http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: "Police call off 20mph speed checks after one week" en Sun, 31 May 2026 15:33:21 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-274871 Sat, 10 Feb 2018 12:13:00 +0000 crowriver 274871@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The comments on that article are entertaining. If you like cyclists and motorists having a rhetorical go at each other. Bit more civilised than the EEN comments section at least. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-274867 Sat, 10 Feb 2018 11:14:46 +0000 gembo 274867@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>That is a curious article. Starts off saying it is fifty fifty bad driving bad cycling, then there is one line only about the unequal relationship then the second half is firmly about catching drivers breaking the law. I did not read the comments so maybe the journo who is a cycle commuter of twenty years standing was just getting his retaliation in first? He does refer to the backlash he received from cyclists when he tried to blame us before? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-274764 Fri, 09 Feb 2018 09:37:36 +0000 chdot 274764@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"</p> <p>But it shouldn’t end there - motorists also routinely encroach on other cycle safety space such as bike lanes and advanced stop lines at traffic lights - which it is also an offence to block. </p> <p>No driver was prosecuted during a pioneering campaign in Edinburgh four years ago. </p> <p>Time for someone to be made an example of?</p> <p>"</p> <p><a href="https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/alastair-dalton-how-undercover-police-are-saving-cyclists-lives-1-4686250" rel="nofollow">https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/alastair-dalton-how-undercover-police-are-saving-cyclists-lives-1-4686250</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228506 Sun, 28 Aug 2016 08:52:12 +0000 wee folding bike 228506@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>gibbo, <em>Why is why, at almost every busy junction with ASLs, cars stop in the ASL. They know there's zero chance of getting fined because police scotland treat that law as a joke.</em></p> <p>I think it's because it's quite difficult to enforce. The cops would have to see people cross the solid line at red. It's not illegal to be stopped in the ASZ. </p> <p>The legislation used to mean it was often illegal for cyclists to enter the ASZ on a red light too but I think this has been changed.</p> <p>Some of them are very badly implemented too. There is one on Crookston Rd in Glasgow which is at the far end of a long box junction. If you're not turning right you can't be stopped in the box but you can be stopped in the ASZ if you don't cross the line at red. This can mean that motorists have a tricky choice to make. Once they enter the box junction they have to keep going until they are across the junction beyond the ASZ.</p> <p>This link might show you the aerial photo from Google. If not then it's the north bound junction of Crookston Rd and Raeswood Rd. </p> <p><a href="https://goo.gl/maps/vqg9rs8PXMS2" rel="nofollow">https://goo.gl/maps/vqg9rs8PXMS2</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228281 Thu, 25 Aug 2016 12:51:11 +0000 chdot 228281@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"I think the Police, Government and Councils should be using more speed cameras, at least until vehicles are equipped to stop their drivers disobeying speed limits."</p> <p>+1 </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228279 Thu, 25 Aug 2016 12:48:53 +0000 slowcoach 228279@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Frenchy (or De'il's advocate) <em>Speed cameras are placed at accident hotspots, and their most important job is to get people to slow down through these areas.</em><br /> Speed cameras are intended to deter speeding by helping to detect and educate those who are not deterred. This helps reduce accidents caused, at least partly, by motorists speeding. But these accidents are not necessarily clustered at hotspots: they are caused where drivers/riders go too fast for a tight bend, or too fast to keep control on a straighter road, or too fast near a junction where others are trying to join/cross the road, or too fast to stop if there is someone or something else on the road, or try to overtake where/when it isn't safe, so that they can go too fast. Which is why route treatments (not just individual sites) and average speed cameras have been successful, even where the crash rate was low beforehand.</p> <p>And going too fast is also a problem even at places where there haven't been accidents, since going too fast causes more pollution and discourages safer modes of transport(both of which contribute to more deaths than crashes cause directly).</p> <p>I think the Police, Government and Councils should be using more speed cameras, at least until vehicles are equipped to stop their drivers disobeying speed limits. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228275 Thu, 25 Aug 2016 12:06:38 +0000 chdot 228275@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/crime-in-capital-falls-by-10-in-three-months-1-4212418" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/crime-in-capital-falls-by-10-in-three-months-1-4212418</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228258 Thu, 25 Aug 2016 10:31:42 +0000 chdot 228258@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"</p> <p>Now Chief Supt Macdonald has confirmed an internal reorganisation will mean an increase in “response” officers, who are deployed to deal with crimes as they occur, and a parallel reduction in community officers. </p> <p>But he said the change – due to take effect in October – would mean community officers were less likely to be diverted to other duties and would therefore have more time to devote to their community responsibilities.</p> <p>"</p> <p><a href="http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/number-of-community-officers-in-edinburgh-to-be-cut-1-4212122" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/number-of-community-officers-in-edinburgh-to-be-cut-1-4212122</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228249 Thu, 25 Aug 2016 09:49:36 +0000 Frenchy 228249@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Telling them exactly where those cameras are gives the speeders freedom to speed everywhere else without the risk of getting caught.</em></p> <p>[De'il's advocate, to some extent]</p> <p>Speed cameras are placed at accident hotspots, and their most important job is to get people to slow down through these areas. Putting big signs up nearby helps with this. Not having signs might increase the number of speeding drivers who get caught, but it will also increase the number of people who speed at the most dangerous places to do so. It's plausible to me that this, on the whole, does more harm than good. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228245 Thu, 25 Aug 2016 09:30:51 +0000 Stickman 228245@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/21-drivers-warned-over-new-edinburgh-20mph-speed-limit-1-4211229" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/21-drivers-warned-over-new-edinburgh-20mph-speed-limit-1-4211229</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228137 Wed, 24 Aug 2016 08:41:15 +0000 gibbo 228137@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@slowcoach</p> <p>You've made the point I was going to make: telling people there are cameras is a deterrent. Telling them exactly where those cameras are gives the speeders freedom to speed everywhere else without the risk of getting caught.