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CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
bikes on trains (originally “Booking”)
(125 posts)-
Posted 4 months ago #
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Good point.
Posted 4 months ago # -
My MTB has 80cm bars... I guess I have to hope the conductor doesn't have a tape measure.
If I may be so bold, 80cm is really very wide, and on trains, perhaps unreasonably so given that there is only so much space inside. Were those handlebars mine, I'd be sawing off a good 3 inches from either end!
(on my mtb, the handlebars are 67cm; on my Elephant Bike, they're 65cm, both including bar ends.)
Posted 4 months ago # -
yep. Every modern bike I've bought (excepting the Helios), I've cut about 50mm off each end of the bars.
Mostly because I'm afraid of clipping something while filtering with such long factory-fitted bars. Why the trend for such madly long bars?
Posted 4 months ago # -
Had a bit of a panic last night, first time getting a very late train back from Edinburgh and I didn't realize they reduce the number of coaches compared to the daytime trains, was only a single bike space carriage and I only just got the second place.
As for long bars, easier to sell wide ones and let people who don't need cut them down than maintain multiple SKUs so as to not leave out the wide-shouldered amongst us?
Posted 4 months ago # -
“I only just got the second place“
Presume train not full of passengers?
I wouldn’t panic.
Long time since (most/central belt) train staff enforced 2 bike rule - as long as ‘nested’ well enough. Some are ok with using door space. (Potentially a problem where there are no bikes/buggies/luggage stickers - more of an issue on lines where trains don’t always stop at same side platforms at all stations.)
Some units with the green stripes above the doors also have bikes spaces at the blue door too. Most 170s (3 coaches) are like this, but a few only have one coach with ‘bike space’.
Most(?) 158s have the ‘bike bar’ in both coaches.
I suspect neither type run on the line you use.
Posted 4 months ago # -
I *think* the Waverly to Helensburgh Central via Glasgow Queen Street uses 334 refurbs? Not enough of an anorak to know for sure on sight alone. Usually when I've taken them they have two carriages with the fold-down seating double bike spot. And yeah I've seen other people happily stacking their bikes 3 or 4 deep, but with the weight of mine I wouldn't trust it to remain upright unless it's strapped in.
Posted 4 months ago # -
My MTB and Pashey both have weirdly wide bars, never been chucked off a train with either.
Even with 'both' spaces taken I just get on the train, never been chucked off because of that either.
I did get chucked off once for not paying, when they had started rolling out card payments, but not all trains could take card payments yet, and I had no cash. Wasn't so bad as I at least got over the bridge so only had to cycle half way home.
Posted 4 months ago # -
Had to use ScotRail to assist with an Urban Arrow delivery today. Was to Helensburgh and wasn't that keen to cycle the 70 plus miles from Edinburgh.
So... I had screenshots of the ScotRail web pages which day what bikes can go on what trains plus a pic of the 'cargo bike and tandems allowed on certain trains' sign plus a tape measure.
Cycled to be at Waverley early to get on the 8am. Train left from Platform 9 so luckily the lifts are big enough as had to use two to get over. Despite obscure platform a crowd gathered including a cyclist competing for same space. There was another four bike area on next unit as was 8 coach train but he was getting off at Linlithgow. Was able to help me get the cargo bike front wheel on train which I appreciated. (Had makeshift ramp just in case stowed in bucket).
Guard duly came round and asked 'who had trailer on train?'. Guys bike was sticking out a bit but was clear my caused by me selfishly taking all the space (!).
I then told him it was a cargo bike and technically allowed (even encouraged as on a sign). He was decent guy and looked at the screenshot but it could have gone badly. Basically he still has power to remove anything he considers is blocking a corridor. So the on-paper cargo bike might be fine but seeing the large UA was not likely to go down so well.
Later on he came by to chat about bike spaces. All in all a good outcome but not without stress. Another customer with quite small Veloe was almost barred a coouple of weeks ago from returning with it at Queen St. Again due to staff not being aware of that type of bike. She did get on after assuring guard it was within the guidelines.Posted 2 months ago # -
Glad of your pioneering here, the more they see the more they are aware! Shame Scotrail can't provide adequate / consistent enough training though - you shouldn't have to persuade them.
Posted 2 months ago # -
I was one of at least 9 cyclists trying to squeeze into the, I think, 6 advertised cycle spaces on a busy Bristol-London train yesterday. Everyone claimed to have a reservation, which seems unlikely, but I did notice that the space that I had a reservation for said it was reserved for a different journey, so maybe it was overbooked somehow.
Very helpful guard got us all squeezed in. I also learned that there are unadvertised cycle spaces, presumably to help with situations like this.
Posted 2 months ago # -
I wish their guidelines were a bit more explicit and general. I've fancied an Urban Arrow Shorty for a while, but would they take it on the 334? They seem to assume "cargo bike" means regular UA's or longtails which aren't allowed on that model due to the length of the bike bay, but the Shorty is no longer than my Gazelle which is allowed, and its cargo box is narrower than the Gazelle with panniers which also hasn't ever been an issue, but because the guidance is so wishy-washy and so much depends on whether the Guard is in a grumpy mood or not I've held off buying one because I don't want to risk having to argue the toss when I'm trying to catch the last train out of Waverly or whatever.
Posted 2 months ago # -
@Yodhrin - main issue from staff point of view is whether you can lift a bike on board. However some staff still think bikes should be hung up which is impossible for many e-bike owners. Traditional view of bike as lightweight sports equipment prevails.
The Activity Coach is the answer for some lines but not able to be used above 70mph so niche.
