http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: “Edinburgh city centre Future of Princes Street and George Street up for debate” en Sat, 26 Sep 2026 20:22:31 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385899 Sat, 19 Sep 2026 08:38:37 +0000 chdot 385899@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>PRINCES Street has never stood still. </p> <p>Over more than two centuries it has changed from the residential southern edge of Edinburgh’s New Town into the city’s premier shopping street, a transport artery, a visitor destination and one of Scotland’s most recognisable urban spaces. </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.buildedinburgh.com/p/saturday-column-princes-street-a?publication_id=3659842&amp;post_id=215208993&amp;triedRedirect=true" rel="nofollow">https://www.buildedinburgh.com/p/saturday-column-princes-street-a?publication_id=3659842&amp;post_id=215208993&amp;triedRedirect=true</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385841 Tue, 15 Sep 2026 08:20:09 +0000 chdot 385841@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>Edinburgh councillors show no appetite for adventurous ideas on Princes Street </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/opinion/edinburgh-councillors-show-no-appetite-for-adventurous-ideas-on-princes-street-9046842" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/opinion/edinburgh-councillors-show-no-appetite-for-adventurous-ideas-on-princes-street-9046842</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385818 Sat, 12 Sep 2026 07:47:03 +0000 chdot 385818@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>Saturday column - </p> <p>What type of Princes Street do we want? </p> <p>EDITOR </p> <p>SEP 12, 2026 </p> <p>THERE is still much to play for, as to what Princes Street might, in the future, look like.</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.buildedinburgh.com/p/saturday-column-what-type-of-princes?publication_id=3659842&amp;post_id=215023608" rel="nofollow">https://www.buildedinburgh.com/p/saturday-column-what-type-of-princes?publication_id=3659842&amp;post_id=215023608</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385795 Thu, 10 Sep 2026 12:17:27 +0000 chdot 385795@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“<br /> Cllr @davidfkey.bsky.social asks what for bicycles in #GeorgeStreet if Option 1 approved</p> <p>A: "conversation is ongoing" [under-statement !] But there is unallocated (visitor levy?) money that councillors could decide to use</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://bsky.app/profile/spokes.org.uk/post/3mv3rrdsm6k2p" rel="nofollow">https://bsky.app/profile/spokes.org.uk/post/3mv3rrdsm6k2p</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385794 Thu, 10 Sep 2026 11:44:52 +0000 bakky 385794@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Cllr <em>'which way is the wind blowing this week'</em> Lang</p> <p>Cannot keep up with him! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385793 Thu, 10 Sep 2026 11:41:38 +0000 chdot 385793@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>LibDem Cllr @kevin-lang.bsky.social says Option 1 is not the ambitious strategy councillors has asked for. It's just a 'glorified resurfacing project'</p> <p>He asks why SNP changed its mind</p> <p>LibDem Cllr Osler Need a transformation now, not incremental 'resurfacing project'</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://bsky.app/profile/spokes.org.uk/post/3mv3sisqedc2p" rel="nofollow">https://bsky.app/profile/spokes.org.uk/post/3mv3sisqedc2p</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385791 Thu, 10 Sep 2026 10:29:14 +0000 bakky 385791@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@neddie Spokes on Bsky:</p> <p><blockquote>Vote</p> <p>:( 7 SNP/Lab/Con - Option 1<br /> :) 2 LibDem - Option 2<br /> :| 2 Green - neither</p> <p>SNP drops their 2nd point, re need for (bike emoji) lanes on George Street. Convener says this will be discussed at TEC (? !)</p> <p>Spokes conclusion: </p> <p>Scotland's premier street remains dominated by roadspace</blockquote> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385790 Thu, 10 Sep 2026 09:41:21 +0000 neddie 385790@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Does anyone know if the SNP got their amendment through?</p> <p><blockquote>Further to the above, a scoping out of options for segregated cycle lane(s) and removal of parking on George Street and a review of how to minimize non-essential traffic on Princes Street. This will provide an ambitious, exciting and deliverable strategy for Princes Street and Waverley Valley</blockquote> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385789 Thu, 10 Sep 2026 08:30:37 +0000 chdot 385789@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>Transport efficiency</p> <p>A new cycle hub at Waverley Station with safe cycle access and improved cycle parking along Princes Street</p> <p>Narrowing of the carriageway at the south side to make more space for walking and wheeling, maintaining it as two lanes in each travel direction for bus and tram services</p> <p>Potential introduction of a new bus gate at the east end of Princes Street as part of measures to reduce congestion and delay along the thoroughfare</p> <p>The design approach is based on the outcome of discussions at a workshop in June where Councillors, officers and representatives from partner organisations including Historic Environment Scotland, Lothian Buses and Edinburgh Trams, Edinburgh Chamber of Commerce, Essential Edinburgh, Network Rail and Edinburgh Access Panel, among others, met to hear proposals and share feedback.