CityCyclingEdinburgh was launched on the 27th of October 2009 as "an experiment".
IT’S TRUE!
CCE is 15years old!
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RULES No personal insults. No swearing.
Stunned this morning to discover the ASL in the outside lane of Morrison Street - Haymarket Terrace has gone!
I've always regarded the outside lane the safest in terms of negotiating the tram lines, so I've very disappointed CEC is not only trying to force me to use the inside lane, but making my choice to use the outside lane less safe!
I was so taken aback that I didn't pay attention to what changes may have been made to the inside lane, so don't know if that has been improved any.
That's recent and unexpected. A bit like their "no ASLs at the Milton end of Harry Lauder as bikes aren't supposed to be there". Hopefully there's still usually be a vehicle or two turning right into West Maitland in the rightmost lane of Morrison, behind which one can tuck onesself in the absence of hving a clearly-painted legal means of plonking at the start of the queue. I'll pop over at lunchtime for a photo and Clarence/FixMyStreet it to see what their excuse is.
I understand Haymarket is getting colour co-ordinated lanes as a temporary measure prior to remodelling of the junction.
The ASL removal might be linked?
Lunchtime today I saw a chap at waverely end of princes st get caught in the tram track (drifted in, he wasn't crossing). He went down, bike with two ortlieb panniers. Car behind. COuld have been nasty. But he was up very quickly. He parked his bike on the central reservation. He had kickstand on bike - think Spesh Sirrus as did his pal. Hope all OK.
"prior to remodelling of the junction"
??
I'm not sure this is entirely unexpected:
http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=11324&page=23#post-176984
Plans:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/yly4ah9jwpak0ba/P9_2_019_Haymarket.pdf?dl=0
Didn't realise the plans for the stupid IN THE GUTTER, SCUM lanes/lines had been agreed/okayed. Midline markings heading west also removed, but the left-hand bike-signs are on bare tarmac, not red chips or red paint.
Don't suppose they've considered what a bicycle-rider who wishes to turn right up Rosebery Crescent is supposed to do? Perhaps they think moving right across two lanes of aggressive taxis is fun and simple.
You said it yourself - cyclists are to ride in the gutter at all times. This means NO TURNING RIGHT, SCUM.
"CYCLISTS KEEP TO CYCLE LANE"
Yeah, that'll fix all the problems, don't know why it's taking so long.
Try explaining "it's a non-prescribed warning sign" to a frothing driver.
Sigh.
There should be a rule that wherever you put up a (non-enforceable) sign telling cyclists they should stay in the lane, there should also be a sign telling drivers they should stay out of the lane. At the very least then when a driver complains that you're not in the lane you can point out the plethora of drivers flouting their rule which is the only reason you're having to breach yours.
Because there will be cars in the bike lane, we all know that.
think there will be some movement of traffic islands and maybe lights is the way i heard it but not for a wee while
Since Haymarket Terr is one lane for driving in and one lane for bus stops, surely all motorised traffic could make it through the junction in one lane, leaving ample room for a cycle lane that has a good crossing angle, with white hatchings and/or kerbs to keep the 4-wheelers away.
I've just driven through there (sorry!) from Morrison St, and they have added red chips down the left hand side, which look pretty rough, and a must-be-almost-impossible left-hand kink at the end of the island outside the taxi drop-off/ old entrance section - not at all the smoothe curve in the plan linked to above. It made me giggle - you wouldn't have thought it was possible to make the junction any worse, but they have managed!
Spent about 5 minutes at Haymarket just observing how cyclists tackle the Morrison St to Haymarket Terrace section.
On a sample of about 15, there were two main techniques; 1) follow the new painted cycle lane including the very sharp left hand kink just before crossing the tracks, and 2) from about mid way along the painted cycle lane, cross the tracks at a much more acute angle. There was one outlier who went into the station jug-handle and, ignoring the red light, proceeded safely onto Haymarket Terrace.
I felt that following the paint was the safest approach, whereas those crossing at an acute angle gave me the heebie jeebies as it looked so close to getting the wheel caught in the tracks. Following the paint was inevitably slower. I also saw that when a west-bound tram was passing, there was absolutely no room for anything in the cycle lane.
My own approach, on narrow tyres, was a kind of compromise between 1 and 2. Follow the paint to the jug-handle exit and then make a slight left before turning right to cross at about 45°.
Basically though, it's crap design, and didn't have to be like this.
