http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: "Edinburgh's Hogmanay" - but not YOU, Edinburgh resident in the "Underbelly zone en Thu, 21 May 2026 10:29:09 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320870 Wed, 15 Jan 2020 15:51:10 +0000 crowriver 320870@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Vested interests attempting to control debate in the media makes for a ludicrous spectacle. All this "pipe down, stop rocking the golden boat full of cash-laden tourists" is desperate stuff.</p> <p>I hope the citizens of Edinburgh give it short shrift. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320868 Wed, 15 Jan 2020 15:22:59 +0000 chdot 320868@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/whats-on/arts-and-entertainment/edinburgh-airport-boss-hits-back-factions-making-fabricated-criticisms-christmas-and-hogmanay-celebrations-1362091" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/whats-on/arts-and-entertainment/edinburgh-airport-boss-hits-back-factions-making-fabricated-criticisms-christmas-and-hogmanay-celebrations-1362091</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320369 Tue, 07 Jan 2020 23:57:24 +0000 minus six 320369@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>There's No Edinburgh In The Festival</p> <p>Bonnie Prince Bob explains why the Edinburgh Festival has nothing to do with Edinburgh</p> <p><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ex5aY7AZ4Ug" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ex5aY7AZ4Ug</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320336 Tue, 07 Jan 2020 16:04:03 +0000 Rosie 320336@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>A friend does airbnb. She's been having problems getting bookings. I did a search for the Hogmanay period and saw loads available, including desirable places that weren't that expensive. I wonder if we're reaching saturation? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320333 Tue, 07 Jan 2020 15:27:48 +0000 unhurt 320333@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Re: air bnb just saw this while having a wee scroll through twitter: </p> <p><a href="https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/airbnb-and-short-term-lets-the-fightback-tickets-88234442593" rel="nofollow">https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/airbnb-and-short-term-lets-the-fightback-tickets-88234442593</a></p> <p>Next Wednesday eve. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320240 Mon, 06 Jan 2020 00:01:42 +0000 LaidBack 320240@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://bellacaledonia.org.uk/2020/01/05/globalisation-in-a-snow-globe/" rel="nofollow">https://bellacaledonia.org.uk/2020/01/05/globalisation-in-a-snow-globe/</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320237 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 23:02:38 +0000 PS 320237@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em> Tebay tho is not an actual place or a geopgraphical feature, it is merely a service station on the M6 that all guardian readers stop at.</em></p> <p>Tebay really grew up as a railway village, so The Guardian could include it safe in the knowledge that rail aficionados would know it too. </p> <p>Before the railway and motorway services (steak pie, mash, veg, peas and gravy highly recommended BTW) came, the village was best known for the 18th century prophetess Mary Baines, the “Witch of Tebay”, who forecast the coming of “fiery horseless carriages”. She got that right. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320235 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 22:26:17 +0000 gembo 320235@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Sydney Australia looked in 2018 to regulate airbnb hosts to having max of 180 nights with guests. Not sure how that is playing out. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320234 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 22:08:07 +0000 Morningsider 320234@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Pretty easy to regulate short-term holiday lets:</p> <p>1. Require planning permission for the change of use of a dwelling to a holiday let. The Greens tried to do this by amendments to the Planning (Scotland) Bill - but were defeated by SNP/Conservative votes. The SNP/Conservatives instead supported a fig-leaf amendment, so they could claim to have taken action - but even these proposals will not take effect for several years and do not apply nationally.<br /> 2. Amend the Civic Government (Scotland) Act to introduce a licensing system for short-term holiday lets. This could include a "fit and proper person" test for those letting homes and place certain requirements, e.g. fire and gas safety, on properties being let out. Idea currently kicked into the long grass at them moment...I mean out for a "review" involving stakeholders.<br /> 3. Robust enforcement of taxation due to be paid by owners of short-term lets.</p> <p>All possible at the Holyrood level. Not much a local authority can really do at the moment, as the legislation isn't really in place to allow them to act. Although there does seem to be a stepping up of planning enforcement action for some cases where it can be proved there is a breach of planning control - but it's a very slow process. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320228 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 19:16:01 +0000 chdot 320228@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“I think the fluff around UNDERBELLY is a distraction from what the council needs to do as a regulatory body around Air BnB.”</p> <p>Yes. </p> <p>I still don’t know what <em>any</em> LA can actually do. </p> <p>Don’t even know if it’s a Holyrood or Westminster thing to legislate for more useful/clear regulations. </p> <p>As usual, (some) other places do things better. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320223 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 17:35:36 +0000 gembo 320223@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The Oulipo Salon has not happened yet. Still to be arranged.</p> <p>What happened was 6 buses came past me in Balerno 5 going to Longstone instead of into town and one out of service. This made me very late for meeting a colleague in the Waverley. She was then co-opted by a group of academics who used to meet in The Royal Oak before their leader Paddy (who was revealed as polish not Irish) died. Too sad for them to return to the Royal Oak, they decamped to the Waverley.</p> <p>My colleague was very impressed by the way one person. Was allowed to speak on a topic and the others listened then moved on to the next person talking. However the B.O. was off putting. So I proposed a similar event but with one other Oulipo constraint that all those involved washed thoroughly before attending.</p> <p>In other Balerno news - Balerno was an answer in the GUARDIAN xmas xword. As was Tebay (it was a geographical xword). Tebay tho is not an actual place or a geopgraphical feature, it is merely a service station on the M6 that all guardian readers stop at. This made me chortle. Not since Auracaria died have i found good jokes in the monkey puzzle. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320220 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 17:22:08 +0000 crowriver 320220@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"you can be a flaneur like Debord as long as you don’t mind hills."</p> <p>Indeed, did just that earlier last year. Possible to find "hidden geographies" which tourists don't even begin to anticipate.</p> <p>"You can spend many happy days in the Pentlands just by catching a 44 bus"</p> <p>Also have done this many times.</p> <p>"You can come to the Waverley Bar in the new year and join in their Oulipo Salon"</p> <p>When is/was this? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320219 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 17:15:51 +0000 gembo 320219@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@crowriver, indeed the best bits of the national article lifted directly from FT. He drops the ‘pretentious’ reference to Guy Debord, which is a shame and makes no mention of ruffled kilts.</p> <p>New York does not allow private events in public spaces.</p> <p>The best thing about edinburgh for me is you can be a flaneur like Debord as long as you don’t mind hills.</p> <p>You can walk the Crags and arthur’s Seat and pop into the Sheep Heid and see the queen having a spot of lunch/</p> <p>You can traverse west east and end up in Robbies Bar on the walk.</p> <p>You can skip across the meadows and end up at Leslies</p> <p>You can cycle anywhere in the city, often on a path if you are prepared to take a roundabout route.</p> <p>You can cycle out of the city in all directions pretty quickly and find glorious countryside and beaches.</p> <p>You can visit the poetry library and just miss Tam Dean Burn getting stabbed.</p> <p>You can come to the Waverley Bar in the new year and join in their Oulipo Salon as long as you have a little to say and can listen a lot (I am the other way round)</p> <p>You can run a half marathon all down hill from Balerno to Leith but that is a secret</p> <p>You can spend many happy days in the Pentlands just by catching a 44 bus</p> <p>You can spend 1.70 and get to the caravan at Seton Sands</p> <p>No tourists around </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320218 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 17:04:54 +0000 crowriver 320218@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"misses a chance for a slightly more subtle analysis. "</p> <p>It's a common flaw of much writing from Mr. Small. They're kind of like mash-ups: bit of political positioning here, bit of moralising there; add a pinch of sensationalist exaggeration, and liberally sprinkle with some essence of riding-the-wave-of-twitter-outrage.</p> <p>There is a need for some more considered analysis and reflection, but I fear our media are not up to the task. The effort which gets nearest to that so far is an article in the FT quoted by Small, which I read the other day. A bit moire nuance and a decent argument founded in critical theory. Well worth a read.</p> <p>---</p> <p>The hijacking of Edinburgh’s Hogmanay</p> <p><a href="https://t.co/cELiu7dO0p" rel="nofollow">https://t.co/cELiu7dO0p</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320217 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 15:57:08 +0000 gembo 320217@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Well I have been visiting and living in Edinburgh a long time now given my extreme vintage. Pictures of me astride Mons Meg just like Cher - as a wee boy in a toorie bunnet. This was before Tourism was invented. What you did was you went to the Capital City as a Scottish citizen or whatever. You bought that shit EDINBURGH rock from the wee shop built into the steps up to the castle. You were a visitor not a tourist.