http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Getting in the way 'On Purpose' en Sun, 31 May 2026 17:31:14 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-47261 Mon, 21 Nov 2011 09:27:48 +0000 chdot 47261@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"When drivers encounter cyclists in circumstances that cause them to slow or deviate… their estimation of the cyclist’s discourtesy increases, regardless of the cyclist’s actual behaviour."</p> <p><a href="http://richardjgarside.wordpress.com/2011/01/21/drivers-0-cyclists-61" rel="nofollow">http://richardjgarside.wordpress.com/2011/01/21/drivers-0-cyclists-61</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46190 Fri, 11 Nov 2011 08:08:08 +0000 gembo 46190@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Just to dwell on the positive for a second - I let two cars out on to the LAnark Road yesterday and the day before several turn right off the LAnark Road. My feeling is that drivers assume the cyclist wont do this [you know brake a little to let them take their turn]. You see other car drivers doing this for each other on rare occasions so I would go with doing it for them too. You do then get the karma back with people giving you time and only overtaking when safe. It is a war out there but there are lulls in the proceedings. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46118 Thu, 10 Nov 2011 14:15:07 +0000 wingpig 46118@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Headshaking (with plenty of (head-fastened) lights front and back) should (I hope) convey to any other road users nearby that disapproval is being expressed in addition to any finger-waggling directed at the perpetrator of the disapproved-of behaviour. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46114 Thu, 10 Nov 2011 14:11:34 +0000 crowriver 46114@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>I have given up [I say that, but when spectacular stunts performed I may still exclaim or shake my head].</em></p> <p>Oh I used to do the head shaking: far too subtle. What naughty drivers need is a school masterly (or matronly, depending on gender of cyclist) ticking off, not a blissed out shrug with "Hey, those crazy dudes" type of thing. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46047 Thu, 10 Nov 2011 10:31:40 +0000 Dave 46047@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Anth, I recommend taking a look at <a href="http://www.cyclechat.net/topic/57877-statement-template/" rel="nofollow">http://www.cyclechat.net/topic/57877-statement-template/</a> and printing something out to take with you.</p> <p>When I went to Leith yesterday, I literally gave the officer a quick verbal (two minute) explanation, handed him the statement and the CD with footage (optional, of course), and he said that was plenty to go on, and he would get back to me if he needed anything.</p> <p>It might go nowhere, or just a verbal warning or whatever, but I think at least if you give it to them on a plate, it makes it easy to view as an opportunity to notch up an easy success for their stats, rather than extra work... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46040 Thu, 10 Nov 2011 09:32:37 +0000 chdot 46040@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"oops, I forgot, vans, esp white ones are protected by that star treck force shield thing !<br /> They all notice and complain when we ( cyclists ) are taking a defensive line, and hence holding them up."</p> <p>SO true!</p> <p>Had one of those yesterday. </p> <p>Wasn't even holding it up, there was a taxi in front of us both - and it stopped at a red pedestrian light. </p> <p>And I was in the middle of the road as I was about to turn right. </p> <p>And I have its number. </p> <p>And I'll be visiting a police station. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46036 Thu, 10 Nov 2011 08:48:25 +0000 crowriver 46036@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@gembo - finger wagging, obviously :) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46034 Thu, 10 Nov 2011 08:40:50 +0000 splitshift 46034@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>back to origonal thread, vans !!!!!!!<br /> couriers regularly stop/park right in front of me(44 ton wagon )as i am obviously about to leave a delivery yard etc, they jump out and look straight at me, then eyes down as they see me looking (glaring ) back, generally they are only a coupl;e of minutes anyway but with most of these cretins, revenge is sweet, do you know how long it takes to restart a lorry when youve stalled it, at the head of a que of traffic( with the van behind you ) ? Just long enough for the lights to be seriously red by the time my tail has just gone through !<br /> oops, I forgot, vans, esp white ones are protected by that star treck force shield thing !<br /> They all notice and complain when we ( cyclists ) are taking a defensive line, and hence holding them up but how many say thanks at all when we move into a clear position to allow safe overtaking ?<br /> be safe ! Scott </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46033 Thu, 10 Nov 2011 07:52:34 +0000 gembo 46033@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Crow - Very Theatrical Winger Wagging - does that not get you arrested?</p> <p>I have given up [I say that, but when spectacular stunts performed I may still exclaim or shake my head].