</p> <p>It also sends out the message that the government doesn't believe speeding to be a "real crime" - and that's why the gov is telling people where they have to stop speeding.</p> <p>i.e. The government is siding with the speeders in order to help them get away with it. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228130 Tue, 23 Aug 2016 22:48:21 +0000 slowcoach 228130@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>from <a href="http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20100304070241/http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tpm/tal/circulars/ular192useoftechnologyfo4041.pdf">DfT Roads Circular 1/92</a> "Every effort should be made to publicise the introduction and use of cameras in an area. However, it is not advisable to identify specific sites at which the cameras will be in operation as this would tend to reduce the overall deterrent effect."<br /> As part of the Government trying to win over some law-breaking motorists this policy was changed. Apparently the Minister in charge threw a wobbly when the officials were too slow to (or couldn't) prove that general deterrence was better than site specific only deterrence. Despite a lack of evidence he insisted that cameras should be specifically signed and made more conspicuous.<br /> That was a long time ago at Westminster, and shouldn't have stopped Scottish Government ministers making progress for several years. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228125 Tue, 23 Aug 2016 18:19:58 +0000 Frenchy 228125@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"e.g. I've never understood why there are motorway signs saying speed cameras are coming up."</p> <p>It makes (more?) sense if you consider the point of speed cameras to be making people slow down. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228121 Tue, 23 Aug 2016 16:48:18 +0000 gibbo 228121@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Funny that we don't get newspapers reporting the police are a bit strapped for resource so they're not going to patrol areas at high risk of crime any more (and then specifying which areas!).</em></p> <p>The police do seem to make a point of telling motorists which laws they can break - and where.</p> <p>e.g. I've never understood why there are motorway signs saying speed cameras are coming up. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228085 Tue, 23 Aug 2016 12:23:03 +0000 chdot 228085@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"</p> <p>City council community safety leader Cammy Day said he had not been aware of such a dramatic reduction in police numbers. “It’s quite concerning when communities are asking to see more police on the streets to hear they have reduced it,” he said. </p> <p>He said the council put £2.6 million a year towards funding community officers across the city. “People want to see local bobbies on the beat and that has to be a core priority of Police Scotland’s work.”</p> <p>"</p> <p><a href="http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/scottish-police-federation-warns-the-force-is-at-breaking-point-in-capital-1-4209983" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/scottish-police-federation-warns-the-force-is-at-breaking-point-in-capital-1-4209983</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228069 Tue, 23 Aug 2016 09:46:00 +0000 crowriver 228069@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@edd1e_h, exactly. Behind the mock outrage is an advertisement: "Motorists! There's no way you can be caught. So speed away! That'll show the Clowncil/Lesley Hinds/Andrew Burns/pesky cyclists/dozy pedestrians!" </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228068 Tue, 23 Aug 2016 09:30:19 +0000 neddie 228068@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Funny that we don't get newspapers reporting the police are a bit strapped for resource so they're not going to patrol areas at high risk of crime any more (and then specifying which areas!).</p> <p>In the motoring world however, like the old days when the AA formed to warn motorists of speed traps, the whole thing is treated like a game...</p> <p>...a game involving people's lives. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228066 Tue, 23 Aug 2016 09:18:26 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 228066@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Chief Inspector Mark Rennie said, "<em>I’m hopeful the public are now fully aware of the new 20mph zones and altering their driving behaviour accordingly.</em>"</p> <p>Cyclists and pedestrians said, "<em>Hahahahahahahahaahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahha *wheeze* hahahahahaaaaaahahahahahaha!</em>" </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228063 Tue, 23 Aug 2016 07:49:19 +0000 threefromleith 228063@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Rather like the enforecement we were promised to stop drivers double-parking in the 'exemplary' new cycle lanes when the revamped Leith Walk opened. Lasted about a week - then once drivers realised that the wardens had vanished, they settled back into a habit they've been allowed to get away with for years.</p> <p>Pity you can't get the police to turn up when you complain about that, but you can get them out if you live on Riversdale Crescent &amp; cyclists ignore a non-enforceable temporary sign... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-228038 Mon, 22 Aug 2016 18:01:56 +0000 gibbo 228038@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>"Conservative City Centre councillor Joanna Mowat said that if the new limit was going to succeed in cutting speed, it had to be enforced. </p> <p>She said: “If you put measures in place you have to enforce them or all you are doing is embarking on an expensive PR exercise. </p> <p>“People have to think ‘I’m going to be caught by the police’."</em></p> <p>Why is why, at almost every busy junction with ASLs, cars stop in the ASL. They know there's zero chance of getting fined because police scotland treat that law as a joke. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16765#post-227987 Mon, 22 Aug 2016 10:02:02 +0000 chdot 227987@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"</p> <p>A total of 24 warning notices were issued at the Pleasance and 12 in Lauriston Place up until August 6. </p> <p>The two £100 fines were both handed out on August 5 during road checks in the Pleasance. And police said they could not comment on when they planned to carry out checks again. </p> <p>This is despite the schools going back last week. </p> <p>Conservative City Centre councillor Joanna Mowat said that if the new limit was going to succeed in cutting speed, it had to be enforced.</p> <p>"</p> <p><a href="http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/our-region/edinburgh/police-call-off-20mph-speed-checks-after-one-week-1-4209128" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/our-region/edinburgh/police-call-off-20mph-speed-checks-after-one-week-1-4209128</a> </p>