http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Edinburgh traffic not really that bad... en Mon, 18 May 2026 16:46:37 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85628 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 15:11:58 +0000 fimm 85628@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Ah, true. We can't all have the delightful weather we in Scotland are experiencing right now... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85626 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 15:01:21 +0000 AKen 85626@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>An 18km cycle through the smog and sub-tropical heat of South America's largest city could be quite unpleasant, I reckon. On the other hand, if it was cutting an hour off your commute each way then it might be more appealing and, for a lucrative sideline (as Min points out above), you'd be able to rob all the car drivers on the way home with no fear of pursuit. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85623 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 14:36:43 +0000 steveo 85623@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>The article mentions the crime rate but surely all of those captive car drivers are more of a target? </em></p> <p>Maybe but we know how insular cars can make people. People probably <em>feel</em> safer inside their car than they would walking. Although 36km would be a bit of a hike, eminently ridable of course. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85621 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 14:27:23 +0000 cb 85621@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"How far to we reckon the woman in the article is driving? 6, 7 miles each way? Very cyclable if so."</p> <p>I reckon about 18km each way:</p> <p><a href="http://goo.gl/maps/EIRt4">http://goo.gl/maps/EIRt4</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85619 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 14:14:45 +0000 Min 85619@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>The article mentions the crime rate but surely all of those captive car drivers are more of a target? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85618 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 14:12:29 +0000 steveo 85618@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>More danger of being mugged, stabbed or shot in Sao Paulo. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85614 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 14:06:30 +0000 Min 85614@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>You are probably not in much danger from the vehilces since they aren't moving but the pollution would be extremely unpleasant. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85613 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 14:03:03 +0000 fimm 85613@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>That article closes with "Tell us your stories of commuting through heavy traffic, using the form below. A selection will be published." Time for someone to post Magnatom's video of filtering through masses of cars? Plus lots of other smug cyclists...</p> <p>How far to we reckon the woman in the article is driving? 6, 7 miles each way? Very cyclable if so. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85596 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 12:35:57 +0000 crowriver 85596@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>There's also this from ten years ago:</p> <p><em>The transport situation in Edinburgh<br /> Transportation is probably one of the highest profile issues in Edinburgh at present. It has an impact on the city’s economy, society, environment and quality of life and on the health, safety and prosperity of all those who live, visit and work in and around the city.</p> <p>Over the past 20 years, growth in car ownership and car use has caused traffic levels on some of the main city roads to increase by up to 60%. In Edinburgh and the central belt of Scotland, over a 10-year period, car ownership levels have risen by 57%, compared with a national growth rate of only 29%. This increase has, in turn, caused significant increases in traffic congestion, parking problems and air pollution at key city locations.</p> <p>Transport routes, particularly roads, radiate in towards the city centre, which acts as a transport hub. An outer by-pass circles the east, south and western boundaries of the city, but there is neither a northern by-pass nor a recognised inner ring road for vehicular traffic. In turn the central area is coming under considerable pressure from cars, lorries and buses, many of which are entering the central area unnecessarily as part of through journeys.</p> <p>City residents, businesses, and visitors suffer as a consequence and, if not brought under control, the recent economic success and the physical attractiveness of the city could be compromised. There is simply not enough space, in Edinburgh, for everyone who wants to travel by car and park at their desired destination. It is essential that the limited space available is prioritised and that everyone who lives, visits, or works in Edinburgh is able to travel within, as well as to and from the city, quickly, cheaply, and safely.</p> <p>The resolution of the many issues relating to transport and traffic in the city is probably the biggest challenge facing the City of Edinburgh Council. It is essential that all that is best in the city’s heritage, townscape, and setting is conserved for the benefit of this and future generations. The challenge is for the city to adapt to ensure that it remains successful. Change can be introduced in a way that is consistent with and sensitive to the city’s heritage, and in a way that will enhance the quality of the city’s environment. The Local Transport Strategy, adopted by the Council in October 2000, recognises those challenges and proposes a plan that could instigate the necessary change.</em></p> <p><a href="http://www.progress-project.org/Progress/edin.