</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/news/article/14485/step-forward-for-princes-street-and-waverley-valley-as-design-approach-is-agreed" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/news/article/14485/step-forward-for-princes-street-and-waverley-valley-as-design-approach-is-agreed</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=3#post-385788 Thu, 10 Sep 2026 08:11:59 +0000 chdot 385788@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>Today we return to one of the capital’s most enduring debates: the future of Princes Street.</p> <p>As far as we can tell, people have been wringing their hands and crying out that Princes Street is going to the dogs since at least the beginning of the 19th century, when it started to turn from its original purpose as a residential street into one of the city’s main commercial locations.</p> <p>Now, more changes are afoot, after city councillors agreed a new “ambitious pragmatic” plan for its future, designed to open up the Gardens and the south side of the street.</p> <p>If you were hoping for a ‘big bang’ change, like cycle lanes on Princes Street or a concert arena in the Gardens, then you’re going to be disappointed.</p> <p>But Euan McGrory has been looking at the plans for us - and he is getting quite excited.</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=1719536&amp;post_id=212756833" rel="nofollow">https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=1719536&amp;post_id=212756833</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385784 Wed, 09 Sep 2026 20:50:45 +0000 chdot 385784@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>The council's political groups are deadlocked over the plans.<br /> The SNP backs Option 1, with an amendment asking officers to explore “a scoping out of options for segregated cycle lane(s) and removal of parking on George Street and a review of how to minimize non-essential traffic on Princes Street”.<br /> By contrast, the Liberal Democrats favour Option 2, with Councillor Kevin Lang hailing the “historic and exciting opportunity” to “position the street as one of the world's great places to visit and experience”.</p> <p>A third approach has been taken up by the Scottish Greens, who have submitted an amendment clarifying that they do not support either Option 1 or Option 2.</p> <p>They have instead asked council officers to "deliver accessibility improvements, improved lighting and longer opening hours at Princes Street Gardens, work to enhance and expand the footway along Princes Street, and [create] more space for pedestrians waiting at bus stops, in particular in East Princes Street, without delay”.</p> <p>…</p> <p>By contrast, cyclist campaign group Spokes "fundamentally rejects the recommendations in this report”. </p> <p>“We point out that widening the south footway by 1.5m, whilst retaining dual traffic lanes, will bring cyclists far closer to tramlines, for example when passing stopped buses,” the deputation states.</p> <p>“This will without doubt mean additional tramline cycle crashes and injuries.”</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://archive.ph/2026.09.08-160619/https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/26532597.edinburgh-councillors-choose-princes-street-designs/" rel="nofollow">https://archive.ph/2026.09.08-160619/https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/26532597.edinburgh-councillors-choose-princes-street-designs/</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385779 Wed, 09 Sep 2026 12:36:59 +0000 Arellcat 385779@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>TAL15/99 is the DfT's Traffic Advisory Leaflet from December 1999:</p> <p><a href="https://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ukgwa/20120606202850/http://assets.dft.gov.uk/publications/tal-15-99/tal-15-99.pdf" rel="nofollow">https://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ukgwa/20120606202850/http://assets.dft.gov.uk/publications/tal-15-99/tal-15-99.pdf</a></p> <p>Page 4 sets out engineering recommendations relating to speed limits, lane width, signage, timing of traffic lights, maintaining access for cyclists and road surface. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385778 Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:58:52 +0000 Tulyar 385778@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I came through for a rare visit to the RSE lecture on 'Who Owns The Clyde' on George Street &amp; took the opportunity to walk the tram route back from Scott Monument to Haymarket spotting several sections of the edge slabs that had broken away &amp; flipped up/down to leave a step of up to 2" to hit if you weren't alert when cycling along<br /> The scaffolding curtain wall that is being used to hold the facade together had large concrete kentiledge blocks poured and filling the footway outside, and making it necessary to reduce the carriageway pavement from N Charlotte St Eastwards to a single lane which is largely filled with the tram track &amp; has to be shared with all the other wheeled traffic<br /> I didn't have a look-out to nip out &amp; measure the pavement width that remains for the carriageway, with the footway pavement 'defended' by a line of water-filled temporary kerbs<br /> This is well below (or very close to) the minimum lane width listed in TAL15/99 "Cyclists at Road Works" which highlights the need to use the TSRGD sign (chapter 8) "Narrow Lanes Do not Overtake Cyclists" where lanes are under 3.5 metres wide<br /> Also missing are the Diagram 1066 yellow marker dots that define the swept envelope of a moving tram (DKE) that should not be obstructed<br /> This short length of Princes Street should be a special notice briefing for tram drivers &amp; bus drivers using this as part of a bus or tram route that they should NOT attempt to overtake cyclists, and to observe the warnings used on the "Supplementary Plates" that appeared nearly 10 years ago after Zhi Min Soh was run over by a bus on Shandwick Place, especially with the high hazard of riding parallel to the multiple grooves where the tram rails are embedded in the carriageway pavement, just perfectly placed for the 'Darwin' mode of cycle crashing on tram tracks riding in to the parallel groove!