Is the EW route being entered?
Dunno, but from the feedback on last year's bid made it clear that
a round the houses route wouldn't win.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
Roseburn to Leith consultation begins (and the debate continues!) CCWEL
(5559 posts)-
Posted 8 years ago #
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"Is the EW route being entered?"
Good question. I'm assuming CEC hopes to get some 'Sustrans money', but don't know if they are trying CL+ again.
"If so, needs to be Option A."
Yes, but.
Clearly resubmitting the plan that didn't win this year won't work - not least because more LAs will working hard to get CL+ money.
Submitting a plan without Option A would obviously be an instant fail, but I have the impression that some people judging the process expect better in other parts of the E-W route.
Suspect this sort of think (a couple of times every year) won't impress.
Posted 8 years ago # -
George Street isn't "officially" part of EW though is it?
Posted 8 years ago # -
I think it is really (separate/additional consultation too).
"
1-way Protected cycle lane
"
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/6669/roseburn_to_leith_walk_cycle_route_map.pdf
Whether the whole E-W route can be entered for CL+ as a coherent plan is perhaps an open question.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Just catching up on this thread. Having attended a George Street consultation event and having asked a council employee about George St when I went to an E-W consultation event, my understanding is that the plans are being drawn up separately. To say that the George St businesses have not been involved is just silly.
Many of the George St businesses are brands and chains and there are very few independent traders on George St proper to my recollection. I would hope that these businesses would be more engaged with the council on this project and that dialogue is more open and less panicked than with the small independent traders...
I understand that people are worried about change, but Mr Gregson's approach is so divisive that I am surprised that councillors are still listening to him.
Also, evidence from the George St trial showed that the trial layout increased footfall and if I remember rightly that the environment was considered better by pedestrians etc. So I believe there is already existing evidence to demonstrate the benefits of a revamped George St.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Oh, also. On a recent document, I saw that according to Friends of Roseburn Park the count of cyclists passing through stood at 450 by their numbers and something like 1900 pedestrians. I'm not sure how they arrived with those figures but there you go. By their own numbers cyclists are almost a quarter of users of the park... they were using these figures to argue for a community cafe where the old toilet block is at the moment. Using this logic, it would be great if those people also had the opportunity to stop at the shops along Roseburn.
Posted 8 years ago # -
I think the park cafe idea has gone away.
Posted 8 years ago # -
I think it's still on the cards to some degree. I was at a meeting in the last few weeks and it was decided that Friends of Roseburn Park will be working with the council to pull together plans for the toilet block. It might not end up a community cafe but that was their stated preference in the meeting.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Cycling along West Coates this evening there was a chap on an unlit bike making very slow progress. As I got closer I saw his bag was obscuring his rear light, so when I passed I politely pointed it out. I then realised it was everybody's favourite cyclist not using his beloved NCN1.
Being unlit on a segregated path would be less of an issue than on a main road of course.
Posted 8 years ago # -
@Stickman
That is quite delicious.
Posted 8 years ago # -
@IWRATS: he wasn't wearing his much-photographed helmet either.
Posted 8 years ago # -
@Stickman
Did you ask him why he wasn't riding NCN1 ?
Posted 8 years ago # -
I'm not really doubting you, you sure it was him??
Posted 8 years ago # -
Definitely. Even recognised his very squeaky bike as I passed.
My camera was running so I can check the footage later.
Posted 8 years ago # -
We HAVE to see the video.
:-)
Posted 8 years ago # -
Posting the video would be a bit much I think, but I've got it saved in case it comes in handy in future.
Posted 8 years ago # -
This is why the Vision thing is so succesful;
http://election-data.co.uk/how-do-you-feel-dont-ask
Facts about particulates, payback times and capacity just bounce off a cammpaign based on an emotional attachment to the present arrangements and fear of change.
We need a set of emotional arguments. Pride in the city. Protecting and nurturing our children. That kind of thing.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Perhaps we need to put some emotive posters up around Roseburn. Like this one:
cars pollution by Ed, on Flickr
Posted 8 years ago # -
@edd1e_h
Nice. But the gasmask wearers need to be little girls.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Or babies.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Can you imagine that cartoon on one of the giant digital advertising hoardings in Roseburn?
