http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: Dog strike! en Fri, 22 May 2026 01:40:59 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103220 Thu, 07 Mar 2013 11:41:46 +0000 ruggtomcat 103220@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>TBH If id seen the dog get up and the owner was nearby I would have kept going too, unless I was really in the mood for an argument. Its all very well saying you'd stop out of compassion but it wouldn't actually do anything (especially if you believe its the owners fault).</p> <p>I might well have said 'Sorry' tho. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103214 Thu, 07 Mar 2013 11:24:28 +0000 lionfish 103214@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Dave, interesting point you've raised: Whether we stop seems to depend a bit on whether the animal is someone's pet!</p> <p>minimoth is the only person I know who's killed a vertebrate by hitting it with their bike: She cycled straight over the top of a pigeon. Killed it immediately. She did stop, but wasn't sure what to do with the corpse... A cyclist coming up behind discussed the situation and he kicked it under a bush by the path. minimoth arrived at work covered in feathers :)</p> <p>Not sure what this story adds to the discussion... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103185 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 22:52:52 +0000 gembo 103185@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Sounds like a black lab I know called bramble. Bramble's owner likes to balance a bone shaped biscuit on the dog's nose then shout eat and bramble flicks it up then catches it and scoffs it. She also gets bramble to 'speak' by gently cuffing it one on the jaw and saying speak, bramble then says ruff. It is a sheer genius dog.</p> <p>I did once connect with a child due to her running right in front of me when her parents were sorting out their methadone. I had braked as hard as Imcould but the wheel did bump her, she didn't fall over I was very apologetic, dad went mental, he took my name and address (he was going nuts and I thought this would placate him, also didn't give him my real name or address) only finally legged it when a passerby suggested she would phone the polis on him. You don't want to go hitting children with yr bikes. I think the same scenario could have ensued if it was the guy's dog rather than his child. You don't want tomgomhitting people's beloved pets </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103182 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 22:38:56 +0000 Rabid Hamster 103182@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Watched a dog (black lab) use the pedestrian crossing (on green man) outside Morrison's supermarket Gilmerton Road yesterday! Unfortunately missed seeing the bit where it pressed the button, but it did trot up the inside of the pavement after crossing. No owner anywhere, and I think it was heading up to the bookies to place a stub on some nag at Chepstow! </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103180 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 21:58:02 +0000 Bigjack 103180@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Some cyclists do go too fast on shared paths but some dogists(my name for irresponsible dog_owners)are also a bit stupid with regard to dog control.I have had to say to more than one dogist that<br /> mutual consideration is the name of the game. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103178 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 21:52:29 +0000 Dave 103178@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Actually, using your child analogy (and I realise that for most people a dog is not equivalent of a child and therefore not worthy of compassion); if parent had been on the path with their toddler that wandered straight across your path and you had 'run over' the toddler, but saw it getting back up in a 'glance' over your shoulder - clearly the parents are muppets, but would you stop to make sure the child was okay, or keep cycling?</em></p> <p>Although I like to think I am not without compassion for dogs (cats, sheep, or rabbits), I think it's a safe bet that my response would be different if a person stepped out in front of me than any of the above - whether I was motoring along a country lane or riding through town / NEPN.</p> <p>This topic has made me wonder whether I am perhaps over callous though. If I hit any of the aforementioned animals in the car, I honestly think it's unlikely I'd stop (especially not if it got up, but even if it didn't), stick the hazards on and walk back to do... something. </p> <p>I did once run over and presumably killed a bunny while cycling at night. I left that too (assumed dead, motionless). The night before PBP, an omen?</p> <p>This is sort of by-the-by, but it is interesting. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103177 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 21:40:06 +0000 Baldcyclist 103177@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I still think that people cycle too fast on shared use paths (I'm not saying you were going too fast, would like to see vid to judge, and you do seem to have had a number of canine run ins...), but an important factor in some collisions is the speed differential between different users.</p> <p>I believe that cyclists should cycle at no more than 15mph on shared use paths, any faster then in my opinion you belong on the infrastructure designed for fast moving.vehicles. I constantly see cyclists flying past me on the NEPN with little or no thought for other path users. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103173 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 21:20:37 +0000 neddie 103173@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I think if you hit a dog or a farm animal (whether you are bicycle or car), you are required to stop, right?</p> <p>Cats of course don't count :( </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103172 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 21:14:48 +0000 Bigjack 103172@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Interesting one. I'm glad Dave was ok after the collision. I've once been knocked off on the NEN path thanks to a human running ahead of his black dog- off lead of course(winter darkness resulting in the dog not becoming visible in the beam of my dynamo-powered headlight until too late - icy conditions too- the owner didn't stop to ask how I was far less apologise!)As I use the shared paths daily I'm well aware of the problems regularly encountered with loose dogs and owners who couldn't give a ****.I've had numerous altercations with that minority of irresponsible dog-owners who don't understand that the path is shared and not just a dog-toilet. The worst are those who ignore audible warnings and then claim I'm going too fast if the dog inevitably gets in the way and I have to slam on the brakes to avoid hitting it.