http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Topic: "East Coast rail franchise bidding process begins" en Sun, 31 May 2026 14:43:11 +0000 http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-285767 Mon, 25 Jun 2018 23:18:55 +0000 LaidBack 285767@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Watched news covering the newly branded LNER train being piped into Waverley. Interviews with Grayling and RMT union rep.<br /> What STV news missed was failure to have any representation from Scotland on this new publicly owned service. I doubt BBC would pick up this either but I'm prepared to be corrected.<br /> <ul><em>From today's National.</em><br /> Union chief Manuel Cortes said Scotland should have a seat at the table given that the line has more than 300 miles of track north of the Border and serves stations including Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Inverness.</p> <p>Cortes, who is general secretary of the Transport Salaried Staffs’ Association (TSSA), said: “It is typical of the pure anti-public sentiment held by privateer Tory Grayling that LNER will be running trains across Scotland without any Scottish representation on its board.</p> <p>“But it’s also indicative that whatever Ruth Davidson thinks, Westminster Tories hold Scotland in contempt. Imagine taking East Coast back into public ownership and not even considering Scotland should have a right to a voice at the table.</p> <p>“The man’s not fit to run a bath let alone a railway.”</ul> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282880 Fri, 18 May 2018 13:37:26 +0000 Morningsider 282880@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Tulyar - I see London North Eastern Railway Limited<br /> (previously known as DfT OLR1 Ltd) (previously known as GW Railway Ltd), has various operating licences from the ORR.</p> <p>I imagine the May timetable changes will go ahead - NR would blow a gasket if they tried to change that now!</p> <p>The Tories just had to get rid of Directly Operated Railways and replace it with something more likely to line the pockets of their fat-cat chums. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282864 Fri, 18 May 2018 11:51:24 +0000 Tulyar 282864@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Of course in all the smoke &amp; mirrors stuff few realise that the operation of ECML as LNER is not re-nationalised. DfT has set up a contract with SNC-Lavalin (Canadian company)and Arup (UK-ish). Grayling carefully used words like Control (vs Own) and Partnership</p> <p>The big let downs by DfT and Network Rail on delivery of track &amp; trains are spoken of sotto voce - although I'm grateful for that as the 8 minute train ride vs 25 minutes cycling along the A602, is still in place after a threatened closure to permit the main line timetable to be delivered</p> <p>Questions<br /> - 1 Who actually has the ORR licence to operate trains<br /> - 2 This means the May 2018 timetable changes haves just gone out the window.... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282712 Wed, 16 May 2018 18:34:20 +0000 chdot 282712@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Someone was quick -</p> <p>“</p> <p>Not to be confused with the new franchised operator, starting in June 2018 to replace the previous franchise. </p> <p>“</p> <p><a href="https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_and_North_Eastern_Railway" rel="nofollow">https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_and_North_Eastern_Railway</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282711 Wed, 16 May 2018 18:32:04 +0000 chdot 282711@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>“DoT have fallen for the retrobranding fad too by naming the new franchise LNER”</p> <p>Yes, but no doubt as with some other rebranding, it doesn’t <em>mean</em> anything... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282709 Wed, 16 May 2018 18:30:05 +0000 chdot 282709@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><img src="https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/964/40346701560_35322c70fa_z.jpg"> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282708 Wed, 16 May 2018 18:18:26 +0000 chdot 282708@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>By email. </p> <p>“</p> <p>It has been announced today that on the 24th June 2018 the East Coast Main Line will transition to be operated by LNER - London North Eastern Railway. </p> <p>The service will continue to run as normal. Your travel plans won’t be affected and all train times and customer experience will remain the same. </p> <p>Any tickets you have already purchased for Virgin Trains East Coast will be valid with LNER and you can continue to purchase tickets as normal. </p> <p>We’ve loved serving you for the last three years and know the business is in a really good position thanks to the positive transformation we’ve started. </p> <p>Kind regards</p> <p>The Virgin Trains East Coast team</p> <p>“ </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282696 Wed, 16 May 2018 16:15:30 +0000 kaputnik 282696@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>DoT have fallen for the retrobranding fad too by naming the new franchise LNER, reviving the 1923-1947 London (and) North Eastern Railway brand. They've forgotten the and though, and called it London North Eastern Railway. Make of that what you will.</p> <p>London AND North Eastern made sense in the context of the railways that formed it, and that it served London AND the "north east" (of England), if you allow for Scotland being referred to as the "north east". London North Eastern kind of doesn't, given London is almost the most easterly point on the route, and it doesn't serve north eastern London. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282689 Wed, 16 May 2018 14:50:49 +0000 Morningsider 282689@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>amir - yes, Agility Trains have a 27.5 year long contract with the UK Department for Transport to provide the Intercity Express trains. The DfT will make the use of these trains a requirement of the next East Coast franchise - or whatever replaces it. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282683 Wed, 16 May 2018 13:55:54 +0000 amir 282683@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Will the Azuma trains still be coming? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282681 Wed, 16 May 2018 13:38:00 +0000 Ed1 282681@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Good news when it was last re-nationalised went down to London at a good price quite a few times since then taken plane as too expensive. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282680 Wed, 16 May 2018 13:10:03 +0000 toomanybikes 282680@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"temporarily" renationalised</p> <p><a href="https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/16/east-coast-rail-line-to-be-temporarily-renationalised-virgin-stagecoach" rel="nofollow">https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/16/east-coast-rail-line-to-be-temporarily-renationalised-virgin-stagecoach</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282617 Tue, 15 May 2018 12:27:24 +0000 Blueth 282617@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Whatever happens the whole lot should be under one management so train companies can't blame track companies for delays.</p> <p>That might also do away with the nonsense I once experienced near London where an incoming train, having been delayed on the outward journey, did not stop at any stations in order that it could reach the terminus on time and therefore not incur a penalty. Not much point a train being on time if it's empty and the passengers have to sit for another 45 minutes. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282604 Tue, 15 May 2018 09:41:54 +0000 chdot 282604@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>To some extent I don’t care who owns/runs the railways as long as they do it well.</p> <p>I wish the EC trains still had the nice blue GNER livery!</p> <p>Taking money away (as profit) from routes that ought to be easy to make money on can’t be good. Of course the argument used to be that ‘private interests will bring in cash and expertise’. Not sure that ever happened.</p> <p>‘Everyone’ hates Network Rail for major work overruns and general intransigence. NR is the nationalised version of RT which was the privatised version of BR. Some continuities, some changes.</p> <p>The bit of the railway that is largely forgotten about are the companies that actually own the trains. They got them cheap and leased them back to desperate train <em>running</em> companies, for a fee...</p> <p>Might be a good idea to take back ownership of the rolling stock. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282588 Tue, 15 May 2018 06:57:56 +0000 gembo 282588@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Reverse alchemy indeed </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282584 Tue, 15 May 2018 05:45:36 +0000 crowriver 282584@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>This quote is worth repeating for posterity here:</p> <p>---</p> <p>Mick Whelan, general secretary of Aslef, the train drivers’ union, said: “This is the third time in 10 years that a private company has mucked up the east coast main line. In contrast, when it was run in the public sector, it returned £1bn to the Treasury."</p> <p>“That shows what we have been saying all along - that Britain’s railways should be run, successfully, as a public service, not for private profit. Because they can’t do it. Virgin and Stagecoach have managed reverse alchemy - by turning gold into base metal, and profits into losses on the east coast.”</p> <p>--- </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-282583 Mon, 14 May 2018 22:37:26 +0000 I were right about that saddle 282583@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/may/14/east-coast-rail-franchise-to-be-scrapped-chris-grayling">Let's do the time warp....again.</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-268369 Thu, 30 Nov 2017 23:52:02 +0000 I were right about that saddle 268369@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I'll have the deep-fried cringe with a portion of shoulder chips. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-268368 Thu, 30 Nov 2017 23:45:46 +0000 unhurt 268368@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>"the railways run as a public service as part of an integrated transport strategy"</p> <p>What extreme socialist madness is this?</p> <p>P.S. They handed out paper booklet menus - <a href="https://www.scotrail.co.uk/train-catering">"Taste the Landscape"</a> - for the trolley on the Glasgow train this afternoon. Print version is full of random images of Plockton etc. The actual menu text is up as a pdf <a href="https://www.scotrail.co.uk/sites/default/files/assets/download_ct/sr_catering_menu_june_17.pdf">here</a> if you want to question who the audience for this might be. I made a FACE. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-268344 Thu, 30 Nov 2017 20:06:15 +0000 I were right about that saddle 268344@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/12066/report-public-future-scotlands-railways">Timely intervention.</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-268255 Thu, 30 Nov 2017 09:47:56 +0000 I were right about that saddle 268255@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>A friend of mine was an actual venture capitalist in the nineties and participated in the Major privatisation of rail.</p> <p>Even he regarded the railways as a 'natural monopoly' at the time and thought the whole thing was a farcical scam. Ditto the 'Royal' Mail. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-268251 Thu, 30 Nov 2017 09:24:27 +0000 steveo 268251@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><em>Or not bother and walk away if it's not going well.</em></p> <p>hmmmm... </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-268246 Thu, 30 Nov 2017 08:08:46 +0000 gembo 268246@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@ps, of course when British rail was privatised the Tories argued that having a separate infrastructure organisation and then different private providers would make things more efficient. Strangely. When the post office was privatised the first time, BT was sold as both infrastructure organisation and provider. So as we know they just make this stuff up to suit themselves. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=4#post-268242 Wed, 29 Nov 2017 23:04:02 +0000 PS 268242@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Don't know the detail, but there's a suggestion in several of the articles reporting this that Network Rail will fail to deliver the infrastructure improvements that Virgin/Stagecoach was told would be in place. </p> <p>Therein lies one of the key problems of the privatisation model - Network Rail is supposed to be delivering improvements across the entire network; operators bid on the basis of these improvements being made to schedule; then Network Rail (seemingly invariably) fail to deliver on time, thereby giving the operator the opportunity (sometimes justified, sometimes not) to say we can't deliver what we promised because the infrastructure doesn't allow it, so you (Network Rail/Government) need to bail us out/compensate us/let us off our commitments. </p> <p>Network Rail is owned by the government and, to put it mildly, does not have a good track record when it comes to infrastructure delivery. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=3#post-268210 Wed, 29 Nov 2017 18:34:02 +0000 chdot 268210@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>My bold -</p> <p>“</p> <p>Instead, Vtec is likely to pay a fraction of that sum, with the bulk of payments due in the final years of the franchise.</p> <p>The firm signalled that it also expects its payments for the next three years to be cut. In the first full year of operation, it paid £204m. <strong>Shares in Stagecoach jumped 12% on the news.<br /> </strong><br /> “</p> <p><a href="https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/nov/29/east-coast-rail-franchise-terminated-three-years-early-virgin-trains" rel="nofollow">https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/nov/29/east-coast-rail-franchise-terminated-three-years-early-virgin-trains</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=3#post-268199 Wed, 29 Nov 2017 17:22:39 +0000 Morningsider 268199@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>Seems the UK Government has caved-in to the demands of Virgin-Stagecoach and will be terminating the East Coast franchise in 2020. This means the big-bucks promised by Virgin-Stagecoach to the UK Government at the start of the franchise no longer need to be paid. In addition, it looks like the amount due to be paid over the remainder of the shortened franchise will also be reduced.</p> <p>This is all hidden in the detail of a "Strategic Vision for Rail" published today and nicely spun as the creation of a new East Coast Partnership. </p> <p>Details: <a href="https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/663124/rail-vision-web.pdf" rel="nofollow">https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/663124/rail-vision-web.pdf</a> </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=3#post-183124 Thu, 12 Mar 2015 15:22:29 +0000 Tulyar 183124@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>I've done Edinburgh-Leeds faster via Carlisle &amp; the S&amp;C (which BTW now has some really smooth jointed as well as CWR - and many reckon the signalling should be cleared for 90mph at least, rather then current 75mph). </p> <p>Arriva or VT did a test run EDB-KGX with a 390 and worked out that it could do current route in around 3h40m, as the bendy bits can be done faster (compare the sliding discomfort on current non tilt trains going through Grantshouse/Penmanshiel/Cockburnspath with the WCML tilters).</p> <p>Further South we've had c.160mph out of a very short HST testing the bogies (now built in Europe) for high speed operation. These were fitted to an HST Mk 3 carriage, so an HST rake, with auto doors (as devised by Chiltern and now planned for Abellio HST's) and then Class 88 or similar if Class 43's cannot cut the mustard, might get new high speed bogies and dun at the already planned and tested 140mph.</p> <p>Eliminate the bottlenecks at York, Newcastle, and avoidable slowing down at Morpeth, 3 hours to London for 395 miles (including going North to go via Dunbar) doesn't look impossible.</p> <p>Worth also bearing in mind that having rebuilt 33 miles of track, 7 new stations, 1 new viaduct, 1 new tunnel, and several totally rebuilt existing structures, in just over 2 years, the prospect of reconnecting rails between Melrose and Longtown, especially if driven by a core freight customer, and cross funded as a lower cost option than road repairs &amp; enhancements for HGV.... We've got the team so where do they go next? </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=3#post-183102 Thu, 12 Mar 2015 13:59:49 +0000 kaputnik 183102@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p><a href="http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/low-cost-edinburgh-to-london-rail-service-plan-1-3716869" rel="nofollow">http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/low-cost-edinburgh-to-london-rail-service-plan-1-3716869</a></p> <p><em>A cut-price express train to London is set to launch a price war with rival rail firms and budget airlines if it is approved by regulators.</p> <p>First Group has promised to offer “significantly lower” fares on the route if its plans go ahead, with journey times of four hours between Edinburgh and London.</em></p> <p>Don't hold your breath, previous attempts to run open-access services on the ECML have been blocked as they might affect the incumbent operator's profits or interfere with diagramming of services. Then they'd have to find enough rolling stock to perform a reliable high-speed service. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=3#post-182409 Wed, 04 Mar 2015 14:30:51 +0000 Arellcat 182409@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>@crowriver, and 23 formations of Class 800 ("<a href="http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=10740">IEP</a>") trains to work the ECML from 2018.</p> <p>Look at those trains, all shiny and streamlined, and wonder why on earth in 2015 we still don't have an ECML operating at 180mph. </p> http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=9794&page=3#post-182391 Wed, 04 Mar 2015 12:51:44 +0000 crowriver 182391@http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/ <p>So, in summary, the new operator's investment is as follows:</p> <p>- spruce up the ageing 125/225 units a bit.<br /> - bring back working kitchens so premium passengers can enjoy a hot breakfast.<br /> - two extra trains on a Sunday.</p> <p>Then, once infrastructure and rolling stock upgrades are delivered by the public sector (2019/20?):</p> <p>- trains every half an hour.</p> <p>Er...that's it.</p> <p>So 2.3bn looks like a reasonable bid. If they can crank up the profit margins a bit over the next few years they'll be back in the black in what....six or seven years? </p>