CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: “Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “

CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: “Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “ http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: “Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “ en Thu, 21 May 2026 11:52:10 +0000 Ed1 on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293775 Thu, 18 Oct 2018 22:36:50 +0000 Ed1 293775@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ would guess an adopted road whether private /council or unknown ownership would be beyond the boundary <a href="https://www.scottishwater.co.uk/assets/business/files/our%20services/wholesale/sw_guide_surface_water_drainage.pdf" rel="nofollow">https://www.scottishwater.co.uk/assets/business/files/our%20services/wholesale/sw_guide_surface_water_drainage.pdf</a> <a href="https://www.scottishwater.co.uk/assets/domestic/files/you%20and%20your%20home/your%20home/flooding%20docs/swdrainssewersguideapr15.pdf" rel="nofollow">https://www.scottishwater.co.uk/assets/domestic/files/you%20and%20your%20home/your%20home/flooding%20docs/swdrainssewersguideapr15.pdf</a> minus six on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293774 Thu, 18 Oct 2018 22:25:04 +0000 minus six 293774@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ this is what its all about this is what its all about this is what its all about acsimpson on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293772 Thu, 18 Oct 2018 21:45:38 +0000 acsimpson 293772@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @ect, "Scottish Water are very clear that will not attend to (or they will re-charge for) any blocked sewer or drain on private land." I think that only applies to private sewers. If the sewer serves more than one property then they will attend. SW are currently hoping to build one in our garden (for Cala) so I looked into it last year. Ed1 on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293748 Thu, 18 Oct 2018 16:48:10 +0000 Ed1 293748@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ even with adopted roads ownership does not need to change due to adoption many adopted roads land below road privately owned as long as road remained would not matter an adopted road ownership may be unknown jonty on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293746 Thu, 18 Oct 2018 16:28:07 +0000 jonty 293746@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @ejstubbs: I guess I would expect the housebuilder or original landowner to own the roadway before adoption, or for the ownership to pass over to the council at adoption time but I guess parcelling it up to the residents has the same effect. Presumably this system only works for to-be-adopted roads, as presumably you'd want the the whole road to be explicitly shared between all residents if it was staying private. ejstubbs on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293742 Thu, 18 Oct 2018 16:06:07 +0000 ejstubbs 293742@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @morningsider: I think that's pretty much the same as what I wrote in my original post on this subject: the fact that there's a public highway running over that part of their property overrides most of the landowner's rights in terms of occupation of that bit of land. But you expressed it more clearly and eloquently. "Solum" - a pleasant word that I should have remembered. I'm more familiar with it in the context of railways, especially disused ones, but of course it can apply in that sense to roads as well. ejstubbs on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293741 Thu, 18 Oct 2018 15:58:28 +0000 ejstubbs 293741@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @jonty: I could imagine there's some weird thing in newbuild housing estates where they parcel the land up entirely house-by-house but then get the council to adopt the road. Not really "weird", it's pretty much standard practice. According to <a href="https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/609561/advice-note-on-road-adoptions.pdf">this Dft document</a>, adoption of roads in new developments is usually covered by a "Section 38 Agreement" under the 1980 Highways Act. This should ensure that the road is built to the required standard in order for it to be adopted into the highway network, which will only be finalised once all planning requirements are in place. Ed1 on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293719 Thu, 18 Oct 2018 13:16:55 +0000 Ed1 293719@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ If an adopted road is no longer used as a road “Upon extinguishment, ownership of the surface will revert back to the owner of the subsoil.” so although may make no difference when used as road may do in future. <a href="https://www.blakemorgan.co.uk/training-knowledge/features-and-articles/reminder-extent-highway/" rel="nofollow">https://www.blakemorgan.co.uk/training-knowledge/features-and-articles/reminder-extent-highway/</a> gembo on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293678 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 21:19:14 +0000 gembo 293678@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ There was an argument outside my house once about lead pipe between the plumbers who had gone down to the edge of my drive and Scottish wAter over what was beneath the pavement. Edinburgh Cycle Training on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293676 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 20:47:49 +0000 Edinburgh Cycle Training 293676@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Scottish Water are very clear that will not attend to (or they will re-charge for) any blocked sewer or drain on private land. If homeowners owned the land up to the middle of their road, then all land would be private, and Scottish Water would never accept any liability for fixing water and drainage issues. ih on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293670 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 18:11:46 +0000 ih 293670@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ The word used when local authorities take over roads is "adopt", not purchase, which implies that they don't legally own the road (the land on