</p> <p>The whole accidental geography of EDINBURGH - Arthur’s Seat, the Crags, the river lends the city a Disney landscape. Add in the pretty New TOWN ARCHITECTURE BUILT ON SLAVERY and it all starts to get a bit much, before you even start talking about Underbelly Tourism causing anything.</p> <p>Then you can look at how edinburgh residents themselves are going mental with the Air BNB. This needs regulated and is regulated in other countries. I think the fluff around UNDERBELLY is a distraction from what the council needs to do as a regulatory body around Air BnB.</p> <p>Sorry if i am even less coherent than usual, I am a bit gubbed from a 100km cycle in big wind.</p> <p>Fauldhouse was involved. Also Forth. Addiewell too, which is getting a new bridge. Also of course Carnwath and our beloved Apple PIE. NOTHING against these places but Edinburgh is much nicer. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320215 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 15:30:35 +0000 Murun Buchstansangur 320215@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Couple of articles in the UK media over the last couple of days:</p> <p><a href="https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jan/05/rebel-alliance-formed-to-halt-disneyfication-of-edinburgh" rel="nofollow">https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jan/05/rebel-alliance-formed-to-halt-disneyfication-of-edinburgh</a></p> <p> <a href="https://www.ft.com/content/b887760a-2be1-11ea-bc77-65e4aa615551" rel="nofollow">https://www.ft.com/content/b887760a-2be1-11ea-bc77-65e4aa615551</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=3#post-320214 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 14:47:11 +0000 chdot 320214@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“Nothing to do with tourism.”</p> <p>I don’t think that is 100% accurate. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320211 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 14:13:24 +0000 gembo 320211@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I don’t think that is 100% accurate as in the latest round of cuts the development company responsible for marketing edinburgh had most of its money that the council gives it withdrawn.</p> <p>I suppose I better read the whole article. It better not be gibberish.</p> <p>Some if it was good. Doughnut city is worth considering. However a lot of it was a bit agitprop. Venice is considering becoming a gated city. But Underbelly gates are bad. </p> <p>Also misses a chance for a slightly more subtle analysis. As with many schemes the council runs e.g. the bike to work scheme. They run with one provider then they are obliged over time to put the scheme out to tender. The Underbelly version is about the same as the previous tender - Gates for residents, German market etc.</p> <p>Many tourists appear to arrive by train, often with North of England accents.</p> <p>I avoid German markets and prefer full festival shows to fringe stuff. My favourite time is probably still after the festival in the summer and before the students arrive back. But i like the winter and you can avoid the tourists and the whole winter underbelly by going to queen street (malt whisky society for example) or dovecote at Infirmary street. So basically about two streets are busy. You can of course go down leith to the Shore bar or out to GMA.</p> <p>As for Mark Ronson and Marc Almond. I like them but prefer to grow my own culture.</p> <p>I like Edinburgh. I like to stroll around the city centre. Excellent walks and pubs etc. After a couple of hours it starts to feel like Disneyland. THE CASTLE, THE NEW TOWN, HOLYROOD ETC. Nothing to do with tourism. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320205 Sun, 05 Jan 2020 12:38:09 +0000 chdot 320205@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>The City Fathers and Mothers are to blame, not the avarice of private companies. City councils (and this is not just Edinburgh) have no other model in their heads: growth, growth and more growth. </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.thenational.scot/news/18138100.edinburgh-bought-sold-hogmanay-gold/" rel="nofollow">https://www.thenational.scot/news/18138100.edinburgh-bought-sold-hogmanay-gold/</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320158 Fri, 03 Jan 2020 11:02:56 +0000 Rosie 320158@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I've seen Wardie Bay mentioned as an alternative. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320144 Fri, 03 Jan 2020 08:33:19 +0000 Try Cycle 320144@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I remember the torch light procession being pretty casual when i went about 10 years ago. Find someone with candles, give them a donation and off you go. This year a friend said it was buy a ticket, queue for ages to get a candle and queue ages to get it lit.