CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure

The Causey & the QBiC - Input Needed!

(40 posts)

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  1. Angus
    Member

    The current Causey proposals are here:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/jh9yxevidxh6kta/IFL%20Exhibition%20Boards%20250315.pdf?dl=0

    I think that it makes sense to include a segregated cycle lane in the proposals rather than as presently proposed suggesting cyclists and traffic cohabit in "shared space".

    If this was done it would strengthen the argument for upgading the rest of the QBiC from its current piss-poor state...

    I'm wondering if anyone is aware of any detailed factual review/evaluation of the QBiC that I can wave at the Council/designers to bolster the case?

    Posted 9 years ago #
  2. chdot
    Admin

    "I'm wondering if anyone is aware of any detailed factual review/evaluation of the QBiC"

    Good question!!

    Not aware of one.

    Probably worth doing by 'us' after Innocent link opens.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  3. SRD
    Moderator

    Didn't spokes do a survey?

    Not that that's what you're looking for. Would be good to do a proper survey of it and show how inadequate it is.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  4. chdot
    Admin

    "Didn't spokes do a survey?"

    Might have done a satisfaction/increased usage one(?)

    "Not that that's what you're looking for. Would be good to do a proper survey of it and show how inadequate it is."

    Yes, perfect opportunity once 'cross route' is open.

    Road surface at East Preston St. junction has been improved since QBiC 'opened' but there are still bad bits, missing white lines, mix of 20/30mph etc.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  5. i
    Member

    Ah, cynical me

    Comparing the preposed plans with the existing, it does look like a huge improvement by blocking motor traffic from West Crosscauseway.

    There are pitfalls to avoid:
    Shared Space
    Placefaking

    Will this be discussed at the AGM this monday evening?

    Posted 9 years ago #
  6. paulmilne
    Member

    Thanks, I've been wanting a closer look at the plans.

    My instinct is to be bolder and call for vehicular through traffic to be banned. A case may be made for a bus lane through the space, but certainly not private cars. There is a major parallel through route along Clerk Street etc, and parking, loading, waiting etc is already restricted all along this route.

    Stopping through traffic would have a positive knock on effect for the whole university district. Cycling and walking would be more pleasant, the cafe culture could really take off! I note Snax has already applied for a licence for outdoor seating to take advantage of the extended pavement on Buccleuch Street.

    Cars are really a blight in this historic district, and it's crying out for a more liveable streetscape.

    The only other thing I'd say about the plans would be to source some cycle friendly cobbled sets for designated cycle routes.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  7. LaidBack
    Member

    My instinct is to be bolder and call for vehicular through traffic to be banned. A case may be made for a bus lane through the space, but certainly not private cars.

    Think that's a good way to go. Was suggested before. We have enough parallel routes to handle this I think. Would make the shift away from private cars easier and more attractive. Bus use could even go up on this route without making cycling less attractive.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  8. i
    Member

    Two way bus street: we'd need a bus gate to prevent cars getting through. Too many buses would make it unpleasant to cycle along.

    One way street: room to make protected cycle paths both ways. Bus would have to find alternative route.

    No way street: great for bikes and walkers, buses would have to find another route.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  9. chdot
    Admin

    24 hours to experience a bit of what it could be like -

    Posted 9 years ago #
  10. neddie
    Member

    TROs for the Causey project are out:

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/download/2006/tro1644_the_causey_project - objections need to be in by 7th Oct

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/download/2004/rso-16-12_east_crosscauseway - objections need to be in by 14th Oct

    Related CCE thread:
    http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=904&page=2

    Posted 8 years ago #
  11. acsimpson
    Member

    Am I remembering correctly that you can't official comment in support but that the council will publish figures showing the number of supporting comments?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  12. LivM
    Member

    "A local campaign to keep the Causey open" https://www.facebook.com/Keep-the-Causey-Open-1823201374559730/

    Not sure what I think about this. Getting rid of cycle lanes on one street and getting a nicer quiet cross street.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  13. chdot
    Admin

    Maybe they are more concerned about point 3 - the parking...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  14. Frenchy
    Member

    Are they actually getting rid of the cycle lanes? It doesn't look like the road is getting narrower, so it'd be strange that there was no longer room for them. If they actually manage to stop people parking there, though, then the loss of cycle lanes would be worth it.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  15. gembo
    Member

    Some of the shopkeepers out that way park all day on double yellows. There are loading bays but they have several vans and it is better just to park outside the shop rather than a few metres down the road. Mostly this means they are in the bike lane despite it being quite far out into the road at this stage (to accommodate loading bays). Perhaps they were not consulted sufficiently?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  16. chdot
    Admin

  17. crowriver
    Member

    "Perhaps they were not consulted sufficiently?"

