http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: In the Fast Lane? en Wed, 13 May 2026 03:42:05 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-61479 Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:40:17 +0000 AKen 61479@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I've <em>tried</em> cycling home gently and unhurriedly in a manner that would not raise a sweat. The prospect of pootling along gently enjoying the birdsong and the flowers seems appealing but, no matter what I do, Edinburgh has these things called hills. I have to climb plenty of them to get home and it's hard work doing it - so I might as well take a good run at it. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-61472 Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:29:53 +0000 Dave 61472@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I like it when (which is most of the time) the people you passed stay at your rear hub in deference. I don't really care if I have to overtake again, but it's nice not to have to.</p> <p>I'd really like to make a video highlighting the difference between riding fast and slow. Speaking of which - isn't it about time for the annual "slow rider empathy week"? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-61466 Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:19:59 +0000 Uberuce 61466@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I was thinking about this since I have for the last three days overtaken another cyclists only to be caught up by them at subsequent lights. Hoisted by my own petard, I thought in reference to Uberuce, since he does take such smug delight in, gaily joined by the sisterhood of crimson lights and sienna paint, sylphing past any drivers who have thundered forth on his starboard side just scant heartbeats ago, but are now hemmed in, straining and confined as a behemoth on the Ark.</p> <p>I know, I know, there is a big ol' timey difference in that I am honing the claws and beak of my haemoglobins so as to swoop down on the bunnies of oxygen with dread efficiency, and they're just hosing money out like an over-watered horse, but still. Makes me go: ah well. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55836 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 15:12:34 +0000 Arellcat 55836@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>...the nature of cycling in Edinburgh is just different.</em></p> <p>From the Avid Cyclists riposte that was in .cc #59 a while back:</p> <p>"<br /> Right now we have to share the road more than do the cyclists in the Enlightened World. We need speed more than they do, or at least we think we do. We have more terrain to deal with. We have to spend more time saving our own lives because the majority is allowed to act more dangerously. We don't, as yet, have the ability to collectively slow down on the road and work together. Universal promotion of flowers and dress trousers and bicycle clips and leather bags isn't going to work straight away. The idealology is perfect, but it needs fine-tuned. The 'edinburghchic' cyclists already look slightly different from 'londonchic'. It gets colder here, it snows more, and the roads are made of holes. We don't have much in the way of underground transport. We like mudguards and bigger tyres, and springy saddles. A lot like continental bikes then, but all ridden with tensed shoulders and hair trigger eyes.<br /> "</p> <p><em>...get that bike made from old drainpipes so I can't ride fast anyway.</em></p> <p>I'm sure Nick would have kittens if his Paper Bicycle was described as such, but you should check out Laid Back's new one. It has eight gears and a Brooks! I've never ridden such a relaxed, flowers-and-tweed-inspiring bike. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55824 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:57:53 +0000 Min 55824@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>"And this is the core problem I have with the 'you can ride slowly' argument, or more accurately with those proponents of such arguments who go beyond 'you can choose' and stray into 'if you don't choose then you're creating the wrong impression about cycling and damaging the efforts of those trying to make things better' evangelism."</em></p> <p>Well indeed and I can't help thinking that, again, cycling is made out to be different from everything else in that respect by the very people who try to claim it isn't. Why do people say they can't cycle because they are not Chris Hoy but fill the tennis courts every summer despite not being Andy Murray? </p> <p><em>Because it's not us going fast that's putting them off!</em> Stick a few private hire cabs in the tennis courts and they'll be deserted. Deserted I tell ye. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55822 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:47:38 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 55822@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Depends on if there would also be a 'green wave' implemented, where riding at a constant speed (something like 13mph) means you get green lights all the way. Riding at 20mph everywhere you'd be stopping all the time and caught up by the pootlers.</p> <p>But again that just highlights the difference between the cycling culture, and the fact that infrastructure (and political will) is probably more important than anything else. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55820 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:45:49 +0000 Instography 55820@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I've often thought that if there was an integrated network of cycling paths, I'd still be commuting on the road at 20mph. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55819 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:45:21 +0000 Min 55819@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>My plan, for when we get Copenhagen/Dutch style infrastructure is to get that bike made from old drainpipes so I can't ride fast anyway and so won't feel any frustration. However, <em>if</em> it ever happens, I will probably be so old I won't need one. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55818 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:39:40 +0000 Morningsider 55818@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>There's lots to be said for pootling, but not on the commute. Why would I want to spend any longer than necessary getting too and from work? One of the reasons I cycle is the fact it is quicker than any other mode, shaving valuable minutes of my working day.</p> <p>Also agree with Min - I feel keeping up a reasonable pace on the road is an important aspect of safety. </p> <p>One of my criticisms of the fetishisation of Copenhagen et al is that without the infrastructuire, the nature of cycling in Edinburgh is just different. It's faster, more aggressive and needs bikes, clothes and cyclists to match. Despite all the moaning I do about Edinburgh traffic, infrastructure etc. - I do love cycling here. While I want to see many more people cycling, I would probably hate commuting in Copenhagen - as I would be stuck behind people on bikes that appear to be made from old drainpipes wearing vintage fishermen's jackets. Where's the fun in that! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55816 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:33:01 +0000 Instography 55816@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Aside from the fun of going fast, I tend to think that on the road, faster is safer. On paths, slower is probably safer and certainly more sociable. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55814 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:18:31 +0000 Nelly 55814@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>My son was being picked up for a kids party at the DAvid Lloyd on Glasgow Road yesterday.</p> <p>The (very nice and occasional cyclist) mother doing the pick up had scheduled 45 minutes in the car from mine, baased on the time it takes her to drive to Riccarton.</p> <p>I told her I <strong>cycle</strong> to edinburgh park (very similar journey)in 30 minutes or less and she looked a wee bit incredulous.</p> <p>Back on original topic - Agree entirely anth, I see my commute home as a cheap workout, hit the hills pretty hard, and arrive home with a bit of a sweat up - I could experiment with low speed, but use the SS day to day and its not really designed to pootle up hills. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55813 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:16:05 +0000 Min 55813@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>It is not really much of a choice if your commute involves riding on roads IMO. I went on about this at great length before I got my Surly and was riding the folder every day but this "slow" bike increased driver aggro exponentially. I like riding the folder, I like the upright position and the ease of being able to ride with any clothes (chain guard) but it is just too stressful for me to want to do it every day.</p> <p>Now with the sporty bike I ride fast on the road and loaf on the off road bits. Best of both worlds. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55810 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:07:14 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 55810@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>p.s. it also requires getting pretty much every single light at green, and no traffic stopping me at junctions (only 2 of those, a lot more lights). </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55809 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:05:02 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 55809@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Clock time - slightly shorter route home (about 4 miles, just over I think). Virtually no uphill, and it's less than a 20mph average. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55807 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 11:49:11 +0000 cb 55807@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"Is thirteen minutes wheel-time or clock-time? "</p> <p>5 miles. Wheel-time. Must be! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55806 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 11:43:10 +0000 Cyclingmollie 55806@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I particularly like your point about the difference between having a choice and having to make a choice. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55801 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:42:33 +0000 wingpig 55801@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>It doesn't work for re-adding people who have accidentally unsubscribed from discussions but I thought it might for adding people who weren't in it. It was only a copy of the text file but with additional typo-spotting posts beneath. I'll email you a corrected text file this evening. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55800 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:39:11 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 55800@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Thinking a few ideas out loud to tie in with your clothing article (speaking of which, I got a notification of being added to a discussion on the final version, but the link just doesn't take me anywhere - very odd).</p> <p>Citycycling probably online on Friday, but I'm not making any promises. Simply haven't been able to do anything the past week due to a variety of circumstances. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55799 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:36:00 +0000 wingpig 55799@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><blockquote><em>"...though I'm not sure I'd ride the distance in a suit every day..."</em></blockquote></p> <p>Quite.</p> <p>Is thirteen minutes wheel-time or clock-time? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=5222#post-55796 Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:28:09 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 55796@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"Speed has long been a fascination for the human race. Foot races of the Olympian Greeks gave way to mechanical aid and from there speed has become an aim in itself. We've come a long way from an early railway belief that the human body could not stand speeds in excess of 20mph. It tallies with our modern world of instant access and demand for immediate gratification. And the bicycle has not escaped this encroaching desire: from club time trials to the Tour de France; from track sprinting to beating the lights. Stamp on those pedals and get fast.</p> <p>A more common refrain towards the commuting cyclist, however, which ties in with 'you don't need specialist equipment to ride a bike' is 'you don't need to ride quickly'. The benefits stack up. You get less sweaty, if at all (meaning you can wear 'normal' clothes); you can take in your surroundings; you can ride a more comfortable bike. It all fits with the idealised view of a cycling culture which embraces and encourages cycling, and which sees the citizen cyclist thrust to the fore.</p> <p>But here's my single, personal, overriding issue with the theory... I <em>enjoy</em> cycling quickly to and from work. There are a number of reasons for this. It gets the endorphins not so much flowing as raging through my body, meaning I arrive at work alert, or back home de-stressed. I manage to forego a gym membership knowing the various routes to work can give me warm up, sprint, climb, cool down. I travel 5 miles of mainly uphill in the morning, slowing down to avoid perspiration takes [x] minutes longer [to be ridden and verified] than the normal ride (which is about 20 minutes), negating the time gain in not having to change once at the office (though I'm not sure I'd ride the distance in a suit every day, and especially all weathers). I can get home in 13 minutes with a slightly shorter, mainly downhill, route. <em>13 minutes</em>, mention that to car-driving colleagues and the incredulity spreads across their faces. Who wouldn't want to get home more quickly after a rough day in the office?</p> <p>In short, I don't ride quickly to work because I feel I have to; or because I'm seeking to perpetuate a fallacy that cycling is difficult, or sport, or testosterone-fuelled. I ride quickly (being a relative term of course) because it's so much damned good <em>fun</em>.</p> <p>And this is the core problem I have with the 'you can ride slowly' argument, or more accurately with those proponents of such arguments who go beyond 'you can choose' and stray into 'if you don't <em>choose</em> then you're creating the wrong impression about cycling and damaging the efforts of those trying to make things better' evangelism.</p> <p><em>Choice</em> is meaningless if you tell people which choice they <em>should</em> make to fit in with your own preconceived notions. I say everyone does indeed have a choice, but it's not a choice between speeds (or bikes or clothes), it's a choice to have fun. And for everyone that choice will lead to different styles or riding. Each is valid; and each is good because a smile is a smile, and when it's on a bike that makes cycling look like it might be enjoyable." </p>