which it is built) but they are responsible for its maintenance. In a Scottish context, all land is owned by someone, so I suspect the land over which roads were built would be owned by someone up the feu chain, and that could in some circumstances be the adjoining householders themselves. As @morningsider says though, all very theoretical. miak on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293669 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 18:09:03 +0000 miak 293669@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I just don't get this 'you cant park outside my house' thing. The road is for use by the public. The road outside my house has been used for years as a park and ride and good luck to those that do. I neither own the road and as long as the cars don't block access i really have no reason to complain. When i drive to other parts of the city or in other cities i park my car. I am sure it is outside someone' else's premises. My one complaint is overnight parking by commercial vehicles in residential areas, which i believe is not allowed under council by laws. One particular pizza chain with a fleet of yellow fiats which used the road opposite my window was kindly asked to desist and they complied. EdinburghCycleCam on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293666 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 17:13:49 +0000 EdinburghCycleCam 293666@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I'll worry about it if the council ever tries to bill me for anything to do with the road or land under it outside my house :D SRD on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293663 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 16:46:31 +0000 SRD 293663@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Googled and it turns out lots of people believe they own this bit of road. Never came across that before today. Morningsider on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293662 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 16:40:14 +0000 Morningsider 293662@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ It's possible for a homeowner to own part of the solum of a road - effectively the land on which the road is built. It doesn't really mean anything though. Anything that meets the definition of a road (a way, other than a waterway, over which there is a public right of passage) is governed by roads law. An owner of the solum can only use the road in the same way as anyone else. jonty on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293659 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 16:11:05 +0000 jonty 293659@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I could imagine there's some weird thing in newbuild housing estates where they parcel the land up entirely house-by-house but then get the council to adopt the road. Perhaps it saves them from liability if there's any issues with the adoption? ejstubbs on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293658 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 16:08:11 +0000 ejstubbs 293658@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @Harts Cyclery: I know that responsibility for maintenance of the road and pavement lies with the council if it's an adopted road, but do they actually own the land the road runs along? I think not. The Land Registry Scotland map of my property shows the boundary as running down the middle of the street. For the avoidance of doubt: acsimpson referred to people being charged for leaving their private property on public land. It may be a public road - which certainly does make a big difference in terms of what one is and isn't allowed to do on it - but I believe that the land beneath the road is usually still the property of the owner of the house. They just can't do an awful lot with it on account of there being a public thoroughfare running across it (similar to the limitations on what a landowner is allowed to do to a public footpath or bridleway in England and Wales). An authoritative reference for your assertion to the contrary would be informative. Harts Cyclery on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022&page=2#post-293652 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 15:42:58 +0000 Harts Cyclery 293652@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ No, you don't own anything to do with the road or pavement if you're a homeowner. It's the Cooncil's, ken? EdinburghCycleCam on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293651 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 14:41:54 +0000 EdinburghCycleCam 293651@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ "My understanding is that, generally speaking, the home owner does own the land as far as the middle of the road. (That's certainly what's indicated on the site plan of my house as provided by the seller's solicitor when we bought it.)" My houses title deeds only show that my property extends to the edge of my front garden (Well, I have a hard standing and there's no pavement outside my house, so it extends to the edge of that - but not the road). Though I don't know either way, I'm just going by what my deeds say. ejstubbs on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293649 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 13:53:36 +0000 ejstubbs 293649@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ @ARobComp: A house with a driveway can be a greater risk anyway (says the man who lives in a house with a driveway). If your car is on the drive but you clearly aren't in, that can tempt a would-be car thief to break in to the house to find the car keys (or to fish for them through the letter box - some people do indeed leave their keys on the hall table next to the front door). A car parked in the street amongst other cars gives little clue as to where the keys might be found. With modern car security systems, if you want to steal a particular car then getting hold of the keys somehow is much more likely to be successful than attacking the car directly. @acsimpson: I think the reason some people are objecting is because the council said the full CPZ would be a fund raising option in their budget. So the good people of Corstorphine should get a CPZ at no charge? Given that it's one of the