</p> <p>A very drunk man shouted at me after he got off the bus - Have you gat a licence for that. I just laughed and said - you don't need one. Trying to keep it jocular [ especially after the guy clinging to the windscreen wipers] </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46018 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 23:22:02 +0000 crowriver 46018@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>My new approach is not going to be combative (unless it needs to be) it is going to be to try and make them feel ashamed. </em></p> <p>I've taken to very theatrical winger-wagging at errant drivers. Normally I reserve this for those silly drivers who think "Oh damn, the lights are changing, I'll just squeeze through.....after all those six cars/lorries/vans in front are all cruising through the lights. Why should <em>I</em> have to stop?". Only by the time <em>they</em> reach the lights they are well and truly RED. They carry on, hoping no-one will notice. However my queue of traffic has a green signal, and is bearing down on the miscreant RLJ drivers with me at the front (naturally). So a good old finger wag, accompanied by a "Tsk, tsk" or "Naughty driver!" in the direction of their driver's windows. Works a treat! The mixture of shame and embarrassment on their faces is a delight to behold. I got to do it three times in the past 2 days.</p> <p>Naughty drivers! Don't think we can't see what you're doing... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-46013 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 22:14:07 +0000 kaputnik 46013@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>It's just plain bullying from the safety of their metal escape pod. Every morning I see legions of cars "getting in the way on purpose" - blocking cycle lanes, bus lanes, lanes of traffic, lights, pedestrian crossings and so forth all in the name of them just squeezing in a little bit ahead of the next guy. But no drivers bother to have a go at them, because they're also in their metal escape pod. They feel bigger and safer and more dominant than someone who is smaller and more vulnerable and less able to be dominant and they bully.</p> <p>My new approach is not going to be combative (unless it needs to be) it is going to be to try and make them feel ashamed. I don't care if it doesn't work but losing your rag if you don't need to just gives them gratification I think. As my mum would say if I'd been proper naughty wee boy "<em>I'm not angry, I'm dissapointed</em>." </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45997 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 19:44:09 +0000 wee folding bike 45997@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I was threatened with having to use the car last week just because number two son had spent the evening in Monklands A&amp;E and Wishaw General. Luckily he got out at 0030 hrs and I was able to dodge the bullet. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45937 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 12:45:36 +0000 spitters 45937@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I got beeped at for riding alongside another cyclist just to tell her that her red light was too low behind the back wheel and invisible to anyone who wasn't over/under/taking. I had been there for enough time to say the words "Your light in invisible behind you and to the left, you need to... &lt;BEEPBEEP&gt; SHUT UP ...move it bye now"...<br /> He then passed me and slowed down so I was right alongside him for half the distance between (Saxe Coburg St - Perth St) making his point I am not sure but regardless - I caught him at the lights at Brandon St and waved as I passed him to make my point that <em>I was back in front</em><br /> Later met the sam cyclist lady and had a nice wee chat as she was new to commuting and had no idea about the lights or other kit to get. Getting a new bike soon anyway as suspension and knobbly tyres not the best on the roads. Told her about the site - if you're reading this "Hello" :) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45934 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 12:20:41 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 45934@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I parked in the NCP on Castle Terrace the other night - forgot how ridiculously expensive it is! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45931 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 12:05:46 +0000 wingpig 45931@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>...brought to you in association with NCP and the City of Edinburgh Council Parking Revenues Department... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45918 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 11:28:33 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 45918@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Yip, that was the plan. Forst mooted a couple of years ago - actually got some mild interest from BBC Breakfast about covering it (think I've still got the contact somewhere). Need to pitch it somehow so that people WILL take it up.