CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues

CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues en Sun, 31 May 2026 21:42:32 +0000 bluejeangirl on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66451 Sat, 21 Apr 2012 13:31:52 +0000 bluejeangirl 66451@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ By adjustments I mean having to cycle more defensivly, and be constantly aware of what other people are doing and as Kirst says, taking avoiding action. I used to be able to cycle into town in the borders and not meet a single car/van/lorry! The thing is though, people say "it's so dangerous out there, I'd never cycle," not "how can I make my driving safer for you?" Saying this to the next person who say cycling is dangerous! SRD on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66405 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 22:54:32 +0000 SRD 66405@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Yeah, I totally support all the infrastructure stuff, and I think it makes a difference but for me the big day-to-day issue is driver attitude. Tom on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66402 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 22:51:40 +0000 Tom 66402@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Kirst: "The thing is though, people say "it's so dangerous out there, I'd never cycle," not "how can I make my driving safer for you?" " Too true. I also think it implies that if they cycled they wouldn't want to encounter someone who drives the way they drive. Or perhaps cyclists are really a massive vote of confidence in the abilities of motorists. Kirst on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66398 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 22:24:38 +0000 Kirst 66398@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I wouldn't have started cycling if off-road routes hadn't been an option. It is scary out there sometimes, and some days I avoid squishy death because I take avoiding action rather than because the motorists around me are driving the way they should. The thing is though, people say "it's so dangerous out there, I'd never cycle," not "how can I make my driving safer for you?" chdot on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66386 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 20:28:00 +0000 chdot 66386@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ "having confidence is key" Well said (and well done for being wise/brave/confident/or?) "there are some adjustments to be made in the way I cycle" Could you expand on that? chdot on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66385 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 20:23:16 +0000 chdot 66385@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ "In my opinion, a great report into the psychology" I'm happy to take your word for it. Clearly it's written for people who understand this sort of thing - "One approach to thinking about behaviour is the so-called expectancy-value theories, of which the rational choice model provides a classical economic theory of behaviour. The basic principle of the rational choice model is that individuals make rational decisions that will optimise their own personal outcomes. The rational choice model has been criticised for its simplicity and over-reliance on the individual as a decision- making unit." bluejeangirl on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66384 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 20:21:28 +0000 bluejeangirl 66384@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ I would say the female aspect does make a difference(although I wish it didn't), when I tell people I cycle to work I gets looks of shock from girls (and the usual 'but it's so dangerous!') and looks of approval from men...for my bravery? I'm not sure...I just do it because I love cycling! Being quite new to cycling in the city, there are some adjustments to be made in the way I cycle but having confidence is key. Morningsider on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66378 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 19:56:25 +0000 Morningsider 66378@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ If you are interested in this topic then you might want to read the following report produced by Steer Davies Gleave for Cycling Scotland: <a href="http://cyclingactionplanforscotland.com/Uploads/1281438792_Background_research_report_v2.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://cyclingactionplanforscotland.com/Uploads/1281438792_Background_research_report_v2.pdf</a> In my opinion, a great report into the psychology behind getting people to cycle and outlining what has been done in areas where cycling rates are high to get to that level of cycling. Uberuce on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66377 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 19:51:29 +0000 Uberuce 66377@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ For me the carrot was the approval of a young lady, but without the almost completely off-road route that exists between my flat and my morning job at the Gyle, I don't know if I'd have taken it up. The route from my flat to afternoon job is 8 minutes on the bike along quiet residential roads, but since I was using the buses I didn't have time to get home, so I wouldn't have used that confidence building journey anyway. The Union Canal was in effect my stabilisers; it took a month or two before my confidence outgrew my impatience with the extra distance and slower speed of the towpath, but it was still some months until I felt competent enough to enter the bear pit of central Edinburgh outside of witching hours. Looking back, it really would have been dangerous for me to cycle rush hour from day one. I started out thinking that you had to be in the ASZ; not being able to recognise a boy-racer or frustrated Beamerer by the sound of their gear changes and revs alone; not knowing what primary is, and why it wins; not knowing the light sequence of every junction I use; not knowing what primary is, and why it wins; not checking through the back window of every car for head silhouettes in case of dooring; not knowing what primary is, and why it wins; not shoulderchecking like an amphetamine-laced OCD sufferer; not knowing what primary is, and why it wins; not knowing that large left-turners have a nae-kidding kill box all down their port side; not knowing what primary is, and why it wins; not knowing to wait until the driver behind has seen your signal before changing lanes; and last but not least, not knowing what primary is, and why it wins. cc on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66374 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 18:47:52 +0000 cc 66374@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Yes. David Hembrow has written a lot about <a href="http://www.aviewfromthecyclepath.com/2008/09/three-types-of-safety.html">subjective safety</a>, it's well worth a read. Wilmington's Cow on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66371 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 17:14:26 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 66371@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ In order... Yes; Mainly; Don't think so; 2 of them usually; All have licences but walk or bus to work. It's not that they're not interested. One cycles, but only one route, that keeps her completely off roads. Not the 'bad experience' because they've never really done it; and not really the lack of support. The roads are dangerous, they want to be able to cycle away from them. SRD on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66369 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 17:09:49 +0000 SRD 66369@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ are they otherwise sporty? environmentally concerned? do they have parents or siblings or friends who cycle? do they take the bus? or drive? some proportion of the population is just never going to be interested. the ones we want to target are the ones who would like to, or might consider it, but have a bad experience, or not enough support to quite try it. Wilmington's Cow on "Discussion on Cycling with 3 Colleagues" http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=6211#post-66365 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 16:52:44 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 66365@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ Chat with three younger, female (if either poitns are relevant?) colleagues as we were chatting and I brought up PoP. Red lights and pavement cycling came up. As did the cyclist who killed a young girl a couple of years back (with an admission that drivers obviously kill a lot more, and that it turns out she had believed all the Daily Wail coverage of the story). But. Also. Cycling provision in Edinburgh is awful. One thought whenever she sees someone cycling on the road that they're 'brave'. None would even consider cycling in Edinburgh because it is 'too dangerous'. This is quite simply what people think. It does no good saying to them "But it's not dangerous" and if it was that easy then we wouldn't be having PoP at all. I've come round to the thinking that while I personally don't think it's dangerous, that's because I've got the experience and been doing it long enough for it to be 'normal' for me. Infrastructure and driving habits have to change before the total non-cyclist can be brought on board...