(I do slow down when there's a loose dog or obvious dog-walker about) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103165 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 19:40:33 +0000 minus six 103165@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Perfectly possible to control a dog effectively via verbal command.</em></p> <p>I don't doubt that it is possible.</p> <p>My point was that it would be nonsense if the highway code said it was ok for the dog owner to make that call, on a path legally shared with cyclists. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103162 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 19:20:43 +0000 BenN 103162@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Odd question, but I seem to remember reading that the NEPN IS classed as a public highway, albeit one that motorised vehicles are banned from? (Something to do with maintenance arrangements or ownership of the surface).</p> <p>To add credence to this, I have twice seen police at the five ways during various cycling events telling dog owners off for not having a lead attached. Last time I listened in to someone arguing that cyclist should slow down and that dog owners should not be punished the police told them that the 'law' said they had to be on a lead on this path?</p> <p>I was thinking about this the other day actually, and decided that if I hit a dog whilst cycling home on the NEPN I would stop to exchange details with the owner, simply so that I could pursue them later for any repairs. (Would probably have to say something along the lines of 'in case there are any costs' - letting them think I am talking about the vet rather than MY bike in order to get the details!) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103159 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:51:30 +0000 wee folding bike 103159@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>amber pedal reflectors is one of the 'musts'...</em></p> <p>Dang, Longstaff and road bike need new pedals then.</p> <p>Longstaff would be easy enough, road bike has Look clipless. I'm not planning to use it until the brakes work. It has 1990 Campag CdA Deltas. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103158 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:44:28 +0000 Darkerside 103158@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>By contrast, the requirement to have amber pedal reflectors is one of the 'musts'... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103157 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:43:24 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 103157@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"<em>No mention of it being ok not to bother, if you think you have sufficient control via verbal command.</p> <p>Which is understandable, because it would be nonsense.</em>"</p> <p>Perfectly possible to control a dog effectively via verbal command. I'd recommend One Man and his Dog for the creme de la creme of examples - but as mentioned above, I grew up with a dog that didn't disobey a single word. Of course cycling round such dogs you don't <em>know</em> that that's the case, but there's a lady walks a couple of dogs on the Innocent quite regularly, one on the lead, one off - reasonably safe to assume she understands therefore that one dog needs that extra bit of control that the other doesn't. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103156 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:40:51 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 103156@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>o_0 - it's good guidance, but it's not law (not a MUST with the relevant legislation marked afterwards - so a bit like the cycling guidance to 'use cycle paths where practicable', or 'wear a helmet', or 'wear bright clothing', or pedestrian guidance to 'wait for a green man to cross'). </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103154 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:36:58 +0000 minus six 103154@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@lezzles</p> <p>Your Kennel Club link was a bit vague.</p> <p>This seems failry unambiguous to me:</p> <p>Highway Code Rule 56</p> <p>Do not let a dog out on the road on its own. <strong>Keep it on a short lead when walking on the pavement, road or path shared with cyclists</strong></p> <p><a href="https://www.gov.uk/rules-about-animals-47-to-58/other-animals-56-to-58" rel="nofollow">https://www.gov.uk/rules-about-animals-47-to-58/other-animals-56-to-58</a></p> <p>No mention of it being ok not to bother, if you think you have sufficient control via verbal command.</p> <p>Which is understandable, because it would be nonsense. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103153 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:30:58 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 103153@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Dave, have never said dogs should be allowed to run wild (though to counter the 'dog isn't under control vocally' point, the border collie I grew up with would stop instantly and lie down with one word and remain there frozen until told otherwise).</p> <p>Dogs should be under control where they could injure anyone, be they tiny toddling children, or full-grown adult cyclists.</p> <p>Cyclists in turn should be courteous. Try not to hit dogs in the first instance by slowing down, and where that's rendered impossible by a poor owner (not the dog) then, and perhaps I'm simply too polite, common courtesy has me stopping to make sure the dog is alright (regardless of whether I'm a trained vet or not).</p> <p>Actually, using your child analogy (and I realise that for most people a dog is not equivalent of a child and therefore not worthy of compassion); if parent had been on the path with their toddler that wandered straight across your path and you had 'run over' the toddler, but saw it getting back up in a 'glance' over your shoulder - clearly the parents are muppets, but would you stop to make sure the child was okay, or keep cycling?</p> <p>PS, I'd agree with you. But in Dave's tale the dog was 'run over' and 'tumbled to the side'. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103152 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:30:43 +0000 Darkerside 103152@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I have stopped for a bumble bee, but only because it caught me a solid blow betwixt the eyes and I was slightly dazed.