Bollards have now been removed and chicanes are padlocked in place, accompanied by a plethora of shared use signs and some odd reflectey chevroney panel things on the gates themselves.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
New chicane on Balgreen path
(92 posts)-
Posted 9 years ago #
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Bah. I was going to suggest that we do some rush hour filming to see if we could find any evidence of speeding conflict before/after.
Posted 9 years ago # -
First post-holiday commute to work since the chicane was put in. Didn't slow me any more than the bollards did when heading from Balgreen Road up onto the path - but then again it was only 6.20am and there were no other pedestrians or cyclists around to get into conflict with as we all tried to squeeze through the gates!
It'll be interesting to see what effect they have when going the other way during the evening rush-hour.
(I had a look at pre-gate helmetcam footage last night - and found that pedestrians were already using the off-path desire line across the verge when the bollards were installed).
Posted 9 years ago # -
MrSrd reports chicane obstructed by MUm with trail gator and 2 other kids on own bikes stopped in the middle of it.
While trying out his new clipless pedals.
Not a good combo
Posted 9 years ago # -
Not sure if this is new news of not but the chicane on Traquair Alley (at the other end of Pinkhill railway has been remodelled so there is a bigger gap between the gates.
Traquair Alley by HankChief, on Flickr
Much more manoeuvrable but still begs the question of why bother with the chicanes at all.I hope this means that CEC are looking at chicanes and how they can improve access across the city. We've discussed several others on here, not least the broomhall / Dovecot one.
Broomhall Chicane by HankChief, on FlickrPosted 9 years ago # -
Pedal for Scotland Family ride next Sunday.
Route: A four mile circular route from Murrayfield Stadium on closed roads, quiet residential streets and cycle paths.
Based on the signs I have seen up I think the route is
Out Murrayfield stadium
Baird Drive
Balgreen Tram side path
Down Carrick Knowe Avenue
Pinkhill Railway
Baird Drive Back to stadiumNot a bad route for little people.
Watching them navigate the Balgreen Chicane in both directions would be interesting to watch. Perhaps we should invite CEC to watch how their handiwork is negotiated by the various bikes (& add ons) on a family ride.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Oh, and some good news. Local ward Cllr Paul Edie has agreed to look into issues we have with the various chicanes in Corstorphine ward (which includes the ones at Balgreen, Paddockholm & Dovecot). So I have sent him a long email last night - I've also included a link to this page.
Posted 9 years ago # -
There is a chap, maybe on here he takes a kids buggy tow along thingy along the towpath, two sprogs on board. I watched him navigate the hermiston village chicane no problem about a week back.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Gembo - As the chicane is (thankfully) compliant with the Cycling by Design document for the size of the gaps, it should be possible to pass through relatively straightforwardly if no one else is around and you are experienced at it.
However, what I anticipate next Sunday is lots of hesitation ('after you' etc) and people not approaching in the right alignment to flow through, so stopping part way through. You'll also have anxious parents guiding (read 'shouting at') their offspring and potentially giving them a gentle push up the hill.
You'll also get a whole range of bikes and experience/age of riders.
As I say, thankfully, they have put a 3m gap between the barriers, which will make things easier. But it should highlight the issues that we face when confronted by chicanes with only a 1m gap.
Posted 9 years ago # -
@hankchief. Agreed. My guy does it every day he has it off pat. Doesn't need to stop. I still pit my foot down on the chicane but the guy with the tow along has no problem negotiating. But as you say, inexperienced will have more bother.
Posted 9 years ago # -
There were some council workies clearing vegetation from the WoL path near the other end of Baird Dr this morning.
Preparation for a papal visit, or just PfS family?
Posted 9 years ago # -
Here's where they cleared the vegetation for Pedal for Scotland family ride:
http://i.imgur.com/b410Qmq.jpgAnd 50 yards further along, off the PfS route, here's where they couldn't be bothered to clear the vegetation:
http://i.imgur.com/3iQdCEK.jpgTIE.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I noticed the PFS route goes across the old railway bridge at Roseburn and then for some reason directs people not straight on towards the slalom and the shared-use pavement on Russell Road, but down the very steep little path to the left and Bailbirnie. I know that they close the bus lane on the A8 to get folks to Murrayfield (and it's a nice admission that the provided official cycle route is rubbish for mass-cycling), however I can see a lot of people being in for a surprise if someone gets to the bottom of that wee slope and suddenly stops as others come down behind them.
Posted 9 years ago # -
"Here's where they cleared the vegetation for Pedal for Scotland family ride"
Very nice. Now that CEC has 'found' this path, perhaps the whole length from Roseburn Park to the Saughton Skatepark can be properly surfaced. (Tarmac)
Posted 9 years ago # -
perhaps the whole length from Roseburn Park to the Saughton Skatepark can be properly surfaced
Indeed. And they could even join it up to the Balgreen path via the blocked-off path between Baird Dr and the tram tracks. A complete joined up off road route.
JOINED. UP. THINKING.
Posted 9 years ago # -
And they could even join it up to the Balgreen path via the blocked-off path between Baird Dr and the tram tracks. A complete joined up off road route.
I didn't know this path even existed - I might explore on my way home.
Seems like an open-goal. Or would the residents object?
Posted 9 years ago # -
"...the blocked-off path between Baird Dr and the tram tracks..."
Where is this?
Some of the path along the WoL between Roseburn Park and Saughton is rather narrow...Posted 9 years ago # -
@fimm/Stickman
The path is parallel and right next to the tram tracks (on the North side). It runs behind the gardens of the South side of Baird Dr and at the same level (tram tracks much higher up). It was used during the construction of trams, but is now blocked up and getting overgrown...
