http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: "Electric cars 'may be costlier than petrol vehicles'" en Sun, 31 May 2026 08:38:47 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11933 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 22:40:16 +0000 steveo 11933@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Doubt there will be much of a problem with lithium disposal. I read that lithium mining is already pretty tight and most of the supplies come from less than friendly countries. Most lithium is already recycled due to the cost this will only increase as demand pushes raw material costs up. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11932 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 22:24:22 +0000 LaidBack 11932@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Problem I see is our reliance on a lot of this 'green' electric technology being made in coal burning China.<br /> (I'd prefer too if more of my bikes were made in Europe...)</p> <p>Disposal of Lithium batteries also needs careful management - other than shipping waste. </p> <p><em>I'm also not sure how people are going to use electric cars as status symbols</em><br /> They'll buy cars like the Prius with two engines or keep a small electric car for city use. This already happens I reckon with SmartCars. Rarely the sole car for a household as it carries less than a bike with four panniers! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11931 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 21:17:31 +0000 wee folding bike 11931@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I can see some improvements in efficiency but I suspect electric cars are going to smack into Sir Isaac Newton in a more significant way than a phone does.</p> <p>I'm also not sure how people are going to use electric cars as status symbols as the bigger and faster metics aren't going to there to the same extent because of the limited power. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11930 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 21:07:42 +0000 Smudge 11930@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>True, true :-(</p> <p>What a cheerful bunch we are! Still fancy a play with some of the new generation of electric bikes though :-) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11929 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 21:05:55 +0000 chdot 11929@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"if you are awaiting a sudden earth changing improvement in battery technology you may be dissapointed"</p> <p>I don't think I am, but I suspect it would be 'necessary' if there is any serious chance of the hype/expectations being fulfilled. </p> <p>Fossil fuel prices will undoubtedly rise, perhaps quite drastically, but for electrically driven vehicles to benefit from a price differential, there will have to be a lot more electricity produced from non-ff sources <em>and</em> at a unit price that is lower. </p> <p>Whatever alternative sources eventually prove (at commercial scale) to be technologically and economically viable, I will be (pleasantly) surprised if they are particularly cheap. </p> <p>Energy in all its forms is unlikely to be plentiful enough for current 'western' patterns of consumption/transport to continue. </p> <p>When added to the expectations of China etc., 'better batteries' may be a minor problem! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11928 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 20:46:02 +0000 Smudge 11928@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"Yes, one problem is whether or not there will ever be the 'technological breakthroughs' that are really required to produce (for instance) light/cheap/efficient/long lasting batteries."</p> <p>I think if you are awaiting a sudden earth changing improvement in battery technology you may be dissapointed, although I'd be delighted to be proven wrong!</p> <p>What we are seeing is a creeping improvement in out ability to store electricity, (combined with more efficient wind/wave/solar generators) and better engine control and regen technology, all these combined with developement of more efficient engines (like Cedric Lynch's Agni made engine), and the increasing cost of fossil fuels are steadily making elctric vehicles more practical.<br /> Already we can produce electric motorcycles which have the enurande and speed to lap the IOM TT course at a hair under 100mph, it took IC engines a long time to reach that stage!<br /> Personally I wonder where the fully enclosed streamliner type bike fits in, the efficiency improvements can be vast and the only reason IC bikes don't use that type is because of archaic FIM regulations designed to limit the speed of racing motorcycles!</p> <p>But stepping away from that digression, mobile phones stay charged for ages largely due to lower current drain rather than great battery improvements, battery improvements help, but it's progress in every area that we are seeing and need to continue to see. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11927 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 15:29:45 +0000 wee folding bike 11927@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I'm still ticked off at Top Gear's pictures showing rows of cars waiting to be scrapped under the Dark Lord's scheme. </p> <p>One of the photos included a LandRover Defender. </p> <p>A Defender is not like other cars. It should be out there doing something useful not sitting on a runway waiting to be crushed for no reason other than the owner wanted something new and the former administration in Westminster wanted to buy some votes. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11925 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 12:30:30 +0000 chdot 11925@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"it's a fascinating time for transport"</p> <p>Yes, one problem is whether or not there will ever be the 'technological breakthroughs' that are really required to produce (for instance) light/cheap/efficient/long lasting batteries.</p> <p>We've been told that 'fuel cells are just around the corner' and 'the future is hydrogen' for at least 30 years.</p> <p>Directly related to this (i.e. energy production - in usable form) is the new 'quest' for 'clean coal'/'carbon capture'. Whether these will every be technically possible/cost effective remains to be seen. Probably not as bad as the unsolved problem of storing nuclear waste.</p> <p>Remember when electricity was going to be 'so cheap it won't be worth putting light switches in new buildings'??</p> <p>Whichever way the future goes, there is no possibility that every person/family in the entire world will have their own 4 wheeled, powered, private transport! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11922 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 12:08:20 +0000 Smudge 11922@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>That's one subsidy I'm relatively happy with if it encourages the changeover.<br /> The figures relate to first generation (effectively) vehicles which are of course more expensive, few people I meet habitually buy brand new vehicles, so for them electric may be MUCH cheaper.<br /> Desperate claims made to help continue the sales of liquid fuel vehicles imho.</p> <p>Personally I'm very interested to see the developement of electric bicycles, bikes and cars, it's a fascinating time for transport. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11921 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 12:03:30 +0000 Kim 11921@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>More government subsidy for motorists...</p> <p>You could get five (or ten) bikes for that! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=1298#post-11919 Sat, 28 Aug 2010 09:28:51 +0000 chdot 11919@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>AND</p> <p>"from 1 January next year the government will also give a £5,000 subsidy to each electric car that is purchased in the UK"</p> <p><a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11112820" rel="nofollow">http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11112820</a> </p>