</p> <p>As others have said, we can all contrive scenarios where sympathy obviously falls on various sides. What about the poor little old lady whose last companion on this earth is the now severely stunned hound that pulled free of her hand when it caught sight of a squirrel?</p> <p>All we can say is that in the case you describe, a number of us would have stopped. I'd have probably felt somewhat at fault and apologised. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103150 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:20:39 +0000 PS 103150@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I'm never going to stop for an insect, though. Scum. Except dragonflies. And bumble bees. And butterflies and moths... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103149 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:18:21 +0000 PS 103149@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I think one's reaction to all these incidents very much depends on the specific circumstances. </p> <p>If I had delivered a glancing blow at a relatively low speed to a solid dog that scampered off with nary of "woof" then I'd keep on riding, probably with a rueful shake of the head.</p> <p>If I'd had a high speed coming together on my road bike with a handbag dog, <strike>slicing the poor runthund in two</strike> and it felt like I'd caused some damage, I'd probably stop if only to offer support or argue my innocence.</p> <p>When you smack into something on a bike you'll have a good idea of the forces involved and whether you'll have caused much damage. I'd hope we'd all act accordingly, but inevitably our response will be conditioned by personal experience. (In fact, I suspect we'd overestimate the damage done. Dogs, like kids, are surprisingly robust.) </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103147 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:11:43 +0000 Dave 103147@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>In the same scenario I'd be amazed if a child didn't come off - it was a good jolt. To me, it's very much to the dog owner's good fortune that I have the awareness and reactions (and perhaps, ahem, the mass) that a child would not.</p> <p>To me, this would suggest that the dog owner ought to keep their dog under close control where children are to be found - or even where they aren't (I don't accept this can be done vocally, although doubtless the law disagrees). </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627&page=2#post-103146 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:11:08 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 103146@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Then the question would be, "Were the child and dog okay?" (in your instance you remained upright, and continued cycling, therefore were clearly fine, whereas you changed the scenario in the second case to the child falling off). </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627#post-103144 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:07:57 +0000 Dave 103144@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>At risk of further frustrating WC, am I the only one who thinks it's disappointing that we should jump to "what if the dog was a child", rather than "what if the cyclist was a child"?</p> <p>The dog is unlikely to make any fine distinction about who it brings crashing down. As there are a lot of child cyclists on this route, I'm not even sure this is particularly far-fetched (although in fairness, I can only think of two or three that I see regularly on solo bikes, rather than under tow).</p> <p>A child would be much less likely to have the bitter experience, scepticism and reactions of yours truly.</p> <p>As the dog's owner clearly wasn't controlling the dog, it may as well have been a child brought down in this incident - I think that's what I'm getting at. </p> <p>I wonder how the opprobrium would fall if I had recorded a child being hit, rather than being hit oneself. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627#post-103135 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 17:33:47 +0000 Wilmington's Cow 103135@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>*sigh* </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627#post-103134 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 17:32:53 +0000 Dave 103134@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Surely you would stop to follow up on those wasps? After all, they're basically children, and who would leave a child lying bleeding in the road?</p> <p>I'm now definitely thinking I should have <a href="http://www.myfirststep.co.uk/site/library/pi/cycleist_wins_compensation_form_dog_owner.html">gone for my 14 grand</a> here? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627#post-103126 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 17:04:58 +0000 PS 103126@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>:D </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627#post-103124 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 17:02:50 +0000 Darkerside 103124@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Ah, fair enough. You seemed unsure whether they were bees or wasps, so though I'd just check how wide your identification error bars were.</p> <p>Not a badger. Noted. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627#post-103120 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 16:55:48 +0000 PS 103120@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@Darkerside No, I'm pretty sure these were insects. I wouldn't like to try headbutting a badger. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627#post-103116 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 16:49:28 +0000 Darkerside 103116@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I'm assuming you're reasonably confident it wasn't a long legged badger? If so the Protection of Badgers Act comes into play, which my work internet connection is stubbornly refusing to load up. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9627#post-103115 Wed, 06 Mar 2013 16:42:34 +0000 Darkerside 103115@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Ditto lionfish/anth, particularly on a shared use footpath. The only reason I wouldn't have stopped is if the dog was well enough to try and take a piece out of me in revenge.</p> <p>Light googling would suggest you're not required to stop and provide information, but only because the relevant part of the RTA refers to 'mechanically propelled vehicle' and not 'vehicle'. S170 of the 1988 Act, for the morbidly bored. I'm not sure if this bit has been amended again, because this would appear to suggest you don't have to stop if you run a human down either. Odd.</p> <p>Still... </p>