    Aye, that'll be it. The all purpose get out of jail free card.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  18. neddie
    Member

    Objections and/or comments on the TRO to be in today (7th):
    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/download/2006/

    For the RSO, you have until the 14th:
    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/download/2004/

    Posted 8 years ago #
  19. neddie
    Member

    Ooops, just seen from the Traffic Orders people:

    The closing date for the TRO has been extended to next Friday (14th), to coincide with the RSO closing date

    Posted 8 years ago #
  20. chdot
    Admin

    Sent this, but not in time for meeting mentioned!

    "

    Dear Southsiders and others cycling and walking through these parts.....

    The date for commenting on this 'Order' has been extended to the end of next week, Friday 14th Oct '16.

    Importantly also there is a meeting of the Southside Community Council at 7pm this coming Monday 10th October at the Kings Hall as above.

    I'd welcome any support there from the floor on Monday evening -especially if you live in the area- to deflect any ire that could be forthcoming from the Causey Development Trust (CDT)

    Interestingly our design struck a chord with the Southside Association such that they have written to the Council objecting to the current scheme and those at their meeting Tuesday last made their feelings known to the member of the CDT present who seemed quite oblivious to any negative comment.

    I think our tweaks to the current scheme make for an attractive, much safer design arrived at through direct engagement with residents and stakeholders in the Street.

    I attach a link to a 3D animation of our proposal c/w homespun English / Gaelic narration
    https://youtu.be/e0Tq8pznjaA , the TRO plan and our comparative plan of the entry to our Street.

    regards,
    Gordon Duffy Dip ID, MA(RCA), RIBA, RIAS
    Studio DuB
    Chartered Architects, Interior and Urban Designers
    17A/2 West Crosscauseway
    Edinburgh
    EH8 9JW
    tel. +441316681536

    http://www.studiodub.co.uk/

    "

    Posted 8 years ago #
  21. UtrechtCyclist
    Member

    By 'tweaks to the current scheme' they appear to mean keeping the causey open as a rat run... Sorry, shared space between rat running cars and pedestrians.

    I have issues with the narrowing of Chapel Street, but pedestrianising the Causey will be excellent, would be great if lots of us could respond to the consultation.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  22. chdot
    Admin

    "I have issues with the narrowing of Chapel Street, but pedestrianising the Causey will be excellent"

    Yes.

    I haven't studied the plans enough to understand why the C St lane 'has' to go to make this workable.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  23. kaputnik
    Moderator

    There's a group for your facebookers to check out here;

    https://www.facebook.com/Keep-the-Causey-Open-1823201374559730/?hc_ref=NEWSFEED ("Keep the Causey Open").

    I have met Gordon Duffy (Studio DUB is his architecture practice) and had a chance to chat with him and look round some of his designs at an architecture talk thing. He's a creative guy and seems open to a bit of thinking out of the box. He's involved with SEDA (Scottish Ecological Design Association) and dare I say it he's the sort of person whose on "our" side. It's worth giving his plans a reading and trying to understand his logic and motives.

    P.S. he's local to the Causey area as in very local as in as in check out his address on the above message and his practice is also his family home so I think has a vested interest in making it a nice place to work and live.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  24. LivM
    Member

    I had a long chat with Gordon's wife Rebecca last night (we play in the same orchestra) and she was discussing in detail that the proposals to turn the whole street into a shared space (i.e. no delineation between pavement and road), combined with the lack of front gardens on their bit of the road, mean that they literally couldn't step out of their front door without fear of being hit by vehicle (or bike)(and they have two small children who can't yet be expected to be cautious enough not to just run outside). It just looks as though they don't have enough space for segregation so they're just trying an "Exhibition Road" strategy but without the benefits of space.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  25. Klaxon
    Member

    I'd counter - in the TRO the proposed shared space accesses only a private car park of 10 spaces (Quarry Lane). This means the number of vehicles per hour will be very very low. Keeping it open right through means it can be used by any joe and his right foot to cut through to Buccleuch St.

