http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: "Edinburgh ‘Oystercard’ launched for buses and tram" en Thu, 21 May 2026 15:47:33 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-265744 Tue, 07 Nov 2017 09:45:46 +0000 steveo 265744@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Still hate those retched ticket machines... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-265737 Tue, 07 Nov 2017 08:50:46 +0000 chdot 265737@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://twitter.com/firstinglasgow/status/927575757014163456" rel="nofollow">https://twitter.com/firstinglasgow/status/927575757014163456</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164233 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 23:37:00 +0000 paolobr 164233@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I've worked in Montpellier in France over the years and used the tram system there. Similar population, cultural centre, university town. Carnet of 10 cheaper than 10 singles (and cheaper than Edinburgh if I recall). Four lines crossing the city (60km), and a fifth in plan. Validate your ticket on the tram, most people do so, bikes are allowed. Never seen a 'ticket inspector'. There's a system (Velomagg, in the summer) to pick up a hire bike to use to get to the beach (ok you need to switch to a bus from the tram to get to the bike hire), but all in the cost of a ticket. Seamless. It can't be difficult.</p> <p>Also many cycle paths alongside roads and streets in the city.</p> <p>Oh, and there's a cycle path from the city along the river out to the beach at Palavas. Got punctured there once and a nice local stopped and gave me his emergency pressure foam repair cylinder. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164226 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 22:22:18 +0000 Lizzie 164226@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I don;t undersdtand why I have to 'validate' my ridacard before boarding the tram when once I get on along comes a 'revenue dogsbody' (didn;t these folks used to be called 'ticket inspectors' or even 'conductors' at one time??) to then check that my ridacard is valid. I would think that if its going to be checked on the tram (and it always is) that the pre-check is just an unnecessary annoyance. Seems to be a lot of red tape for nothing. Or maybe the trams just like wasting money having the on-board 'revenue dogsbodys' when really their role should be a random check, the fear of which leads folks to getting their tickets, as it is in other places.<br /> Either way. Has anyone else noticed how empty the trams are now the festival visitors have all gone away?<br /> When will the trial to carry bikes (that is non-folding bikes) start? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164175 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 14:20:29 +0000 steveo 164175@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Maybe these things bug me more because I do this kind of thing for a living. </p> <p>Maybe its because its actually made me miss my transport for no good reason. Even if you did make your tram @AKen (just) wouldn't it be better if you <em>made</em> your tram comfortably? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164173 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 14:15:22 +0000 steveo 164173@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Might even film it to see how long it takes to negotiate these fiendish machines one handed.</em><br /> <em>The tram arrived at the platform before I crossed the road but I still managed to get over, buy my ticket and get on (just) before the doors closed. Not complicated. </em></p> <p>No complicated but unnecessarily clunky. See above where the UI used by bus drivers and compare it to the UI used by the these machines. It only needs 2 buttons alright four (children). </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164169 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 13:50:40 +0000 AKen 164169@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>i Might even film it to see how long it takes to negotiate these fiendish machines one handed.</p> <p>I had to get a tram from Shandwick place the other day. The tram arrived at the platform before I crossed the road but I still managed to get over, buy my ticket and get on (just) before the doors closed. Not complicated. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164165 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 13:15:30 +0000 Nelly 164165@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Although clearly cycling home, I am going to take a small detour to Edinburgh Park Station and time a ticket purchase.</p> <p>Might even film it to see how long it takes to negotiate these fiendish machines one handed.</p> <p>;-) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164155 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 12:33:04 +0000 Min 164155@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em> I don't think it's asking for too much for a big red button on the tram ticket machine welcome screen that says "£1.50 single". </em></p> <p>That sounds fair. The fare system is very simple so why not a very simple ticket machine? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164151 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 12:22:14 +0000 steveo 164151@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>When the equipment came to the end of its useful life,</em></p> <p>It was cheaper to bin it than replace the factory installed roll of paper that had run out? They were installed around the time the tram lines were being installed I think the idea was that you'd get used to buying from the machine before the trams made it compulsory. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164150 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 11:52:41 +0000 cb 164150@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Picture here:</p> <p><a href="http://www.busandcoach.com/newspage.aspx?id=5182&amp;categoryid=0">http://www.busandcoach.com/newspage.aspx?id=5182&amp;categoryid=0</a></p> <p>Looks like there were four buttons. presumably two for child tickets.</p> <p>From that page:</p> <p>"When the equipment came to the end of its useful life, we made the decision to remove the machines permanently rather than invest in new ones to keep fares down for customers"</p> <p>How long were they operational for? Not <em>that</em> long? