http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: What's happening to my heart rate? en Wed, 13 May 2026 03:00:14 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-337592 Wed, 16 Sep 2020 18:04:42 +0000 wingpig 337592@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Given the recent failure of my normal type of watch to respond to having its battery replaced, I bought a USB-rechargeable watch with an electric display which can also estimate heart rate via blood flow through the wrist in case it turns out to be useful to regain some of the fitness lost through not commuting (though I already know I have to just go for more runs, walks and cycles and bigger skips). It emitted a piercing alarm the other day for a reason I couldn't determine, which was different to the "estimated heart rate above this level" alarm which is just a double-buzz, which it was quite happily doing when I went for a run yesterday. It was annoying more for happening during the period when it's been told to keep quiet and stay dark in caase I'm trying to sleep, so might conceivably have been some sort of "can't detect any blood flow so you might be almost dead" alarm, though it should have been able to work out that I was still moving. Perhaps it was a "you're dead and someone is stealing your corpse" alarm. At least, by not being made by Garmin, it doesn't do that irritating blipping noise every time I stop or start moving. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-337591 Wed, 16 Sep 2020 17:39:11 +0000 I were right about that saddle 337591@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Garmin told him that something was wrong with his heart?</em></p> <p>OK not Garmin, but Raymond Dufayel;</p> <p>Si vous laissez passer cette chance alors, avec le temps, c'est votre cœur qui va devenir aussi sec et cassant que mon squelette. Alors allez-y, nom d'un chien. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-337584 Wed, 16 Sep 2020 14:57:02 +0000 Murun Buchstansangur 337584@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Dunno, only thing I can think of that a standard HRM would tell you is if your HR stayed abnormally high even after you had reduced workload. Though could just be fatigue </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-337573 Wed, 16 Sep 2020 13:02:51 +0000 gembo 337573@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Googling suggest aortic valve stenosis can manifest as a fluttering heart beat or a murmuring heart beat (an extra beat in between the beats)</p> <p>Other symptoms - chest pain, tiredness</p> <p>Seems mostly in over 60s, possibly related to a calcium build up </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-337572 Wed, 16 Sep 2020 12:55:16 +0000 bill 337572@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Murun it sounds like the Garmin told him that something was wrong with his heart? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-337568 Wed, 16 Sep 2020 09:04:10 +0000 Murun Buchstansangur 337568@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/people/bike-heart-monitor-saves-life-very-lucky-edinburgh-gp-2972427" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/people/bike-heart-monitor-saves-life-very-lucky-edinburgh-gp-2972427</a></p> <p>Shame the article does not deign to tell us what to look for </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-309260 Mon, 24 Jun 2019 01:44:51 +0000 davey2wheels 309260@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Greenroofer, you're still going to have to wait for a physiologist.<br /> <a href="https://www.polar.com/blog/cardiac-drift-effect-on-training/">Possible explanation here</a><br /> Cardiac drift occurs for long term, moderate to heavy submaximal exercise, so you don't have to be working really hard. Stroke volume is reduced so a higher heart rate is required to maintain the same cardiac output.</p> <p>Increase in air temperature means increase in blood flow to the skin to control body core temperature in addition to that to required by the muscles. Sweating takes water from the blood plasma and increases the blood viscosity affecting the stroke volume. Both result in an increased heart rate.</p> <p>The human body is a wonderful thing. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-309253 Sun, 23 Jun 2019 21:59:15 +0000 Greenroofer 309253@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I thought I'd drag this thread, kicking and screaming, back into the light of day. I'm still very confused and waiting for an exercise physiologist to explain what's happening.</p> <p>On yesterday's long ride, my average heart rate rose in the first few hours, was steady for the next 12 hours or so, and then began to decline. This decline wasn't unexpected, as I didn't eat all that much in small hours of the morning, and was kind of expecting that to happen. Pleasingly, after all the training I've been doing, it happened later into the ride than it used to.</p> <p>However the trend of my heart rate curve exactly matches the trend of the temperature cure. Average heart rate rose as the day warmed up, then fell in the cool of the night. It's clear that my heart will be working harder when the weather is hot, but it wasn't <em>that</em> hot yesterday.</p> <p>Would you expect ambient temperature to have a noticeable effect on heart rate during steady exercise? I know about 'cardiac drift' if you're working really hard, but I wasn't... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-283827 Fri, 01 Jun 2018 13:38:38 +0000 fimm 283827@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Darkerside you may have as much beer as you feel appropriate when you have finished... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857&page=2#post-283816 Fri, 01 Jun 2018 12:43:10 +0000 Darkerside 283816@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Excellent thread. And I am much heartened (as someone who's effectively switched from cycling to running this year) that nutrition methods for ultras can include sausages and cheese.