</p> <p>Window stickers and the like saying "I'd usually be on a bike/bus/walking", that kind of thing. Needs publicity for people to realise that is why the traffic is busier than usual. And make people realise that 'traffic' is volume of 'cars' - a very tangible effect of there being less people on bikes and more in a cage (as well as making it clear that most cyclists do actually have the option, but don't take the car by <em>choice</em>). </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45911 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 11:17:08 +0000 crowriver 45911@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>National Take Your Car To Work Day</em></p> <p>Nobody would get to work as they would be stuck in one huge traffic jam all day. That might open a few eyes! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45903 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 10:58:38 +0000 recombodna 45903@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>National take your car to work day??? GENIUS!!! For one day get everybody to do everything by car. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45893 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 10:21:12 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 45893@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Ah no, I mistakenly wrote a thing in the last citycycling about the fact I am <em>not</em> traffic... ;) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45889 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 10:17:25 +0000 thebikechain 45889@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>You can't get in the way of traffic... you are traffic! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45888 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 10:17:16 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 45888@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"<em>Sad, selfish, stupid, and unfortunately very hard to change :-(</em>"</p> <p>Yep, I'm already over it! ;)</p> <p>Although I do like crowriver's idea - in a similar vein I think I'm finally going to roll out my idea next year for National Take Your Car To Work Day. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45886 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 10:15:27 +0000 crowriver 45886@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Maybe we should have a national 'Getting in the way of motorists on purpose' day. Just get in folk's way, on purpose, all day. We'll see how they like that!</p> <p>Then, the following day when we're all cycling normally, a few may realise that, hey, we <em>weren't</em> doing it on purpose except for that one day... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45885 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 10:14:27 +0000 Smudge 45885@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>It's no help, but I'd lay a pound to a penny he behaves just the same way towards any vehicle that he <em>feels</em> is holding him up.</p> <p>Unfortunately passing the assessment which decides whether or not a learner driver may be trusted to continue learning unsupervised does not make a driver, as evidenced daily on our roads by people who have no interest in anything or anyone outside their cabin until they think they are being in some way inconvenienced.<br /> Sad, selfish, stupid, and unfortunately very hard to change :-( </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=4359#post-45882 Wed, 09 Nov 2011 09:52:56 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 45882@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>So this morning I reach the top of the Royal Mile (well, almost, I wasn't going to the castle). Turning left to Johnstone Terrace. The cobble surface is <em>awful</em> at that point so I'm a little out. I make the left about mid-lane - there's a pedestrian island narrowing the road, so nothing can go past if I'm left anyway. I can <em>feel</em> the van behind me. </p> <p>The right sweep is off-camber, with a terrible road surface, and at least one manhole cover to boot. Oh, and there are parked cars ahead. I stay mid-lane. Van accelerates, passes quite closely, I turn and the driver has both hands off the wheel shouting and indicating I should be left. I point at the parked cars in disgust. He cuts me up.</p> <p>He's in sight all the way down, and up to Bread Street. I get held up slightly by traffic, but head to East Fountabridge (Breadt Street is closed in the contraflow direction at the moment). He's there, at the red light at the junction with Lothian Road (<em>not</em> in the ASL remarkably, though two cyclists are). Window is down.</p> <p>I lean back to see if he's looking, he leans out, "It's not worth arguing about mate."</p> <p>"I'm not going to argue, but it's just there were parked cars so I was staying out for them."</p> <p>"Aye, but you were in the middle all onto Johnstone Terrace, you were doing it on purpose."</p> <p>I try to explain about the road surface and the parked cars, but his mind is closed. I'm getting in his way 'on purpose'.</p> <p>Anyway, lights go green, he passes very close to one cyclist while still having a go at me, then completely cuts up the other cyclist to go through the road narrowing ahead as I turn right into Semple Street.</p> <p>Seriously, how did we come to the point where cyclists are viewed as actually deliberately <em>trying</em> to get in the way of traffic? I don't know anyone (save for critical mass) who does it <em>in order to</em> hold people up and make their life difficult. For safety reasons mebbes, but for kicks? That would be frankly insane on our part given how squishy we are if hit. Frustrating, too, that they can't see <em>why</em> I was riding where I was...</p> <p>Argh! Grr! etc etc etc </p>