From the looks of it, though, the lane merges into one does it not (having had a proper look at Wingpig's pic in big), so if you were in the right hand ASL you'd have to merge across in front of traffic?
Apologies if I'm looking at it wrong, so long since I've been to that bit I'm not sure how it works - looks like in the past to get to Rosebery you'd start in the right hand ASL, then have to merge left into traffic, then turn right, whereas now you'd start int he left hand ASL (but if you knew you were turning right, not in the far left), and have traffic merging into you and then turn right? Anyone who uses this regularly able to explain how this will operate differently / more dangerously? (again, apologies if obvious, I don't really know the bit of road well)
If you're approaching it from Morrison Street and it's green and stays green, there's little change - you can either choose to go in the middle or right-hand lane of the Morrison Link/Torphichen Place junction ASZ depending on the amount of traffic in the right-hand lane further up, immediately prior to the right-turn-into-West-Maitland channel, but then once you're in the right-hand lane you can then stay in it, crossing the tracks as required then moving to the left once you're past the parked coaches if heading to Haymarket Yards. However, the (currently still partial) removal of the middle dashed line is a pain - previously this described the leftmost limit of where you could move to in order to get across the westbound tram tracks at the best angle, but with the line gone it's not so obvious where one can expect to move across to without encroaching on the left-hand-lane's space. Also, the removal of the paint appears to have cracked a chunk of track-concrete (shall get photos at lunchtime), resulting in a small hole, and if the middle dashed line returns a little further to the right then it'll reduce the maximal angle at which one can approach the tram tracks without going into the left-hand lane.
If the lights are red as you approach the end of Morrison St then there's now no right-hand ASL for getting a nice position ahead of motor traffic prior to performing said lane-taking track-negotiation.
Turning right into Rosebery is mentioned just because it's another reason for wanting to be in the right-hand lane - I seldom turn that way, but I like to go on the right for the better track-crossing angle and to get past the parked coaches at the tram stop.
Complaint with the cycle 'lane' itself is the same as it was when these plans were released - you're relying on paint to warn following left-hand-lane traffic that you're going to suddenly (not suddenly, but it would be to attention-deficient lane-ignorers) veer to the right, into THEIR SPACE.
Aha, thanks for that, makes sense in me head now. I happened to drive through there at the weekend, and the new little U-bend in the cycle lane is very odd indeed.
Some pictures of the new red cycle lane. It's the worst surface I think I've ever seen for new work and there is a raised surface and loose material round the tram lines
Can't work out whether to cry with laughter or sadness at that.
That is a death trap. No way am I riding that line.
It's clearly to force cyclists to use the traffic lights or fight the tram lines
Thanks for the photos. That's the line I've been using. New surface looks terrible.
It's a huge accident waiting to happen. I'll bet the light timings would allow a slow rider to be getting to that U-bend just as the lights for the taxi rank go green.
It's also very bizarrely telling cyclists to swerve out of, then back into, the lane. Someone will argue that the magic red chippings will mean that cyclists will do so safely because it's a cycle lane. Hands up if you've seen a car drive in a cycle lane....
If you use the lane you'll be damned into having to try rejoin the traffic you just left in a slightly different position and at a new and interesting angle. Or maybe just come to a dead stop and wait to be let in?
If you don't use the red lane then you'll be damned for not using it. And you still have to cope with getting across the tracks...
What is missing is a traffic island to protect cyclists as the cycle lane re-merges with the traffic lane.
PS. I'm not saying this scheme is good in any way.
So there's now three options for getting through the junction: the red one, the jug handle, or the stay-in-the-outside-lane-because-it-gives-you-the-best-angle one.
Surely all that money and effort expended in giving us three options could have been invested in doing it once and getting it right?
"What is missing is a traffic island to protect cyclists as the cycle lane re-merges with the traffic lane"
This, at the very very least, this.
Took some more pictures on the way back from lunch. The surface is worst near Morrison St where it goes from moon crater to gloss finish in patches
Of course, taxis never stop along the pavement there with double yellows and 2 bars on the pavement.
Not even for 20 seconds to drop off. Not even with their magic parking lights activated.
No.
Never.
tk's #11 photo just about shows in the distance the way conflict between cars and bikes is engineered in at the point where the cycle lane re-merges
Why on earth has the council still not built the Spokes two way cycle path? Is it trying to get people hurt?
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