we need some sort of Batman-esque signal for you. We could mount a giant floodlight with an 'M' stencil on it to shine from the Castle. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=2#post-123194 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:12:41 +0000 SRD 123194@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Andy wightman had an interesting encounter earlier in the summer: <a href="http://www.andywightman.com/?p=2872" rel="nofollow">http://www.andywightman.com/?p=2872</a>;</p> <p>see also his more recent post about parks: <a href="http://www.andywightman.com/?p=2999" rel="nofollow">http://www.andywightman.com/?p=2999</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=2#post-123193 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:10:46 +0000 chdot 123193@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"Most footpaths do not meet this technical definition"</p> <p>Does that mean footpaths are 'pavements' in some places but in others need to be specially designated for peds <em>only</em> for bikes to be banned? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=2#post-123191 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:05:29 +0000 Dave 123191@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Footway is amusingly circular though because "<em>“footway” means a way comprised in a highway which also comprises a carriageway, being a way over which the public have a right of way on foot only</em>" </p> <p>i.e. we're back to it being beside a road, but also if the LRA granted access to those not on foot, say due to it being a core path, the footway would cease to be a footway ("public have a right of way on foot only") and thus surely an explosion of some sort would occur. </p> <p>Or perhaps a petition. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=2#post-123190 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:02:34 +0000 Morningsider 123190@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Technically, a "footpath" is a road where the right of passage is restricted to foot only and the road is not associated with a carriageway (road). Most footpaths do not meet this technical definition, meaning the access rights granted under the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 apply - i.e. you can cycle along them. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10828&page=2#post-123188 Tue, 27 Aug 2013 13:51:26 +0000 crowriver 123188@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/495/parks_gardens_and_open_spaces/1251/accessing_our_parks_and_greenspaces/3">Edinburgh's Core Paths</a> </p>