<br /> Perhaps a quick report on the measurements taken with a scaling element (a 12" ruler) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385775 Tue, 08 Sep 2026 22:28:25 +0000 chdot 385775@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://archive.ph/2026.09.08-160619/https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/26532597.edinburgh-councillors-choose-princes-street-designs/" rel="nofollow">https://archive.ph/2026.09.08-160619/https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/26532597.edinburgh-councillors-choose-princes-street-designs/</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385754 Mon, 07 Sep 2026 13:52:40 +0000 chdot 385754@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>Spokes fundamentally rejects the recommendations in this report. The proposals represent only minor change from those rejected by councillors2 on 12 November 2025, under Cllr Lang’s motion as amended. Their very description as ‘pragmatism’ does not reflect councillors’ request for an “ambitious and exciting strategy.” </p> <p>…</p> <p>We recall historically that Gehl recommended a unified approach to Princes Street and George Street. Very regrettably, councillors subsequently decided this was too difficult and that the council would instead concentrate on George Street, leaving Princes Street to later decisions</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.spokes.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2026/09/2609-Princes-St-Planning-Cttee-9.9.26-Spokes-submission.pdf" rel="nofollow">https://www.spokes.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2026/09/2609-Princes-St-Planning-Cttee-9.9.26-Spokes-submission.pdf</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385611 Thu, 27 Aug 2026 12:02:40 +0000 chdot 385611@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-to-reopen-this-weekend-seven-weeks-after-fire-8945061" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-to-reopen-this-weekend-seven-weeks-after-fire-8945061</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385476 Tue, 18 Aug 2026 08:16:31 +0000 chdot 385476@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>“We believe we’ve managed to strike a balance between form and function,” Brian Mikkelsen, boss of the building’s owner the Danish Chamber of Commerce, has previously said of the refurbishment plans, which are expected to complete in 2029. It includes restoring the copper roof using historic techniques, writes Emma Newlands. </p> <p>Moving from Scandinavia’s capital to Scotland’s, the embers have only relatively recently cooled on the site of July’s fire on Princes Street. </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.edinburghinquirer.co.uk/p/copying-copenhagen-bright-horizons?triedRedirect=true" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghinquirer.co.uk/p/copying-copenhagen-bright-horizons?triedRedirect=true</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385461 Mon, 17 Aug 2026 12:42:18 +0000 neddie 385461@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The traders at the Farmer's Market will all tell you that a busy market, i.e. a lot of people walking past, does not translate to much in the way of increased sales.</p> <p>i.e. most of the custom comes from the regulars. Or, increased footfall doesn't tell you what sales are going to do.</p> <p>Think about the rugby or festival crowds coming... they just want to have a look, soak up the atmosphere, they don't want to carry a half leg of lamb back to the hotel </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385457 Mon, 17 Aug 2026 11:47:35 +0000 chdot 385457@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Yeah but</p> <p>“Footfall” is usually(?) about (potential) customers rather than people walking to places</p> <p>Rose Street may well be “up over 300%”, and some people may visit shops and pubs they might not have done if they could walk along PSt</p> <p>So? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385452 Mon, 17 Aug 2026 08:30:44 +0000 LaidBack 385452@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><blockquote>But Roddy Smith, chief executive of business group Essential Edinburgh, said the closure has changed the way people traverse the city centre – and that one neighbouring street had seen footfall more than quadruple.</p> <p>“We’ve not seen overall a massive decrease in footfall,” he told the Press Association.</p> <p>“But what we have seen is people are traversing the city differently because they simply have to, and that’s obviously affected some shops positively, and some shops negatively.</p> <p>“Rose Street, for example, is up over 300% in terms of its footfall.”</p> <p>He said the change in Rose Street was most apparent at its western end, which he said has seen a “significant” uptick in pedestrians.</p> <p>George Street has also seen more pedestrians, with Smith saying it has become “very busy” as a result of the number of buses being diverted onto it.