http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: The Sacred Driving Licence en Sun, 31 May 2026 10:02:02 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-347894 Tue, 09 Mar 2021 11:23:52 +0000 acsimpson 347894@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I say well done the government for using an open document format rather than choosing a propitiatory one.</p> <p>Apple are such a large company that they really should be able to support open source file types (Google and Microsoft both manage it). If apple choose not to natively support open source documents then the fault lies with them not the government. I don't have an ipad but a quick search suggests that there are apps available which will allow ODS to be opened on IOS. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-347893 Tue, 09 Mar 2021 10:52:48 +0000 chdot 347893@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Can’t open that file with Numbers app.</p> <p>Suggest you email web site. I’ve been sent other file formats in (distant) past. </p> <p>iPads are so common these days, Gov info should be useable on them. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-347886 Tue, 09 Mar 2021 10:21:58 +0000 gembo 347886@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@prof French</p> <p>Define normal, define spreadsheets</p> <p>I think they can but I expect I would need The App. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-347882 Tue, 09 Mar 2021 10:02:06 +0000 Frenchy 347882@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Do iPads normally open spreadsheets? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-347880 Tue, 09 Mar 2021 09:54:01 +0000 gembo 347880@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Yes prof French that is where I went too and it said would I like to download it and I said yes and I can see it in my downloads but it winnae open (iPad) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-347879 Tue, 09 Mar 2021 09:30:30 +0000 Frenchy 347879@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The age and gender one <a href="https://www.gov.uk/government/statistical-data-sets/nts02-driving-licence-holders">here</a>?</p> <p>It's working for me. Could send you it resaved as an xls if that would help? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-347878 Tue, 09 Mar 2021 09:02:05 +0000 gembo 347878@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>For some reason I can’t download the same data set (England) to look at age. I can see it on th3 gov.up site anD it lets me download it bu5 i5 is not then opening.</p> <p>My pal trev’s neighbour is deaf, possibly blind (Trev was in his garden. Shoveling smashed greenhouse panes into a barrow and he didn’t see him despit3 looking out the window). Has ha$ motorbike nicked? So has bought a Mazda sports car age 75 </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-347877 Tue, 09 Mar 2021 08:00:46 +0000 chdot 347877@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Well this seems like the optimum(ly titled) thread for this -</p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/culture-and-community/transport/driving-licences/latest#by-ethnicity-over-time">Latest figures show</a> 24% of white people in England do not hold a driving licence, compared with 39% of people of Asian ethnicity and 47% of black people. </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/mar/09/warning-over-photo-id-law-change-for-uk-wide-and-english-elections" rel="nofollow">https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/mar/09/warning-over-photo-id-law-change-for-uk-wide-and-english-elections</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138881 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 19:01:42 +0000 wee folding bike 138881@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>One of the things I like about cruise control is that it can stop you drifting up through the MPH. It's easy to do if traffic round you is doing it too. </p> <p>Cruise control makes it one less thing to worry about and you can give more attention to other stuff which is going on. Remember not to jump into the back seat for a snooze though. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138874 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 18:38:39 +0000 Kenny 138874@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>I'm wondering exactly how one manages to go at 120mph without really noticing</em></p> <p>Depends, to some extent, on the car you're driving. Cars which are incapable of exceeding 120mph make it quite obvious when you are going faster. Cars which can easily do 155mph+ don't really feel any different whether you're doing 70 or 100. So if you're not keeping an eye on your speed (which obv you should be), then it is possible to hit 100 since it doesn't seem any different to 70. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138869 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 18:25:12 +0000 allebong 138869@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Funny this has come up, because the other night I found myself drifting onto the speeding/law/legal section of a motoring forum (was just there for the cycle subsection, honest!) and it was rather morbidly amusing reading some of the stuff there.</p> <p>On the one hand, you had people admitting a fair cop when they got caught doing 35 in a 30, and they took the points/fine on the chin, and posted as a warning to others to keep the speed in check. </p> <p>On the other hand, there'd be at least one person who just 'drifted up' to 100mph+ on the motorway, for long enough to get caught, and then had the gall to drop the '(otherwise) law abiding tax paying motorist' line. They'd be wanting to know exactly how much they could wriggle out of any penalties as they already had enough points and fines racked up. While there would inevitably be at least one other member that would defend to the death their right to be free from nanny state draconian fascist police state speed limits etc the majority opinion was that said person should politely be made to leave and stop giving the rest of them a bad name.