</p> <p>(Is a light pilsner on the cards as well...?)</p> <p>Had a play around with Veloviewer charts of one of my longer (but still very humble in terms of distance) runs. Maybe a slight downwards dip of HR over time, but a definite correlation between HR and grade that probably overwhelms it. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283741 Thu, 31 May 2018 21:37:08 +0000 Cyclingmollie 283741@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I consulted a huge book about sports science today in the secondhand bookshop in Goldenacre. Their section on heart rate described something called cardiovascular drift. But their charts only covered two hours of exercise. During that time the observed heart rate increased. Googling that I got:<br /> <em>Cardiovascular drift is mostly caused by increased body core temperature. This increases heart rate, but decreases stroke volume so that cardiac output (and oxygen uptake) remain the same. The effect can be enhanced by the decrease in plasma volume that is caused by water loss during exercise.</em><br /> That's what I used to find during one hour turbo sessions: my heart rate got higher over the hour. So we're really no further forward. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283616 Wed, 30 May 2018 13:08:34 +0000 neddie 283616@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Maybe gels after that, but I'm cautious with them as they are basically a sugar spike, and what goes up ....</em></p> <p>^^^ This</p> <p>My "made up" rule is that after a pint, a Mars bar or anything sugary you've got around 20mins before you get an insulin spike and then crash again.</p> <p>Save the gels for the emergency 20 mins required to get home / get to the nearest station. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283614 Wed, 30 May 2018 12:43:50 +0000 Arellcat 283614@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I remember The Bonk while riding from Lochgilphead to Dalmally, via the B840 that skirts Loch Awe before zigzagging up to the A819. I'd had a full Scottish Breakfast that morning, actually against my better judgement, and as I reached the A-road and stopped for a breather, I very nearly fell over.</p> <p>It took me a good hour to recover, with the help of a couple of biscuits and some water.</p> <p>While touring in the US the following year, I had one wobbly moment, during which my riding buddy ordered me to "eat this banana, and drink a ton of water". I eventually found I worked best by alternating water and Mountain Dew (which I found surprisingly palatable), and Oreos/crisps and bananas. I never really found Jelly Babies that good for touring because I'd have to stop to eat them, and then bits of them would get stuck in my teeth.</p> <p>When doing my Battle Mountain training last year, I would have some porridge for breakfast, but needed to hit the road before I started digesting, otherwise my blood flow would go to my stomach and not my leg muscles. At peak fitness I used about two-thirds of a bottle of water and one energy gel for a roughly 30 mile ride, which was really extended intervals rather than a constant pace. My resting HR went down to 42bpm. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283612 Wed, 30 May 2018 11:24:16 +0000 crowriver 283612@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"a Ginsters pasty at mile 25"<br /> Snap! Exactly what I fancied after riding out to Burntisland last week. Available from the local Co-op. </p> <p>"Just get some actual jelly (the cubes, rather than the powder). "<br /> I used to like eating jelly "raw" as a bairn but not since the age of 12 or so. </p> <p>"Oatcakes"<br /> Now you're talking. Used to always pack some in the saddlebag on audaxes as emergency rations, next to the wine gums...</p> <p>"Provided you're fit enough then any form of persistent exercise should bring the heart rate down. "<br /> Sounds about right. The body finds its "level" after getting accustomed to the effort over time.</p> <p>@unhurt, that sounds like an adventure! Should have had your Ready Brek in the morning... :-) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283611 Wed, 30 May 2018 11:18:58 +0000 remberbuck 283611@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>You've really got two different things going on here. The first is hitting the wall, which is simply the body running out of stored glycogen and transferring to burning fat. The distance involved isn't that important - you can get it on an innocuous evening 6 mile run just as on a full endurance effort. It shouldn't impact directly on your heart rate, though the attendant anxiety plus the other things you've been doing to your body won't be helping!</p> <p>It seems more dramatic in running as there are other muscular fatigue issues going on. When Lance Armstrong missed his food stop in the 2000 TdF he didn't end up with Calum Hawkins' problems, though the cause was largely the same.</p> <p>Building your glycogen reserves beforehand is never wrong - there is method in the marathon runner's traditional pre race evening pasta, and the couple of days before as well. I'd have a big bowl of porridge a couple of hours before setting out, and a couple of porridges bar an hour or so in to give the stomach something to work on. Maybe gels after that, but I'm cautious with them as they are basically a sugar spike, and what goes up ....</p> <p>(I've only seen the no carb running suggested for first thing in the morning and 10k max, but the theory seems sound).</p> <p>Provided you're fit enough then any form of persistent exercise should bring the heart rate down. Simply, it has adjusted to the effort, and worked hard enough to bring the body down to a manageable temperature. Most runners will get there somewhere in the first hour. It will be more complex with cyclists as the effort is more variable depending on where the hills are.