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.progress-project.org/Progress/edin.html</a></p> <p>One of the 'solutions' in the LTS was.....a three line tram network, and (much further down the list of priorities) a "city-wide cycle route network". </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85595 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 12:31:37 +0000 crowriver 85595@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Oh yes, and "non-car ownership" is an officially approved measure of so-called "multiple deprivation" (used in the Census).</p> <p><a href="http://cdu.mimas.ac.uk/related/deprivation.htm" rel="nofollow">http://cdu.mimas.ac.uk/related/deprivation.htm</a></p> <p>So, if the government officials believe not owning a car = deprived, we can't be surprised if most other folk think so too. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85588 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 11:45:33 +0000 Min 85588@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>"No city in the world will ever manage to end congestion because when traffic flows, people are drawn to their cars. The key is to find a balance, the point at which it is worthwhile for commuters to use public transport because it's faster then driving," he says. </p> <p>"That way Sao Paulo needs urgently to invest more in public transport instead of building new roads and expressways that will only be filled up with more cars."</p> <p></em></p> <p>Genius bit of insight there.. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85587 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 11:43:35 +0000 crowriver 85587@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>I wonder if this lead to car ownership not necessarily being a priority in Edinbugh even when it seemed that was all that really mattered in other parts of the country.</em></p> <p>I remember various statistics being bandied around in the 1990s that Edinburgh had one of the highest car ownership rates in the UK per head of population*. That <em>despite</em> it being an eminently walkable/cyclable city. Maybe things have changed since then, but I somehow doubt it, the rest of the country has just caught up/taken over...</p> <p><em>Maybe my experiences are a little skewed as my Mum has never driven so I grew up getting the bus and walking around place</em></p> <p>Possibly. I can't think of anyone in my family except myself who does not own a car.</p> <p>* - this was often cited as evidence of Edinburgh's prosperous professional classes. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85584 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 11:33:25 +0000 kaputnik 85584@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>5 lanes of solid traffic each direction. A point in case for "if you build the road, they will fill it with cars".</p> <p>Just one lane-width for a cycle lane... If only. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85570 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 10:43:13 +0000 steveo 85570@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I often wonder how unusual Edinburgh is. Even for the UK the public transport is adequate at worst and the traffic really is never <em>that </em>bad. Coupled with the inner couple of miles being mostly very high density housing and that its a very compact city meaning that even when cycling was in a trough walking was always considered normal. I wonder if this lead to car ownership not necessarily being a priority in Edinbugh even when it seemed that was all that really mattered in other parts of the country.</p> <p>Maybe my experiences are a little skewed as my Mum has never driven so I grew up getting the bus and walking around place, well once we moved back from Penicuik. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85568 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 10:30:16 +0000 chdot 85568@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"<br /> The price of demonstrating you are middle class I suppose.</p> <p>This phenomenon seems to be on the wane in the UK.</p> <p>"</p> <p>I think this forum is some proof of that. </p> <p>People here may or may not own cars, (and may or may not consider themselves to be middle class), but (I suspect) most don't have to worry about 'what other people think' because cycling to work is a new norm - at least in Edinburgh. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85566 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 10:18:19 +0000 steveo 85566@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>At some point it must be quicker to walk no matter how far you've got to go. The price of demonstrating you are middle class I suppose. </p> <p>This phenomenon seems to be on the wane in the UK. I wonder how much of bell curve the car ownership = not poor relationship describes over the long term. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85556 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 09:57:40 +0000 chdot 85556@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"<br /> drivers endure an exasperating stop-and-go journey, which can continue for hours.</p> <p>"</p> <p>Is this a definition of insanity? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=8507#post-85550 Tue, 25 Sep 2012 09:47:12 +0000 steveo 85550@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Next time you complain about being stuck in traffic, spare a thought for the drivers in Brazil's biggest city, which has some of the worst congestion problems in the world.</p> <p>Friday evenings are a commuter's worst nightmare in Sao Paulo.</p> <p>That's when all the tailbacks in and out of the city extend for a total of 180km (112 miles), on average, according to local traffic engineers, and as long as 295km (183 miles) on a really bad day.</p> <p>Red brake lights stretch as far back as the eye can see, blinking repeatedly as drivers endure an exasperating stop-and-go journey, which can continue for hours.<br /> </em><br /> <a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19660765" rel="nofollow">http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19660765</a> </p>