</p> <p>Incidentally, I was doing a brief stint on the bypass a few days ago in a driving lesson, and I'm wondering exactly how one manages to go at 120mph without really noticing, as was described in one post. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138860 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 17:18:57 +0000 wee folding bike 138860@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/transport/revealed-motorist-who-received-45-points-in-nine-months-and-is-still-on-road.1389079689" rel="nofollow">http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/transport/revealed-motorist-who-received-45-points-in-nine-months-and-is-still-on-road.1389079689</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138845 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 15:04:05 +0000 Stickman 138845@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I overheard a colleague's conversation yesterday where he was discussing being sent on a speed awareness course. He'd been caught speeding again and was told it would be more points on the license or even a ban, but was given the option of paying around £100 to go on this course. </p> <p>From his comments it sounds like his attitude to speeding hasn't changed and that he viewed it as a couple of hours just to avoid extra points and the resulting highe insurance. </p> <p>It was a bit depressing. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138837 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 14:36:56 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 138837@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>My brother was very silly a few years back, caught doing a little over a hundred in a 70. This was compounded by not appearing in court because his notice to attend was sent to the wrong address - the Sheriff made a point of saying she had to ban him to send the correct message (that he was young, and where he was caught was a bit of a black spot), and that she didn't believe his wrong address story (which, incidentally was absolutely true).</p> <p>People acted as if his life was over with a 12 month ban, asking if he was going to have to move to Aberdeen, because at the time he lived 16 miles away and they couldn't possibly see how he could get to and from work.</p> <p>Of course he cycled occasionally, and took the bus other days. There is this strange sense that you can't do anything unless you have a driving licence. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138836 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 14:25:55 +0000 crowriver 138836@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Being bad in a car made me a cyclist.</em></p> <p>Shhh! You are just reinforcing the stereotypes drivers believe about cyclists. ;-) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138834 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 14:24:04 +0000 Baldcyclist 138834@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I had mine taken away from me before I had even got it - don't ask, young and stupid.</p> <p>I remember my solicitor in 'mitigating' saying that "He needs his licence to get to work" to which the Judge replied "Presumably he doesn't as he only has a provisional license?".... "Oh, yes"</p> <p>Seems to be standard defence even when one doesn't actually even have a license to 'need'.</p> <p>Incidentally, just after I got banned, I left the court, went home and changed, and then got the train to Edinburgh and bought my first adult bike. True y'know. Being bad in a car made me a cyclist.</p> <p>Remember it was a lovely sunny afternoon, cycled that bike home to Livingston, took me ages but it was lovely. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138831 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 13:40:00 +0000 DaveC 138831@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I can't find it now, but yesterday I read on either the Beeb or EEN, a man who in 2007 had attempted to murder another man by mounting the kerb in his car and running him over had been released after 4 years of an 8 year sentence. His driving ban was overturned after he appealed against it, saying he had a job offer and a car would be useful in ferrying his aging mother round!</p> <p>As I always say change the work car for gun and see how stupid these things are, when licences are given back.</p> <p>Found it:</p> <p><a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-25621299" rel="nofollow">http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-25621299</a></p> <p>Hmm when googling driving ban I get law firms who specialise in getting people off driving bans! :O( </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909&page=2#post-138828 Tue, 07 Jan 2014 13:28:14 +0000 Min 138828@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Another article about the stupid number of points people are allowed to accrue without losing their licence. 45 in one case.</p> <p><a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-25626147" rel="nofollow">http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-25626147</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-35005 Wed, 06 Jul 2011 11:43:36 +0000 chdot 35005@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"<br /> carltonreid: </p> <p>Lorry driver blacks out, kills cyclist, drives away...and only gets 12 month ban. He should never drive again, surely? </p> <p><a href="http://bit.ly/rg9qTs" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/rg9qTs</a> </p> <p>Original Tweet: <a href="http://twitter.com/carltonreid/status/88556591124709377" rel="nofollow">http://twitter.com/carltonreid/status/88556591124709377</a> </p> <p>" </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34992 Wed, 06 Jul 2011 10:18:24 +0000 Smudge 34992@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Or at minimal cost, make the default sentence for death by dangerous driving or 2 x dangerous driving a lifetime ban from holding a driving licence of any type?</p> <p>(and I don't mean "life" as 15 years minus remmission etc etc, I mean <u>permanent</u> loss of licence).