</p> <p>I wouldn't be too worried about the heart rate drop. Your cardio vascular system will be excellent, and a measure of that is how quickly it returns to normal. Getting straight back to your resting rate sounds quite dramatic, but provided there are no other unexpected discomforts, I'd just take it as a compliment to your fitness. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283602 Wed, 30 May 2018 08:58:28 +0000 fimm 283602@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@greenroofer that's what I was trying to say.<br /> @wingpig, according to Mr fimm even a gentleman with about 4% body fat (which is the minimum for a healthy man) has about 10,000 calories stored away there.</p> <p>I've taken to having a jelly baby every 20 minutes if I'm running a long way. I believe that one can train ones stomach to an extent - if you do in training what you are going to do in racing then your body gets more used to it.</p> <p>There's a different way to train, which is not to use carbs at all. That, as I understand it, trains your body to go for the fat reserves much more quickly and you can then run on fat.</p> <p>All this is stuff I think I remember rather than stuff I've checked. I'll try and ask Mr fimm, he knows more about this sort of thing than I do. When he runs ultramarathons, he nibbles on a mixture of stuff including jelly babies and bits of flapjack but also cheese and sausage. It is very definitely "what works for one may well not work for another" though. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283593 Wed, 30 May 2018 07:09:08 +0000 gembo 283593@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@greenroofer good theory</p> <p>I do not eat gels every twenty minutes. I eat something every half hour or so. Alternating sweets, date bars and gels.</p> <p>The magic gels that hankchief gives me should take about twenty minutes to even start working but I find I get a psychological boost - because they are what is called Isotonic. The Scientists at Hankchief Gels Inc. claim only their gels are isotonic and merely need a few sips of water to help whereas other inferior non scientific gels require 500mls of water to work.</p> <p>Before cares came on the radar I used to eat a wholemeal Jeely piece and drink Ribena out in the wilds of west Lothian. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283592 Tue, 29 May 2018 23:34:03 +0000 unhurt 283592@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@crowriver @gembo re: Le Bonk - ooh, yes, first met before I even knew what it was called, in 2007, on day three of an ill-prepared for ride from Seattle to SF (on an dirt cheap Ed Bikes hybrid with way too much stuff and exactly one three day long practice tour behind me, ahem). One Kellogs Rice Crispie Square bar for breakfast after not enough sleep and two days of - in retrospect - eating nowhere NEAR enough food - and I started falling asleep on the bike mid morning. Like, head dropping, almost impossible to not just keel over and pass out on the verge. Quite scary, as I had no idea what was going on! Ended up lying on picnic table bench outside a small store forcing myself to eat a whole bag of jelly beans, conking out there for 45 minutes, then dragging myself over the road to the diner for emergency coffee and discovering that I was <em>starving</em>. One massive platter of fried red potatoes with bacon, sausage, mushroom &amp; egg scramble and a pancake on the side and another hour snoozing on the bench outside before my legs finally came back online enough to proceed. Slowly, and with emergency Reese's Peanut Butter Cups on hand.</p> <p>Still dream about those amazing fried potatoes sometimes. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283589 Tue, 29 May 2018 23:11:40 +0000 wingpig 283589@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>What do professional bicycle racing people eat, apart from erythropoietin and salbutamol? Their lack of visible fat suggests they're doing enough work to use up any spare energy, whilst maintaining enough inter-organ fat to keep them idling if they get their food dosage wrong. Unless one of the jobs of their support team is to flush them out thoroughly prior to the racing session and keep them stoppered whilst on the bike, they can't be eating that much bulky stuff during a race. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283588 Tue, 29 May 2018 22:20:32 +0000 Greenroofer 283588@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>So I have concocted a theory, which goes like this.</p> <p>1) We have limited stores of glycogen in our muscles and liver. When that's gone, it's gone (particularly if gembo's been at the chianti again).</p> <p>2) We can replace some of this by eating carbs, but at any appreciable work rate we can't take in carbs as fast as we're using them.The digestive system is a conveyor belt that slows down as we start working hard, and if we overload the conveyor belt we start feeling sick. So we will, at some point, run out of carbs.</p> <p>3) So, after a point, we reach steady state where the available carbs in the system are the ones we're putting in, and we can't put them in very fast. At that point we can't produce high levels of work because the carbs aren't available. We're in the 'fat burning zone' which seems to be about 60%-70% of max heart rate. In normal people, this zone is achieved by not working too hard. In the case of a long bike ride, we're in this zone because we can't actually work any harder: we've used all the other fuel.</p> <p>So this suggests two strategies to maximise performance:<br /> 1) Get really fit, so we can ride fast at very low intensity and eke out our supplies of carbs and hope they don't run out before the end of the ride. This would gives reserves of power for hill climbs and sprints.<br /> 2) Don't worry too much about eating lots. Let the carbs run out and accept that it will lead to unlimited plodding with no spare power. Eat gently to maintain the carbs at minimum low level. Actually a perfectly acceptable way to cover long distances, but not suitable for racing.