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164146 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 11:36:48 +0000 acsimpson 164146@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I can't find a picture to confirm but my memory of those machines was that they had two buttons. One for a day ticket and the other for a single. Genius in it's simplicity. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164117 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 10:09:42 +0000 cb 164117@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The short-lived bus ticket machines were never that complicated.</p> <p>They didn't even worry about such tricky concepts as giving change - but I suppose that is part of the unique Edinburgh Bus experience. AND they saved you 10p. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376&page=2#post-164114 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 10:06:19 +0000 steveo 164114@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Hey, I'm a dittery young(ish) chap and I missed the tram the first time I tried it!</em></p> <p>I've now missed three journeys due to these machines. First one I seen the tram coming along Broomhouse but it was the first time I'd encountered this idiocy, the second I was coming back from the pub and really did just need a "take me home button". The third I was heading to Haymarket for a meeting when I was stuck behind confused above. I've so far used the tram 4 times... Only one that wasn't frustrating was the return of the first where I had a day ticket.</p> <p>It needs two <strike>settings stun and kill</strike> buttons single and day ticket, any thing else you need the menu. It strikes me they're more interested in collecting MI than a rapid customer experience. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164111 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 09:58:16 +0000 kaputnik 164111@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>First time you miss the tram because there is a dittery old lady trying to work out if its better to buy a ticket to Murrayfield or Haymarket</em></p> <p>Hey, I'm a dittery young(ish) chap and I missed the tram the first time I tried it!</p> <p><em>But then I don't go looking for problems, just drop the money in the slot and take a ticket.</em></p> <p>I don't look for them either, but if you can direct me to the machine into which you actually just pop £1.50 and the ticket comes out, I may be less grumblesome.</p> <p>Once you are more familiar with the user experience I'm sure it speeds up, but the first couple of times I've use it I found it needlessly laborious. There's a good reason that it's time efficient to just get on the Lothian Bus and pop your £1.50 flat fare in the hopper - the driver isn't scrolling through a list of destinations on a tiny screen (or inputting codes off a route sheet) and trying to work out what your fare is. I don't think it's asking for too much for a big red button on the tram ticket machine welcome screen that says "£1.50 single". Think of all the seconds it would save and all the missed journeys it would avoid. Seconds. Vital seconds! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164107 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 09:48:31 +0000 acsimpson 164107@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Perhaps she was from outside town. Isn't it only Edinburgh council residents who get it free? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164105 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 09:37:49 +0000 steveo 164105@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Fair enough, confused tourist (this one doesn't even speak very good English or Spanish or German)...</p> <p>Don't travel pass users still have to tap their card before they travel as the bus pass users do?</p> <p><em>I am also unsure that QR code scanning or other types of new fangled stuff works any easier than a ticket machine for older people. </em></p> <p>My dad has no problem with contactless or QR codes... But the less people who have to use the single cumbersome ticket machine the lesser the queue or panic as the tram arrives.</p> <p><em>Lets ignore that the comment is fairly patronising to two sections of society, but if said tram user is a pensioner, I would probably tell her she doesnt need a ticket as her free bus pass is valid.</em></p> <p>And just for the record that wasn't (just) a patronising comment but actual user experience of an older person trying to navigate an unnecessarily cumbersome UI. I just never thought to say the tram was free with her pensioners pass, it was very much precoffee and I had other stuff on my mind. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164102 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 09:17:19 +0000 Nelly 164102@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"because there is a <strong>dittery old lady</strong> trying to work out if its better to buy a ticket to Murrayfield or Haymarket "</p> <p>Lets ignore that the comment is fairly patronising to two sections of society, but if said tram user is a pensioner, I would probably tell her she doesnt need a ticket as her free bus pass is valid.</p> <p>At least thats what my dittery old mum and dad have told me............</p> <p>I am also unsure that QR code scanning or other types of new fangled stuff works any easier than a ticket machine for older people. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164100 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 09:11:54 +0000 cc 164100@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The only time I went on the tram I used a day ticket which I bought on the bus. Easier than dealing with machines. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164096 Wed, 03 Sep 2014 08:51:50 +0000 steveo 164096@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>First time you miss the tram because there is a dittery old lady trying to work out if its better to buy a ticket to Murrayfield or Haymarket you'll not be looking for problems you'll be just as annoyed by poor implementation of a pointlessly complex UI. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164074 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 21:02:06 +0000 Nelly 164074@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I have never had a problem getting a tram ticket. But then I don't go looking for problems, just drop the money in the slot and take a ticket. Must take about 3 seconds..... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164053 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 15:35:39 +0000 kaputnik 164053@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>The ticket machines for the tram are so cumbersome that if the tram is approaching the stop you've already missed it, whilst scanning the QR code would be much quicker. </em></p> <p>This.</p> <p>Also there's only 1 machine per platform, so if there are people ahead of you, again you'll miss it.</p> <p>Being able to use a card is great, but it's still slow. And then there's the paywave / tap and pay which doesn't work, even though the logo is on the front of the machine and what looks like a reader area.</p> <p>Oh and why does it ask your destination for a flat fare ticket (airport excluded) which you have to pick off a wee touch screen that you can't read in glare, and then prints you a ticket without the destination regardless? It should have 2 options - "Airport" / "Not Airport" by default and "other options" e.g. day tickets hidden away elsewhere.</p> <p>Oh and while we're on the subject, the rain gets into the ticket trough and you get a wet ticket, or when you open the flap to retrieve your ticket it blows away...</p> <p>A thoroughly useless user experience. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164050 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 15:02:44 +0000 steveo 164050@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em> 3 return journeys and a one-way and that's your £10.50 gone... </em></p> <p>I might almost make 7 journeys in a year but probably not 6 months which is a shame because it would be good to have my phone loaded with credit. The ticket machines for the tram are so cumbersome that if the tram is approaching the stop you've already missed it, whilst scanning the QR code would be much quicker. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164049 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 14:58:47 +0000 steveo 164049@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>But that would leave them having to pay out literally millions and I'm not sure logistically how practical that would be, never mind the hit to the books. </em></p> <p>If they acted in good faith the money from these dormant cards will be sitting ring fenced earning interest and could be made available with out too much effort. I doubt Literally Millions is that big a deal for TFL since it has a turn over of <a href="https://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/about-tfl/how-we-work/corporate-governance/chief-officers">literally billions. </a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164048 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 14:43:19 +0000 condor2378 164048@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@acsimpson </p> <p>Theoretically, yes, everything is possible. </p> <p>But that would leave them having to pay out literally millions and I'm not sure logistically how practical that would be, never mind the hit to the books. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164047 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 14:31:34 +0000 acsimpson 164047@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@condor2378, TfL could stop using the oyster quite easily. They would just have to provide a way for anyone with cash left on a card to obtain a refund. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164041 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 13:16:13 +0000 threefromleith 164041@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I was originally sceptical of the Lothian Buses mTicket app, since you could only buy a minimum of a tenner's worth of tickets, and they expire after a certain number of months if not used.</p> <p>However, these days 7 mTickets don't last long so there's no danger of me leaving free money for LB! 3 return journeys and a one-way and that's your £10.50 gone... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164035 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 12:56:15 +0000 Nelly 164035@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Standards compliance are an oddity.</p> <p>I have a Nexus 5 phone, which has NFC capability (i.e. you can tap and pay) but you cant use Google Wallet or any equivalent to pay for things in the UK on that phone - partly due to EE my phone service provider.</p> <p>So, you can have the most technologically advanced device going, but if one service provider or other doesnt want to play ball it all falls over. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164030 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 12:34:10 +0000 mgj 164030@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>From memory, Oyster is a complete technical dead end and not even slightly standards compliant but it just works because of the scale and vision involved. The Scottish entitlement card which was standards based (and was based on YoungScot and pensioner travel) just never got off the ground; I did a review of the project in the mid 2000's and it was a mess then, with suppliers blaming each other. The free travel for pensioners application worked eventually though. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=13376#post-164013 Tue, 02 Sep 2014 09:57:51 +0000 condor2378 164013@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>TfL can never get rid of Oyster as there are currently millions of pounds sitting on unused Oyster cards which may never have seen the light of day for over 10 years, which limits the introduction of new schemes as they cannot close it.</p> <p>With the citysmart expiring after 180 days this gives greater opportunity for LB to introduce newer and better schemes at a later date. It is essentially though an electronic book of City Singles, meaning you don't have to search for change, can be topped up in the bus hopper on a Monday and you don't have to worry for the rest of the week. It's a convenience. </p> <p>tl;dr If you're not going to use the bus more that 20 times (equivalent to 2 weeks for a standard commuter on the bus) in 6 months, don't get one. </p>