Crowdfunding anyone?
Posted 8 years ago # -
"We need a set of emotional arguments. Pride in the city. Protecting and nurturing our children. That kind of thing."
Yes, with or without 'facts'?!
Some interesting things at Spokes meeting last night showing attitudes changing
https://mobile.twitter.com/search?q=%23Spokesmtg
"
HankChief
HankChief @hank_chief
@LAHinds talks of getting the message out about studies showing shopkeepers over-estimate car based customers@EdinChamber
#spokesmtg
"
"reggie tricker
reggie tricker @reggietricker
'Seem to turn a blind eye to edinburgh's World Heritage Site being rammed full of cars and vans' - #spokesmtg"
"
reggie tricker
reggie tricker @reggietricker
Lack of exposure to evidence,examples and education of benefits of cycling contributes to businesses poo pooing idea in Edinburgh #spokesmtg"
"
LyndaKHaughney
LyndaKHaughney @LyndaKHaughneyPoint by @lahinds about importance of evidencing & promoting the business benefits of improved active travel infrastructure. #spokesmtg
"
Obviously the meeting was about 'business' and there's more to this than 'people (want to) cycle to shops'.
There are two places that need to be influenced Westminster/Holyrood and Edinburgh/local.
The latter might be easier with CEC elections coming up.
Plenty of groups that want a better/nicer Edinburgh - inc community councils!
Most(?) people seem unable to look beyond status quo/more of the same - especially when it comes to cars/traffic/parking.
But the increasing cycle budget and the (very) gradual rollout of segregated cycle routes show that things can/do change and (we believe, obviously) that's for the better.
Need some facts - including anecdotes of 'I didn't cycle until ... ', 'I cycle more now because ... ', 'I would cycle if'.
Real people who, for some reason, don't believe 'too hilly, too cold, too wet, not a proper way to travel' etc.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Travelling to European cities & enjoying the pedestrianized streets is a good point.
Why can't Edinburgh have streets like:-
Siena
Vienna
etcAlso enjoyed Lesley H's "mistruths" about Roseburn...
Posted 8 years ago # -
In some quarters it would be enough to suggest protecting Edinburgh from 'Glasgowisation'.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"This is why the Vision thing is so succesful;
http://election-data.co.uk/how-do-you-feel-dont-ask "
Well not sure that it is successful.
Noisy yes, column inches in EN - I think the ride to Roseburn got better coverage.
I think 'emotion before facts' is useful consideration. One problem now is the drift away from facts that are true!
Something has changed. Trump voters clearly regard a lot of what he said during the campaign as 'froth' and (it seems) won't be upset if he doesn't deliver on his 'headline promises'!
Not sure if Brexit voters feel the same.
So, go for a vision of a better Edinburgh where kids play in the streets, daddy cycles to work smoking a pipe, cafes takeover Princes Street (or Roseburn Park). (Other visions are available).
A 21st C mix of undoing things that have gone too far (car domination) and the best ways of running a progressive Scottish/European/World/Sustainable city.
Posted 8 years ago # -
daddy cycles to work smoking a pipe
Cracker, though in my vision daddy just cycles in circles smoking a pipe.
Posted 8 years ago # -
How about "Make Edinburgh Great Again!".
:-)
Posted 8 years ago # -
@rosie: Also enjoyed Lesley H's "mistruths" about Roseburn...
What did she say?
Posted 8 years ago # -
@Stickman
That she wasn't going to accuse an individual of lying but "stating mistruths" which deceived business holders.
First time I've seen her speak and was very impressed. Shows the power of a convert to a cause, as opposed to an "always convinced" evangelist.
Good talks from Hannah at Cycle Service on the rise of and challenges facing local bike shops in Edinburgh and @greenroofer on the Gogar BUG as well. His point regarding the change in emphasis between hard core cyclists when the group was formed to a more balanced profile today with many more occasional cyclists was very interesting.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"Don't misunderestimate the power of mistruths" as Dubya could have said about Trump.
Posted 8 years ago #
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