more affluent areas of Edinburgh, they're 'avin a larf. I don't personally see any reason why they shouldn't make money from private property being left on public land. My understanding is that, generally speaking, the home owner does own the land as far as the middle of the road. (That's certainly what's indicated on the site plan of my house as provided by the seller's solicitor when we bought it.) However, the fact that there's a public highway running over that part of their property overrides most of the landowner's rights in terms of occupation of that bit of land. Happy to be proven wrong by someone who really does know what they're talking about! ARobComp on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293641 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 11:03:30 +0000 ARobComp 293641@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Doesn't work that well these days. I moved from Roseburn with onstreet parking away from my house, to a house with a driveway in the sticks, and saved exactly £0. The geo area the insurance company used was "Edinburgh" which I pointed out was rather large, however clearly car crime is not huge here. fimm on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293639 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 10:20:13 +0000 fimm 293639@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ [The car]"... lived in a much nicer postcode than we did and so insurance was cheaper..." LOL sallyhinch on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293638 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 10:17:37 +0000 sallyhinch 293638@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ the first house we bought was on the one-way system in Maidenhead and despite being opposite a multi-storey car park there was nowhere we could leave a car at all without moving it every day (there was no other residential street within the town centre so no provision for car storage). In the end, we rented a garage that was 15 minutes walk away which had multiple benefits - not only did we only use the car if we really needed it, but it meant it lived in a much nicer postcode than we did and so insurance was cheaper, so the garage practically paid for itself. ARobComp on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293633 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 09:19:18 +0000 ARobComp 293633@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I had a conversation about this recently. I was suggesting that a car parking pass should be roughly equivalent in cost (or at least somewhat compatable) across say 8 years, to the value that a driveway brings to a house. So say my house is valued at 6k more because it has a driveway (imagine it's more). I live there for 8 years so parking costs me £750 a year. Plus the tax and fees on buying the thing (4%). Surely then we can use this to deduce that someone who get's a parking permit on their street should be paying something comparable to this? Note that when I did live in town I did not have a car despite the flat having two whole parking spaces. In roseburn I campaigned to improve the parking situation because I would rather have paid for parking the tiny car we barely used rather than dealing with the ridiculous situation that was Roseburn Street. Stickman on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293631 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 08:48:00 +0000 Stickman 293631@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Corstorphine Community Council: “Really disappointed to see local MSP campaigning in local media against something before the full results of the @Edinburgh_CC consultation are published. Just for info the numbers in @edinburghpaper article don't seem to be the same as the ones published in public last month.” acsimpson on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293630 Wed, 17 Oct 2018 08:15:29 +0000 acsimpson 293630@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I think the reason some people are objecting is because the council said the full CPZ would be a fund raising option in their budget. I don't personally see any reason why they shouldn't make money from private property being left on public land. Harts Cyclery on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293626 Tue, 16 Oct 2018 21:09:31 +0000 Harts Cyclery 293626@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ As a business in Corstorphine... I support a CPZ in Corstorphine!! Stickman on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293623 Tue, 16 Oct 2018 19:11:27 +0000 Stickman 293623@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Most expensive permit seems to be for 3L+ gas guzzlers in Zone 1 at £499. <a href="http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/10730/residents_parking_permit_prices_3_april_2018.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/10730/residents_parking_permit_prices_3_april_2018.pdf</a> Stickman on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293622 Tue, 16 Oct 2018 19:08:33 +0000 Stickman 293622@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Despite their claims, it isn’t just commuters that are the problem: Corstorphine residents have to look at themselves. In the block of four flats next to us the retired couple in one flat don’t have a car and walk/bus everywhere. Between the other three flats there are (at least) five cars. That’s for one block. Our block is unusual in that there are only three cars between four flats. Corstorphine needs to be a full CPZ. Nelly on "“Corstorphine residents rage at motorists using streets as a ‘park and ride’ “" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19022#post-293621 Tue, 16 Oct 2018 18:55:15 +0000 Nelly 293621@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ "The residents want the cheapo permit scheme known as Priority Parking (annual permit cost <£40) rather than full-on CPZ (permit >£120) Wouldn’t be Embra vehicle owners if they weren’t demanding their cake, eating it and refusing to pay for any of it..." Not sure about those numbers - I am in the CPZ, I pay £102 for my (not small) car. The idea it is expensive to buy a permit is nonsense. As for car drivers not wanting to pay, everyone I know in a zone thinks its a great idea...........