    Whether or not deliveries take place from the lane or the main road isn't dependent on the lane being kept open as a through road, either.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  26. neddie
    Member

    I had the misfortune to be in a taxi the other day and the driver took a completely unnecessary rat-run though West Crosscauseway, charging through there at 30 odd mph.

    Needless to say I felt bad about it. Needless to say, there was no tip for the driver.

    It definitely needs closed to through-traffic.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  27. UtrechtCyclist
    Member

    Deadline for comments is today!

    I wrote the following in ten minutes, which you can tell by reading it (it wouldn't win me a Nobel prize in literature unless that whole stream of consciousness thing comes back into fashion). But there's no problem with poorly written and badly structured comments as long as we all get our opinions in!

    I very much welcome the principles behind the changes to the Causey. I walk or cycle between Montague Street and George square several times a week, at present I rarely use the Causey since it's unpleasant and car dominated, but hope that the proposed changes will really lift the area. I saw the public information board from the Causey Development Trust displayed on West Cross Causeway and went along to one of their information evenings, I really like the ideas behind what they are trying to do.

    That said, when the detailed designs came out there were several aspects that I think are disappointing. The removal of the bus stop on Chapel Street seems unnecessary, it is already the case that when a bus stops there at rush hour traffic behind has no option but to sit and wait, so I don't see why narrowing the road should mean that the bus stops can't be maintained.

    I'm also disappointed to see the cycle lanes on Chapel Street removed. Chapel Street is very busy and I don't think that raised tables and road narrowing will slow traffic enough, the road is still wide enough for two buses to pass each other on a corner, which means that it's wide enough for general traffic to travel quite quickly, very stressful if cyclists are in the main stream of traffic. I would like to see vehicle speeds reduced by the removal of the centre line of the road (which forces drivers to pay attention) and possibly the introduction of a zebra crossing across Chapel Street at the Causey. Pavements definitely need widening, but hopefully the uphill cycle lane at least can be maintained.

    I know that a local resident is campaigning to keep the Causey open to through traffic. I saw their leaflet, and thought that their point about the Chapel Street cycle lane and about forbidding loading by large vehicles on West Cross Causeway were well made. Most of their points however were about residents parking and maintenance of West Cross Causeway as a through route, I very strongly disagree with this. By pedestrianising the Causey this project will turn a busy rat run into a really nice space, I think it would be a great shame if that central ambition were derailed by the concerns of car drivers on the street. As their leaflet points out, there are over eighty residences on the street, I suspect that very few of those residences belong to people who own a car...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  28. UtrechtCyclist
    Member

    Lunch time challenge, write a two line email to the council in favour of pedestrianising the Causey.

    Taken from the 'keep the causey open' website:

    If you would like to comment on traffic orders TRO/16/44 & RSO/16/12, the deadline is TODAY, Friday 14th Oct. Email your comments / reasons -together with your address- quoting the order ref's as above now to: trafficorders@edinburgh.gov.uk

    Posted 8 years ago #
  29. neddie
    Member

    The Causey project is moving forward into its next phase, and carrying out a consultation on emerging options for amending the design proposals to address concerns raised by local people, following on from the TRO process in September 2016.

    We understand that you wish to be involved in further consultation on The Causey. Accordingly Causey Development Trust, in partnership with The City of Edinburgh Council, invites you to a Drop In event when you’ll have the opportunity to see and comment on the options and discuss them with the designers, Ironside Farrar.

    The Drop in event will be on 1 June 2017 from 6pm – 9pm in Room G.07a of the Informatics Forum, Edinburgh University, 10 Crichton Street, just opposite the Appleton Tower.

    We hope that you’re able to take this opportunity to participate in this consultation. As you represent a key organisation, your views are very important to us.

    In order to help us gauge numbers attending, please RSVP by Mon 29 May to info@thecausey.org.

    Yours sincerely

    Isobel Leckie
    secretary
    Causey Development Trust
    http://www.thecausey.org

    Posted 7 years ago #
  30. neddie
    Member

    Today!

    Posted 7 years ago #

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