CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure

Edinburgh Waverley Station: Car and taxi ban comes into force

(432 posts)
  • Started 10 years ago by crowriver
  • Latest reply from crowriver

  1. Morningsider
    Member

    What! None of this makes any sense. Why bother with a painted cycle lane at all. If you can make it through the traffic maelstrom outside Waverley, I doubt you would be phased by the possibility of the odd delivery van on the ramp.

    The gate is crazy - anyone with a heavily loaded bike (not unusual at a major railway station) will probably struggle to open it. It won't stop those determined to cycle in the station from doing so - they will simply re-mount after passing through.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  2. Arellcat
    Moderator

    The gate itself opens in both directions and is self-closing. It's easy to push open; you could just bang your front wheel into it. That said, I have no idea how recumbent owners will open it except perhaps by kicking out with a spare foot. I haven't measured the gate, but it's three or four feet wide. If you have a tandem with huge panniers front and back, you're as well not bothering.

    I really can't believe that Network Rail is actually saying this is the entrance and exit for cyclists to use, and I hope I'm wrong and there's some other gate still to be installed. To put the gate where it is, tucked out of the way and eight feet from the shop wall, is a nice way of saying that cyclists are to be tolerated but nothing more.

    The chaps in orange were installing the fenceposts and fences; I didn't see any other gatey-looking stuff lying around.

    Might be interesting to FOI Network Rail and ask what design standards they're working to.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  3. gkgk
    Member

    If the railings will be built right around the circle then that gate will become the fag break gate.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  4. paulmilne
    Member

    The south ramp is looking better and better ...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  5. jdanielp
    Member

    It was still closed off when I arrived at Waverley with my bike on Friday evening - any chance that I will be able to exit up the new route when I return this evening?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  6. jdanielp
    Member

    Apparently not. Looks very nearly ready...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  7. SRD
    Moderator

    Work going on about two hours. Not yet finished though.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  8. Arellcat
    Moderator

    The facility isn't quite open yet, but there's your problem:


    Obstacle course by beqi, on Flickr

    There's a bigger gate, in a sensible position, but it's for more important things like deliveries, so it's locked.

    Access denied by beqi, on Flickr

    Posted 8 years ago #
  9. jdanielp
    Member

    Hmm.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  10. Klaxon
    Member

    Live (11:15)

    Lesley Hinds, Tom Norris and many others currently being goofy on the go bikes to presumably launch the new access

    Posted 8 years ago #
  11. chdot
    Admin

    Is that Sarah Boyack?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  12. Klaxon
    Member

    Indeed it was. Couldn't remember her name.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  13. jdanielp
    Member

    I'm guessing that Network Rail will have made sure that no deliveries will have been made during the launch...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  14. HankChief
    Member

    Looks like Derek Mackay was there too...

    https://twitter.com/EdinBikeLanes/status/659696877844217856

    Posted 8 years ago #
  15. paulmilne
    Member

    Interesting development. A couple of nights ago I was standing on the overhead walkway observing the area and noticed two things:

    1) cyclist coming down dodging around the speed bumps by veering towards the side.
    2) People stepping over the barriers to cut across.

    Last night I was walking down the North ramp and noticed

    1) 1 cyclist going down the ramp
    2) 1 cyclist pushing her bike down the footpath
    3) Fresh temporary bollards and new stripy tape "protecting" the permanent bollards and railing, which I notice is gone from Klaxon's photo above.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  16. DaveC
    Member

    "I'm guessing that Network Rail will have made sure that no deliveries will have been made during the launch..."

    That would have been hilarious.

    Lesley "I'd Just ike to start by thanking..."

    Approaching lorry "BEEP!! BEEP!! BEEP!! ...!!!"

    Posted 8 years ago #
  17. sweb67
    Member

    Image Sometime later that day (not much later!)

    Posted 8 years ago #
  18. cc
    Member

    Of course the van driver couldn't dump it on the other side of the ramp because that would have blocked it...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  19. crowriver
    Member

    But it's a parking lane, innit?

