http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Hundreds of new drivers banned for mobile phone use en Tue, 19 May 2026 13:54:31 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-311846 Thu, 01 Aug 2019 14:32:59 +0000 Rosie 311846@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@acsimpson - Maybe. I assumed laws about speeding, dangerous driving etc would be UK wide. Have I got that wrong? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-311844 Thu, 01 Aug 2019 14:15:38 +0000 acsimpson 311844@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Is that ruling only applicable in E&amp;W? It appears from the article Ed1 linked last year that an item being identified as a mobile phone by police officers is sufficient without having to prove it's being used as a phone. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-311842 Thu, 01 Aug 2019 14:02:30 +0000 Frenchy 311842@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I thought this was already established. Jimmy Carr got off with it in 2009 by claiming that he was using the voice recorder on his phone to record a joke he thought of whilst driving. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-311840 Thu, 01 Aug 2019 13:48:05 +0000 Rosie 311840@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Anomalies in mobile phone usage laws:-</p> <p>Not okay to use it as a mobile phone, okay to use it as a camera or SatNav.</p> <p>"Any use of a hand-held electronic device while driving is potentially dangerous and should be clearly banned. The current law allows some, but not all such usage, and does so on no rational basis whatever. It manages to be arbitrary, inconsistent, incomprehensible, unpredictable, and unworkable."</p> <p><a href="https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/the-law-on-using-a-phone-while-driving-is-a-complete-mess/" rel="nofollow">https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/the-law-on-using-a-phone-while-driving-is-a-complete-mess/</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-274879 Sat, 10 Feb 2018 17:20:09 +0000 gembo 274879@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Nice ruling.as both officers recognised the item from one metre away as a mobile phone it was therefore a mobile phone and was not required t be produced as evidence. Van driver retrospectively claiming it was a black notebook, though not at the time of his crime. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-274878 Sat, 10 Feb 2018 16:34:53 +0000 Ed1 274878@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="http://barristerblogger.com/2018/01/03/law-using-mobile-phone-driving-date-incomprehensible-mess/" rel="nofollow">http://barristerblogger.com/2018/01/03/law-using-mobile-phone-driving-date-incomprehensible-mess/</a></p> <p>"until someone is killed in an accident – the higher courts have not been asked to give any authoritative ruling, even though the Regulation has been in place since 2003. (The Regulation is applicable in Scotland and there has recently been a somewhat inconclusive case1 in the Sherriff Appeals Court, which is binding on Sherriff Courts in Scotland, although only of persuasive value in England)."</p> <p><a href="https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/docs/default-source/cos-general-docs/pdf-docs-for-opinions/2017saccrim16.pdf?sfvrsn=0" rel="nofollow">https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/docs/default-source/cos-general-docs/pdf-docs-for-opinions/2017saccrim16.pdf?sfvrsn=0</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-270858 Thu, 28 Dec 2017 13:17:20 +0000 Rosie 270858@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>American perspective on the numbers of deaths caused by smartphoning while driving; also the electronic devices' manufacturers lobbying against it.</p> <p><a href="http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/future_tense/2017/12/yes_smartphone_use_is_probably_behind_the_spike_in_vehicle_related_deaths.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/future_tense/2017/12/yes_smartphone_use_is_probably_behind_the_spike_in_vehicle_related_deaths.html</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268483 Sat, 02 Dec 2017 00:28:16 +0000 acsimpson 268483@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>No I was meaning the length of time people have held there licences. 2% of penalties given to drivers within the first 2 years of having a licence must be less than the average for all other 2 year brackets.</p> <p>What we don't know here is how large each bracket is. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268470 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 21:07:39 +0000 chdot 268470@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“assuming an even spread of licence ages”</p> <p>You mean assuming that most new drivers <em>aren’t</em> teenagers? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268469 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 20:31:10 +0000 Murun Buchstansangur 268469@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Either it is 2900 new drivers and therefore 18% or @acsimpson is right. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268466 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 19:27:17 +0000 acsimpson 268466@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I'm not sure who did the maths but I make it about 2% not 18% that are new drivers. It seems they are the ones who are behaving assuming and even spread of licence ages. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268434 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:38:11 +0000 dougal 268434@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"These people are utterly unfit to drive, but despite this, have recently been given licenses. There's clearly not enough vetting of learners."</p> <p>To reuse somebody else's coining, any test procedure will encourage "Volkswagening", where the agent will perform as expected <em>only under test conditions</em>. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268432 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:35:15 +0000 Rosie 268432@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Agony &amp; Etiquette Aunt - am I required to comfort a teenager who killed my cat while driving and texting?</p> <p><a href="http://www.slate.com/articles/life/dear_prudence/2017/11/dear_prudence_i_can_t_comfort_the_teen_who_killed_my_cat.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.slate.com/articles/life/dear_prudence/2017/11/dear_prudence_i_can_t_comfort_the_teen_who_killed_my_cat.html</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268429 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:24:09 +0000 I were right about that saddle 268429@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>tattoos and other mutilations</em></p> <p>This is going to get ugly. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268427 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:20:18 +0000 Rosie 268427@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@crowriver - whatever happened to spending a month in the wilderness spearing your own food as an initiation into adulthood? (manhood really). Followed by tattoos and other mutilations. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268424 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:16:30 +0000 crowriver 268424@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Rosie, it's the post-1960s equivalent of receiving a symbolic golden key when you reach 21 years of age. Rite of passage to adulthood, etc.</p> <p>Which is why it is a fiendishly difficult genie to put back in the bottle. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268423 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:14:02 +0000 Frenchy 268423@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>3 hours? </em></p> <p>Quite confident that if you stood at a junction like Gilmerton or Kaimes crossroads you'd see a hundred in half an hour. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268422 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:09:15 +0000 Rosie 268422@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@gibbo</p> <p>"foolish" = RAC speak for "grossly irresponsible".</p> <p>And "personal freedom" - Grrr - as if driving a metal box about equated with human and civil rights. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268420 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 13:52:42 +0000 gibbo 268420@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@crowdriver</p> <p><em>The RAC's Mr Williams said: "These people have spent hours and hours and hundreds of pounds learning to drive to gain their personal freedom only to throw it all away through this foolish behaviour."</em></p> <p>How about</p> <p>"These people are utterly unfit to drive, but despite this, have recently been given licenses. There's clearly not enough vetting of learners." </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268418 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 13:50:36 +0000 gibbo 268418@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@frenchy</p> <p><em>Although if he didn't already know that so many people use their phones whilst driving, I have even bigger questions about his role as RAC's safety spokesman. </em></p> <p>That was my thought, too. If he didn't already know how widespread this problem is, does he even use the roads?</p> <p>This is less than 100/day. How many hours would you have to cycle around Edinburgh until you saw 100 people breaking this law?</p> <p>3 hours? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268413 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 13:19:20 +0000 crowriver 268413@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The RAC's Mr Williams said: "These people have spent hours and hours and hundreds of pounds learning to drive to gain their personal freedom only to throw it all away through this foolish behaviour."</p> <p>That's a very revealing statement about ingrained attitudes to driving in this country.</p> <p>"Safety officer" indeed.</p> <p>Good riposte in the comments section:</p> <p>---</p> <p>So 18% of those caught are new drivers, yet you focus on these and not the 82% of experience drivers who bloody well should know better. </p> <p>What a ludicrous standpoint to take.</p> <p>-- </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268404 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 11:26:19 +0000 Frenchy 268404@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Speak for yourself. I think this is great.</em></p> <p>I <em>presume</em> he means it is sad to see so many people using their phones whilst driving. Although if he didn't already know that so many people use their phones whilst driving, I have even bigger questions about his role as RAC's safety spokesman. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268402 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 11:07:21 +0000 gibbo 268402@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>RAC road safety spokesman Pete Williams said the figures were "sad" to see.</em></p> <p>Speak for yourself. I think this is great. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268398 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 10:47:49 +0000 dougal 268398@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The "only" consolation is they won't kill someone! Well I guess you take what you can get eh? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268378 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 08:46:51 +0000 Rosie 268378@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>So car addiction will be overcome by mobile phone addition.</p> <p>Like methadone instead of heroin.... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18426#post-268374 Fri, 01 Dec 2017 07:32:49 +0000 paddyirish 268374@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42189068">Good news!</a></p> <p><em>"The only consolation is that they now won't be involved in some horrific crash caused by the distraction of a handheld mobile phone," he added</em></p> <p>I would say it is a &lt;Rule 2&gt; massive consolation and proof that (on however small a percentage of cases) that the law is working. </p>