http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Maps & qualitative assessment en Sun, 31 May 2026 12:07:01 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25112 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 14:31:13 +0000 chrisfl 25112@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>As far as I know they base the hostile-ness of a road on it's category So a B road is less hostile than an A road and unclassified and residential streets are thought to be quiet. </p> <p>However in cities I think this breaks down quite quickly. So unclassified roads tend to get rated as quiet, which in the city often isn't the case. The cyclestreets guys have been promising a blog post on how they use OSM tagging to determine routes for some time...</p> <p>wingpig: Even if you don't have time to edit, then stick a quick bug in using: <a href="http://openstreetbugs.schokokeks.org/?zoom=13&amp;lat=55.94339&amp;lon=-3.20005&amp;layers=B00T">OpenStreetBugs</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25108 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 13:20:54 +0000 wingpig 25108@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I've been meaning to get round to signing up and logging-in to do some updating of stuff to OSM/CS since finding a couple of bits that the app repeatedly tries to route me down which are blocked by a shut door or a large fence. Wonder if I'll ever get round to doing it, much the same as I never get round to telling Spokes about some of the cobble-labelling omissions on their map? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25106 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 13:13:45 +0000 Dave 25106@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>All true. The problem with open source is that my complaint is really "why haven't I fixed this" ;-)</p> <p>I suppose the problem illustrated in the above post is that quietness / hostility / routing are also heavily dependant on the individual. So only one person is ever going to be happy with Cyclestreets rulings (I suppose you could log in and set a bunch of parameters like "I don't mind passing buses that have stopped: 1-5")? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25092 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 12:34:34 +0000 wingpig 25092@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I think I just passed a mention somewhere on CycleStreets or OSM about time-of-day being rather impactful and thus destined for consideration at some point. Hopefully the threateningness as well as the busyness will be time-variable.</p> <p>The hostility of a road very much depends on what you're trying to do on it. Sticking to the bus lane is often fine whereas trying to get round a stationary bus (or delivery vehicle) blocking the entire bus lane with nose-to-tail 40mph traffic passing a foot to its right preventing you getting around the blockage is less fine. Sticking to a bus lane to go left or take the "AND BUSES" straight-ahead option is fine whereas crossing a couple of lanes to get to a right-hand filter without the benefit of a red traffic light can sometimes be tricky if no-one wants to let you out. I assume OSM's junctions carry permissible-routing information but haven't looked to see if the differing easinesses of different manoeuvres can be attributed. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25088 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 12:19:35 +0000 SRD 25088@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>I DO agree that Harrison Road is exceptionally unpleasant.</em> </p> <p>Especially for the drivers who have to contend with Spytfyre glaring at them (see old threads :) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25076 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 12:09:29 +0000 chdot 25076@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"I certainly don't know how anyone can describe it as "quiet"!"</p> <p>The simple answer is a) OSM is inevitably subjective b) most roads are different at different times of the day - which doesn't help!</p> <p>I DO agree that Harrison Road is exceptionally unpleasant. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25071 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 12:05:13 +0000 Min 25071@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>It seems the only way to find out these things is to ride the route yourself which is unhelpful. I would also consider Harrison Road to be very hostile and as you have to ride up it to link from the Roseburn to the Towpath this is quite concering. I certainly don't know how anyone can describe it as "quiet"!</p> <p>I have also ridden on huge A roads and found them to be no problem at all. This is usually because they are so wide that even HGVs can pass with no difficulty and of course - blessing - no parked cars!</p> <p>But these things may just be subjective. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25068 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 12:03:39 +0000 chdot 25068@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>CycleStreets uses the data from <a href="http://www.openstreetmap.org">OpenStreetMap</a> which <strong>anyone</strong> can update/improve/add too.</p> <p>Yeah the "hostile" is particularly unhelpful! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2358#post-25059 Fri, 25 Feb 2011 11:51:09 +0000 Dave 25059@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I think I've mentioned this before, but on the above subject last night's exploration reminded me of Cyclestreet's bizarre metric for route quality.</p> <p>Take Harrison St - the ratrun linking the A70 to the far side of the canal. Every time I ride this I am concerned for drivers trying to scrape past, playing chicken with oncoming vehicles and cutting up bikes (especially uphill). Cyclestreets give it a top "very quiet" status on the quality-o-meter.</p> <p>Then look at a busier road which, nonetheless, proves very agreeable for cycling. In extremis, I rode the A90 daily during the years I worked in Fife and *never* had any trouble. But as a more mundane example, consider riding the bus lanes on the A8 - about as agreeable as cycling can be, in many ways.</p> <p>Cyclestreets tells us this is "very hostile". Well, no. It is *busy* but while many would seek to avoid that, it is by no means *hostile* to share a bus lane with Lothian buses.</p> <p>Does anyone else think this is weird? I'd have "no through road / very quiet / quiet / average / busy / very busy / stationary" as my quietness metric, and then "friendly / agreeable / disagreeable / hostile" as the quality metric. </p>