</p> <p>The Loony Dook could be the final straw, bad optics to be charging people to jump in the sea. Probably good news for the Porty Loony Dook though, until UB find a way it can be monetised </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320117 Thu, 02 Jan 2020 14:48:33 +0000 chdot 320117@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>Originally organised by locals and starting from the Moorings pub (now the Inchcolm), factors such as increased crowds, safety issues and popularity necessitated a different handling. As a consequence, the events 2009 onwards were professionally handled by event managers Unique Events. Being the organisers of the Edinburgh Hogmanay Festival, they included the Loony Dook into the latter from 2011. In the same year a registration fee was introduced to cover the cost of organisation and stewarding. The fee of originally £6 was raised to £10 in 2016. The proceeds of which benefit RNLI Queensferry and local charities.</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loony_Dook" rel="nofollow">https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loony_Dook</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320116 Thu, 02 Jan 2020 14:19:44 +0000 Rosie 320116@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Cllr Arthur's fairly measured take on it.</p> <p><a href="https://drscottarthur.scot/2019/12/31/the-council-needs-to-understand-what-edinburgh-wants-to-gain-from-its-visitor-economy/" rel="nofollow">https://drscottarthur.scot/2019/12/31/the-council-needs-to-understand-what-edinburgh-wants-to-gain-from-its-visitor-economy/</a><br /> @acsimpson - I do sympathise but isn't it a question of numbers? These things can be victims of their own success (like the canal towpath). </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320114 Thu, 02 Jan 2020 14:01:30 +0000 gembo 320114@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>How many of the residents are renting flats as Air BnB? Not many? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320108 Thu, 02 Jan 2020 12:40:09 +0000 chdot 320108@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>“Tourism is an important topic of conversation for our city right now and we’re working positively with partners and stakeholders on a new 10 year plan to enhance Edinburgh’s management of the impacts of high visitor footfall. Residents’ feedback will be absolutely central to this plan.” </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/whats-on/arts-and-entertainment/how-edinburgh-compares-other-world-cities-miami-and-dubai-terms-tourist-resident-ratios-1353183" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/whats-on/arts-and-entertainment/how-edinburgh-compares-other-world-cities-miami-and-dubai-terms-tourist-resident-ratios-1353183</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320105 Thu, 02 Jan 2020 11:21:47 +0000 acsimpson 320105@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/politics/council/underbelly-can-get-sea-locals-respond-news-edinburghs-hogmanay-loony-dook-sold-out-1352930?itm_source=parsely-api">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/politics/council/underbelly-can-get-sea-locals-respond-news-edinburghs-hogmanay-loony-dook-sold-out-1352930</a></p> <p>For some reason I find charging people for the loony dook more distasteful that the street party. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320104 Thu, 02 Jan 2020 11:08:53 +0000 chdot 320104@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Alternative to fireworks??</p> <p><a href="https://twitter.com/aliestripling/status/1212509551104274434" rel="nofollow">https://twitter.com/aliestripling/status/1212509551104274434</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320103 Thu, 02 Jan 2020 11:04:52 +0000 chdot 320103@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“<br /> In its consultation response to Edinburgh City Council’s Tourism Strategy 2030, The Cockburn Association said continual tourism growth should not be the “overriding objective” for the council. </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/people/edinburghs-leading-heritage-group-calls-tourism-strategy-which-expansion-not-overriding-objective-1353181" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/people/edinburghs-leading-heritage-group-calls-tourism-strategy-which-expansion-not-overriding-objective-1353181</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320086 Wed, 01 Jan 2020 17:14:59 +0000 crowriver 320086@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Suppose it depends on the definition of tourism. York is so low on list for international visitors it barely registers, whereas Edinburgh second biggest destination after London. But most visitors in York and Edinburgh are "domestic tourists" from UK. Maybe just a far larger proportion of visitors to York.</p> <p>Presume many of the visitors to Edinburgh's Xmas markets and Hogmanay events are "regional" ie. from nearby areas of Scotland: Lothians, Fife, Borders etc. Less than 20% from city itself and only a fifth or so are international visitors. Similar story for the Fringe, with added rUK influx, many from south east England/London. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=19997&page=2#post-320081 Wed, 01 Jan 2020 13:11:56 +0000 SRD 320081@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>we were in York at the start of December. stayed in a hotel, not airbnb. definitely busy, but welcoming. streets had a great vibe. my impression was that most of the visitors were from other parts of yorkshire. felt more like a regional hub attracting people for their christmas shopping. </p> <p>was back a week later for work and spotted several shops we would have visited but didn't; the roads were so crowded we didn't even see them. </p>