LNER set such a barrier to bike use that almost any ScotRail train is better.Posted 2 months ago # -
“Basically he still has power to remove anything he considers is blocking a corridor.”
Was on a train to Falkirk the other day.
Got on at HYM to the coach with the green flash - (notionally for 4 bikes - but only if you interlace them). Found 4 already on so put our 2 next to doors away from platform side.
Ticket man came and said we’d have to move them. ‘But it’s alright, just go to coach with wheelchair space. Don’t worry, plenty time, I’ll come back and show you’.
He did, all fine.
Staff definitely more understanding/helpful.
So must be some training going on.
However much more clarity on all rolling stock would be helpful. There are many coaches with blue bands that have the horizontal bike holders.
And there are some sets with only blue bands!
Posted 2 months ago # -
@chdot - Staff definitely more understanding/helpful.
Can be of course. Often challenged by the size and quantity of wheelie suitcases in use now. Bike users are generally more aware of space and how to make it work. Was on a train where cases were just left in corridor in front of rack. Guard had to re-pack while visitors watched!
Posted 2 months ago # -
Well
There’s actually LOTS of info on SR website
Don’t know when it was last updated, but there are now videos of many train types (2nd link)
https://www.scotrail.co.uk/plan-your-journey/cycling/bikes-trains
Posted 2 months ago # -
I influenced the design spec of the Class 380, which carried over to the Class 385, and the upgrading of Class 334 included provision of a matching bike space to same detail (& changing the coupling to Dellner 10 so that ALL electric trains crossing Central Scotland are 100mph & coupling compatible (to deal with breakdowns etc)
CUK tandem riders often use Ayrshire lines for days out
The standard bike spaces are now 2.4m long, by the door vestibule, have the draught screen cut back to allow for smooth boarding
On 318/320 units 75 mph locals around Glasgow the bike spaces are 1.4-1.5m with similar cut back draught screens
Talk is that Scotrail might go after the Class 350 (110mph) released by new trains in W Midlands, which are Siemens & possibly compatible with Class 380
The Class 380 detail was used to sort out HST's by fitting 6 tip up seats in place of 3 fixed pairs to provide 3 metres of space in Coach C, but the access from door vestibule is tight
Images welcomed
Posted 1 month ago # -
11 people with bicycles getting off the train to Livingston North this morning.
Posted 1 month ago # -
@ Finn
Is that a one off ‘party’ or a gradual increase in bike commuter numbers?
Posted 1 month ago # -
Not a one-off, but typical numbers in the morning - perhaps slightly more than usual, but only by a bike or two. For no particular reason I counted them and thought it was worth posting here.
Posted 1 month ago # -
“thought it was worth posting here”
Definitely!
Has it been a gradual increase over years or a noticeable post Covid bump?
Posted 1 month ago # -
That route has always been busy with bikes, because public transport in Livingston is so <rule 2>. I feel like that train has got particularly busy with bike recently.
Posted 1 month ago # -
I think 14 bicycles this morning - 5 in the racks I was using, and I was trying to count all the others.
Posted 1 month ago # -
Presume train staff ok/‘resigned’?
Any folders?
On basis of ‘2 bikes per space’, what is ‘official capacity’?
Is it always same type of train/number of coaches?
Posted 1 month ago # -
Train staff didn't appear to make any comment (I had headphones in). They have always been good on that route. I remember an incident where there were, I think, two cancelled trains in the afternoon rush hour and everyone just crammed on with bikes in all the vestibules.
It is funny rolling stock. As well as the official bike racks (definitely more than two bikes) there are big spaces for wheelchair users where you can put a bike or bikes, more awkwardly than in the racks of course.
I think I was the only person with a folder. I have a cheap Halfords folder these days, so I try not to fold it (and didn't this morning). If I do fold it, I then tend to go to the "wheelchair" space. The advantage of folding it is that I can say "Look! It isn't a bicycle! It is folded!" in spite of the fact that it at least as awkward an object in its folded as in its unfolded form.
Posted 1 month ago # -
Thanks
Interesting
Slightly on topic -
“
He said: “Anyone wanting to cycle on the road from say, Livingston to Edinburgh, has to go on the carriageway with its heavy traffic, which can be quite dangerous.
“
Posted 1 month ago # -
To answer this properly:
On basis of ‘2 bikes per space’, what is ‘official capacity’?
4 bikes. They are 2 x 3 carriage trains, i.e. 6 carriages, and each set of 3 has a bike space and a "wheelchair" space.Posted 1 month ago # -
The advantage of folding it is that I can say "Look! It isn't a bicycle! It is folded!" in spite of the fact that it at least as awkward an object in its folded as in its unfolded form.
@fimm - yes just done my commute this morning to Pitlochry on my used Raleigh 7 speed creaky folder. Excellent V brakes for going down via Moulin.
Guard was very good as French tourist taking a bike box on board to get tram to airport. (Too big or expensive for taxi run?)
So he sat on 3 coach train at blue marked wheelchair space and my bike plus a folded pram for on. Other dedicated green bike space had two gravel bikes on so guard invited us both along platform to use the space. He didn't want bike folded in case another bike came on. Thought it easier to move and park. Good young guard!Posted 1 month ago # -
Thanks Fimm
Seem to be two of these throughout the day
Posted 1 month ago # -
So on the train from Livingston to Edinburgh yesterday. I wave my ticket at the guard, and he goes past the bikes, all seems fine.
After a bit he comes back.
"Is that your red bike?" he asks
Oh what now, I think.
"Yes," I reply.
"Where did you get your mudguards? I've got a bike very like that and I'd like to get some mudguards for it...!"Posted 1 month ago #
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