</blockquote></p> <p>From National </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385420 Thu, 13 Aug 2026 14:50:57 +0000 chdot 385420@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>Ashley has bought a series of struggling premium brands in recent years after starting out with a single sports shop. He has said he would keep Harvey Nichols’s Knightsbridge and Edinburgh stores, but rebrand the four other stores – in Birmingham, Leeds, Manchester and Bristol – as House of Fraser or Flannels. </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.theguardian.com/business/2026/aug/13/sports-direct-owner-buys-harvey-nichols-department-store-chain" rel="nofollow">https://www.theguardian.com/business/2026/aug/13/sports-direct-owner-buys-harvey-nichols-department-store-chain</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385398 Tue, 11 Aug 2026 14:39:51 +0000 chdot 385398@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“</p> <p>Frustrated passengers who normally rely on the tram to get around now face waiting for Princes Street to be reopened, which the council is aiming to do by August 26.</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-fire-hopes-of-temporary-service-between-city-centre-and-newhaven-are-dashed-8875625" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-fire-hopes-of-temporary-service-between-city-centre-and-newhaven-are-dashed-8875625</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385384 Mon, 10 Aug 2026 15:32:13 +0000 chdot 385384@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“<br /> we believe more must and can be done. Public transport users need not just be kept moving, but delays and extended journey times experienced by them across the entire network need to be reduced.</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://edinburghbususers.group/second-open-letter-to-the-city-of-edinburgh-council-next-steps-for-edinburghs-public-transport-recovery-post-debenham-fire?ref=edinburghminute.com" rel="nofollow">https://edinburghbususers.group/second-open-letter-to-the-city-of-edinburgh-council-next-steps-for-edinburghs-public-transport-recovery-post-debenham-fire?ref=edinburghminute.com</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385368 Sat, 08 Aug 2026 22:30:07 +0000 chdot 385368@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-fire-investigators-must-wait-at-least-two-weeks-to-access-worst-hit-parts-of-former-debenhams-store-8844769" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-fire-investigators-must-wait-at-least-two-weeks-to-access-worst-hit-parts-of-former-debenhams-store-8844769</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385344 Fri, 07 Aug 2026 08:17:31 +0000 chdot 385344@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Ah Party politics, that’ll speed things up</p> <p>ThisIsEdinburgh </p> <p>“<br /> Following a meeting between the Deputy First Minister and the Edinburgh Council Leader at the site of the Princes Street blaze, there has been a degree of political Following a meeting between the Deputy First Minister and the Edinburgh Council Leader at the site of the Princes Street blaze, there has been a degree of political fallout. fallout. </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://theedinburghreporter.co.uk/2026/08/councils-snp-group-leader-criticises-council-leader-for-her-petty-party-politics/?ref=edinburghminute.com" rel="nofollow">https://theedinburghreporter.co.uk/2026/08/councils-snp-group-leader-criticises-council-leader-for-her-petty-party-politics/?ref=edinburghminute.com</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385331 Thu, 06 Aug 2026 08:21:08 +0000 chdot 385331@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-fire-council-leader-hits-out-at-john-swinneys-shameful-lack-of-response-as-scottish-government-announces-ps5m-support-four-weeks-on-8841193" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-fire-council-leader-hits-out-at-john-swinneys-shameful-lack-of-response-as-scottish-government-announces-ps5m-support-four-weeks-on-8841193</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385322 Wed, 05 Aug 2026 14:06:33 +0000 chdot 385322@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/ps5m-edinburgh-fire-recovery-funding-8840201" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/ps5m-edinburgh-fire-recovery-funding-8840201</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385313 Wed, 05 Aug 2026 07:56:14 +0000 edinburgh87 385313@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Rode down there yesterday on way to work - immediate thought was that the buses would be flowing better if there was a temporary ban on private vehicles crossing the city centre S&gt;N at the West End. Lothian Motorcoach also disgorging a load of people outside the Caledonian blocking one of the two N-bound lanes on Lothian Road, too. Just sort of feels like there's not much thinking out side of the box.. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385309 Tue, 04 Aug 2026 15:28:05 +0000 chdot 385309@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/opinion/princes-street-fire-closure-of-street-set-to-impact-edinburghs-vital-visitor-economy-8836561" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/opinion/princes-street-fire-closure-of-street-set-to-impact-edinburghs-vital-visitor-economy-8836561</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=21898&page=2#post-385293 Mon, 03 Aug 2026 17:43:56 +0000 chdot 385293@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-fire-stark-briefing-spells-out-scale-of-task-facing-engineers-trying-to-save-former-debenhams-store-8836053" rel="nofollow">https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/princes-street-fire-stark-briefing-spells-out-scale-of-task-facing-engineers-trying-to-save-former-debenhams-store-8836053</a> </p>