</p> <p>I made all this up. It may be wrong. What do you think? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283587 Tue, 29 May 2018 22:07:02 +0000 Greenroofer 283587@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@winpig - agreed. Can't understand how anyone (other than gel manufacturers) can imagine that if you're working hard enough to need a gel every 20mins you've going to have any spare blood available to digest the things. In the depths of a long ride (when I've run out of other things to think about) I do ponder whether some of the stuff like water and simple sugars can get absorbed through the stomach wall. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283584 Tue, 29 May 2018 21:55:30 +0000 wingpig 283584@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><blockquote><em>"...obviously interested in best food to eat to avoid The Bonk"</p> <p>"Midget Gems. Jelly Babies. Wine Gums."</em></blockquote></p> <p>Just get some actual jelly (the cubes, rather than the powder). Dissolves easily in the maw and comes in a range of nice flavours.</p> <p><blockquote><em>"I found it was making me feel sick."</em></blockquote></p> <p>Not surprised, if you're eating gels in those quantities. Unless you stop to let your intestines steal some blood from your legs you're not going to be digesting very much very quickly.</p> <p>Oatcakes sit very lightly in the stomach. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283583 Tue, 29 May 2018 21:29:22 +0000 gembo 283583@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@greenroofer, yes bit sick and Also I get a stitch. Trying combo of aforementioned sweets, banana bars, or date bars, Aldi do them cheap, gels and cake. I find I need a combo so afte cake will fish out old gel wrapper from pocket and squeeze the residue </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283582 Tue, 29 May 2018 20:37:13 +0000 Greenroofer 283582@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@DrAfternoon. Exactly. While you are clearly much more of a machine than me and can last over 100 miles before it happens to you, there's a clear point where your heart rate drops off to a markedly lower steady state.</p> <p>@gembo. I've stopped eating so much on rides. I found it was making me feel sick. I've gone down from one gel every 20 minutes (suitable for racing, I fear) to a gingernut or two every 40 minutes and something more substantial every couple of hours. At the weekend it was a Ginsters pasty at mile 25, an ice cream and a bit of cake at mile 50 and a bread roll with peanut butter at mile 75. I did get through <em>litres</em> of electrolyte though. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283580 Tue, 29 May 2018 20:21:16 +0000 gembo 283580@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@crowriver, yes also sports mixtures which my pal Tom claims never to have heard of, despite being a good age. He liked the ones I gave him around netherurd/elsrickle the other day. The black ones are his favourites. Not much carbs in them tho? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283578 Tue, 29 May 2018 19:59:12 +0000 crowriver 283578@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"obviously interested in best food to eat to avoid The Bonk"</p> <p>Midget Gems. Jelly Babies. Wine Gums.</p> <p>I find fruit bars quite good too. Or a banana (but the latter do get squashed/bruised in the saddlebag/pannier). </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283577 Tue, 29 May 2018 19:53:31 +0000 gembo 283577@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Strava was very insistent I allowed it to record my heart rate recently under GDPR. I declined. I only look at Strava to see what routes the strava gang have posted. Still checking strava gives you something to do at the end of a bike ride instead of talking to each other.</p> <p>Having said this, obviously interested in best food to eat to avoid The Bonk. Gels, even the pink grapefruit ones Hankchief gives me, cause heartburn if I have more than four.</p> <p>Once I get The Bonk there is no recovery. So need to keep eating every 30 mins or so </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283570 Tue, 29 May 2018 17:20:24 +0000 DrAfternoon 283570@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Very interested in this, and I work in related physiology so should know more, but I can at least offer some more data from a four day ride, shows a clear long term fall in heart rate. </p> <p><a href="https://www.strava.com/activities/657684593/analysis">Strava West Highlands 1200</a></p> <p>Almost certainly related to the shift from using glucose/glycogen to fat stores, but the confusion of that is that fat burning uses more oxygen for the same energy output. Need a sports physiologist. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283554 Tue, 29 May 2018 13:05:15 +0000 I were right about that saddle 283554@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Greenroofer</p> <p>I have hit a wall doing endurance running. It involved hallucinations, palpitations and an inability to walk and it did take a while to recover. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18857#post-283549 Tue, 29 May 2018 12:42:51 +0000 Greenroofer 283549@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>For me the drop in heart rate with fatigue is just too pronounced for it to be simply the result of going downhill. When I'm in my Type A state, it falls a bit on the downhills, but not normally to below about 90bpm. Coming down Comiston Road on Sunday with 100 miles in my legs it fell to 50bpm (normal resting rate) and my HRM kept saying I was dead.</p> <p>I agree with @crowriver that 'the bonk' causes a high heart rate for me, but I wonder if that's different from the marathon runners' 'wall', which has always sounded much more serious and irrecoverable... </p>