Soon it will be forgotten forever... :(
It comes out on Balgreen Rd directly in front of the pedestrian tunnel under the railway, where there used to be a BuzzyBee catering unit/shed/garage.
Posted 9 years ago # -
@eddie_h:
Thanks. It sounds like wingpig's suggestion would be ideal then. So no chance of it ever happening unfortunately.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Balgreen Rd end:
Posted 9 years ago # -
edd1e_h interesting, thank you.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Once through the pedestrian tunnel towards Balgreen primary there was a road that ran down to the WoL path, which was closed during tram construction. Hopefully it has re-opened?
There was also a new pedestrian bridge built over the river to a new housing development
Posted 9 years ago # -
What my suggestion?
Posted 9 years ago # -
What my suggestion?
Oops, eddie_h's suggestion. Not sure why I ascribed it you...
Posted 9 years ago # -
I should have asked: was any reason given for closing this path? And is there any way of requesting the council reopen it and link it up?
Posted 9 years ago # -
"...the blocked-off path between Baird Dr and the tram tracks..."
Worse still, someone appears to have deliberately planted fast growing fir trees at the WoL end:
Posted 9 years ago # -
Results of a FOI request:
1. What consultation was carried out on this installation? What/who's views were taken into consideration?
The Road Safety team were asked to investigate ways of reducing the perceived danger to pupils travelling to school on this path raised and discussed with Balgreen Primary Parent Association. Consultation took place internally within the Council with the tram and cycle teams and externally with Network Rail, who have a statutory agreement which allows their vehicles access to the path to reach the railway lines.
2. What other options were considered?
The only other option considered was to provide guard rail at the kerb edge with Balgreen Road. However if lockable guardrail was erected along the edge of the footway, the vehicles would have to stop in the carriageway under the bridge to unlock the railings. They would be then be committing an offence as this section of road has zig zag lines marked on it for the pedestrian crossing.
3. What evidence / rationale was used to decide on the chosen solution?
Concerns about child safety were raised by the Balgreen Primary Association. These centred around the risks of children (particularly those walking / scooting / cycling to school) travelling down the path ramp failing to stop and entering the busy Balgreen Road carriageway. In addition, a public concern had been raised about the speed of cyclists using the ramp. It was felt that the existing arrangement of two bollards was ineffective in tackling either of these issues. As any solution would also need to require access to be maintained for tram and rail maintenance vehicles it was decided to use a barrier chicane formed of two lockable gates. A barrier chicane is a standard facility for off-road paths and is used widely in Edinburgh and the UK and is contained within Transport Scotland design guidance for cycle routes (‘Cycling by Design’).
4. Any impact assessment carried out for this solution/others considered?
No impact assessment was carried out for the installation of the barrier chicane as this is a standard type of facility that is already widely used in Edinburgh and across the UK. It has also been installed in line with the standards outlined in Transport Scotland’s ‘Cycling By Design’ guidance.
5. What was the cost of this installation?
The final costs of the manufacture and installation of the chicane are not available as yet. The costs of a similar feature installed elsewhere on the cycle network was around £1500; the cost has been met from the Council’s Safer Routes to Schools capital budget.
Posted 9 years ago # -
"2. What other options were considered?
The only other option considered was to provide guard rail at the kerb edge with Balgreen Road. However if lockable guardrail was erected along the edge of the footway, the vehicles would have to stop in the carriageway under the bridge to unlock the railings. They would be then be committing an offence as this section of road has zig zag lines marked on it for the pedestrian crossing."
their workmen can't park elsewhere and walk 10 or 20m back to do the unlocking? its just like all the park maintenance, they have to drive into the park to do it, no matter what.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I only discovered this route 3 weeks ago but been using it a lot a night. At night its sometimes open, even when closed with no one about its not much of an issue. I can imagine in the day when busy must be quite a pain. The biggest issues I have on this route the 2 stage junction and cyclist dismount signs.
When in my car I am not expected to dismount and push, it breaks the flow of the journey somewhat.
Posted 9 years ago # -
So, I've had a response from my loooong email on the various chicanes in and around Corstorphine.
Some positive words from the cycle team, recognising historic chicanes that aren't fit for purpose anymore:
Balgreen/Dovecot (both ends) - They will contact the landowner (whoever that is) to see what can be done, but supportive of the change.
Corstorphine Bank Drive/Forrester Road - Again will contact the landowner.
And some middling comments on recently installed/amended chicanes:
Balgreen Tram stop chicane: It is in line with 'Cycling by Design' and so " Because it is a standard facility and a relatively small piece of infrastructure it was not considered necessary or cost effective to consult cyclists specifically at this location"
Paddockholm: Whilst they have expanded the distance between the barriers (although not in accordance with the plans) given the path is only 2m wide, they can only give a 1m gap (rather than the 1.5m minimum in 'Cycling by Design'. to fit through.
And given concerns by local residents about conflicts with cyclists they are reluctant to do more.They did point out that it isn't actually on a signed cycle path, as Route 9 takes an on-road route further south at this point.
The Edinburgh Streets Design Consultation (now closed) has a section on cycle design which has a lot of similarities to the 'Cycling by Design' when it comes to chicanes.
And a glimmer of hope of future infrastructure:
Kaimes Road / Traquair Alley: Crossing will be considered for a toucan, but would need to "meet the appropriate design standards and is safe for all path/road users."
All in all, not a too disheartening response, but we do need to get past the words and get the historic issues sorted and change the mindset so that we don't keep creating issues.
Posted 9 years ago #
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