</p> <p>Then you only have to jail the people who continue to drive while disqualified... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34976 Wed, 06 Jul 2011 09:38:25 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 34976@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Thanks to everyone in this thread - gave me a page in the new citycycling! (and Kim there's a link to your blog :) ) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34970 Wed, 06 Jul 2011 08:20:08 +0000 Dave 34970@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"I just wish Ken Clarke would stick to playing records on the radio and leave the serious stuff to people who understand the real world."</p> <p>To be fair, he is specifically talking about the impracticalities of jailing everyone who drives dangerously. It's true - we can't afford (and I don't want to pay for) jail places for about 95% of the population.</p> <p>Perhaps if he had said something like "for those cases, we should simply remove the driving licence" it might have been more palatable? (Of course, he could literally mean "ordinary" dangerous drivers should be let off, he is a politician after all).</p> <p>It costs about £40,000 to keep someone locked up for a year, which means even a 3 month jail term for someone who drives dangerously costs society £13,000. Imagine instead spending the same money on a full time case officer who monitors, say, half a dozen driving offenders for a couple of years - daily phone calls, sitting in the vehicle with them on rotation, etc. Which would be more effective?</p> <p>&lt;/pipedream&gt; </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34969 Wed, 06 Jul 2011 08:18:00 +0000 Dave 34969@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"I'd be reluctant to see GPs/nurses/admins inform the authorities in other than extreme cases."</p> <p>It depends on what you mean by extreme. I'd go the other way and make practices part liable for crashes that occur because they did not inform the DVLA of a potentially disabling condition...</p> <p>From my point of view it's pretty farsical that that the health service prefers more deaths and serious injuries to breaching percieved patient confidentiality. In other words, the rights of the wider public not to *become* patients (or corpses) trumps the right of a patient to keep their condition secret from the DVLA, to which health professionals should not be accomplices. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34961 Tue, 05 Jul 2011 21:15:04 +0000 Kim 34961@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Sadly the Secretary of State for Justice, Kenneth Clarke QC, MP, seems to be incapable of understanding the concept of dangerous driving. Apparently “<a href="http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201011/cmhansrd/cm101207/debtext/101207-0001.htm#10120737000583">ordinary dangerous driving</a>” isn’t a serious problem, but then this is a man who doesn’t think all rapes are crime. All rape is rape and all dangerous driving is dangerous, both destroy lives. I just wish Ken Clarke would stick to playing records on the radio and leave the serious stuff to people who understand the real world. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34344 Mon, 27 Jun 2011 17:17:50 +0000 alibali 34344@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Good point; the responsibility does lie with the person with the health issue and I'd be reluctant to see GPs/nurses/admins inform the authorities in other than extreme cases. The same doesn't go for friends and relations though. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34321 Mon, 27 Jun 2011 13:06:01 +0000 Kirst 34321@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"I can't help but wonder how someone who had several seizures a month wasn't identified by health professionals, the police or just acquaintances as a dangerous driver before they had the accident. I guess everyone who knew him well knew about the epilepsy and the driving. Sadly, it's probably the tip of a dodgy license iceberg."</p> <p>Health professionals often struggle to report people to DVLA because of confidentiality requirements. Nobody's ever sure whether they're allowed to report it or not. I once insisted that a GP report an elderly man who had had loads of accidents because of his poor eyesight, dementia and footdrop, but I really had to push for it, and the GP was really hacked off about it. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34276 Sun, 26 Jun 2011 16:12:04 +0000 alibali 34276@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Yes, that's true. There are always going to be corner cases public transport can't address though and if someone needs a car to cope with those, they will use the car for other journeys too. It makes economic sense to do so in many cases.</p> <p>A key element is to make it possible to have ready have access to a car occasionaly so that buying and owning one is less attractive. Not an easy thing to arrange. The nearest City Car from me is 20 minutes walk away which doesn't make it attractive at 0530 when buses are thin on the ground. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34275 Sun, 26 Jun 2011 14:56:35 +0000 Kim 34275@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"As things stand", but they are only that way because we have allowed them to become that way. It doesn't have to be that way! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34270 Sun, 26 Jun 2011 10:47:00 +0000 alibali 34270@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>There is no question holding a license is so important to people because the car unlocks the door to random access travel in a way public transport cannot as things stand. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=2909#post-34269 Sun, 26 Jun 2011 10:37:08 +0000 Kim 34269@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The problem is in no small part due to government policy in subsidising motoring and running down public transport. Successive governments have reduced peoples transport choices for narrow political gain and though a total failure to think (or care) about the consequences. </p>