    I noticed it was all open this morning as I sauntered past disguised as a pedestrian. The gate looks okay actually: plenty clearance for most pedal powered conveyances I'd have thought.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  20. Morningsider
    Member

    Here's the Network Rail press release:

    http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/news/new-cycle-lane-opens-for-edinburgh-waverley-passengers

    Best to think of it as an absurd comedy piece. Or perhaps everyone really has forgotten that Network Rail caused the problem in the first place, which at least gives them an excuse for thinking the new facilities are a decent solution to cycle access into the station.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  21. crowriver
    Member

    Well yeah, but on a sightly more hopeful note:

    "The ramp will continue to be used for deliveries in the short to medium term, however, solutions are being sought to find a long term alternative to bringing deliveries into the station via the ramps."

    Could be interesting...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  22. Arellcat
    Moderator

    They can't bring in station supplies on a train because they've turned all the goods stations into car parks. And they can't bring in supplies by cargo bike because bikes.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  23. jdanielp
    Member

    The only people shown cycling in the accompanying picture are doing so on the unpainted part of the ramp due to an 'obstruction' on the official cycle lane. Get used to it.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  24. ih
    Member

    I distinctly recall Phil Verster, MD of the Rail Alliance, giving evidence to the CEC Transport Committee (link upthread) saying that he didn't think the north ramp would be used for cycle access, but the south ramp was more likely. I would love to know why his mind was changed from that eminently sensible idea to the risible 'solution' we have now.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  25. Arellcat
    Moderator

    The south ramp would at least have allowed people to cycle all the way (almost) to the mass of parking on platform 3, which is really quite a distance to push your bike, lock up and then run back to catch your Glasgow train or run into the toilets in the central block because you're about to be spectacularly productive.

    The fact that the north ramp and gate is probably adequate for 95% of cyclists means that the other 5% are consistently disadvantaged because of a failure to consider the full range of users, the same as the diversion path on Roseburn Park.

    They could have left the foot access to the station as the Waverley Steps, and the stairs from Market St, and the ramps, and the only reason this changed is because they were required to provide access for people with mobility impairements.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  26. ih
    Member

    Hi @Arellcat. Not sure if your comment,

    "They could have left the foot access to the station as the Waverley Steps, and the stairs from Market St, and the ramps, and the only reason this changed is because they were required to provide access for people with mobility impairements."

    is meant to explain why Phil Verster changed his mind from the S ramp to the N one. If so, could you expand a bit? He was right then, and the south ramp is still the right choice. The new cycle lane, with a gate, which dumps you into the most congested part of the station, may be "adequate" for 95% of users, but the south ramp would be "better" for 100%, and wouldn't have required any extra infrastructure; just open the barrier. What was the killer reason that changed his mind?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  27. Tulyar
    Member

    http://www.endole.co.uk/company/09819596/intercity-railfreight-limited

    Changing from http://www.5pl-uk.com/ this weekend

    about to launch more routes, including deliveries to stations .. where HGV trucks can access platforms to transfer to trains ... has run trials at Euston where trucks drive right to side of train and load/unload at night .....oh dear we've sealed off Glasgow Central from all directions and built 2 more platforms, Queen Street ...not much better Waverley...errr ... smart thinking....

    Posted 8 years ago #
  28. gkgk
    Member

    Re why north not south, seems to me they probably thought just as far as the zebra crossing at foot of south, envisaging speeding bike collisions, and bikes streaming onward uninterrupted into the station, chose north.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  29. Arellcat
    Moderator

    @ih, my comment was to try to illustrate the fact that NR had to be forced (by legislation) to improve conditions for disabled people. Otherwise those modifications would have been carried out much sooner. I get the feeling that cyclists, who might all be passengers, are basically just pests who need no special treatment that provides equality of access, but public pressure made NR relent.

    As gkgk noted, I think the presence of the pedestrian crossing, and the habit of cyclists to race down hills and run amok in public spaces, was the single reason why the south ramp was not an option. Whether or not this would have held out in real life — I suspect not — is not up for argument anymore it seems. Public perception of cyclists has thoroughly polluted every kind of public space design thinking, despite no-one remembering all of the good drivers and good cyclists that we enounter every day. It's human nature to remember negativity.

    In some respects, the 1960s idea of reducing Waverley to a local station and building (or rebuilding) Princes St Station at ground level might well have been the better option overall. Waverley is, to all intents and purposes, a glorified underground station with complex access arrangements.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  30. Stickman
    Member


RSS feed for this topic

Reply »

You must log in to post.


Video embedded using Easy Video Embed plugin