"local residents spokesman"
Where have I heard that before ?!
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
Craigleith cycle access restrictions
(105 posts)-
Posted 7 years ago #
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Yes, I wondered who "local residents spokesman" might be. I can't find anything in Craigleith-Blackhall Community Council agenda, nor minutes, though most recent minutes are from 6 months ago.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Good work @duncan
I don't think it will have been CBCC as two following twitter conversations show
Posted 7 years ago # -
Interesting Twitter thread.
I think the point above about the balance of safety is also relevant here. Someone above says a child was 'nearly' knocked down by a bike.
By contrast, car parks are far more dangerous (and occasionally, lethal). According to the AA, 'car-park bashes are the most common single category of car insurance claims. Amazingly 20 per cent of all claims – which if scaled up nationally would be the equivalent of over 6 million – are for damage caused in car parks.'
Source: http://www.theaa.com/insurance/news/car-park-accidents.htmlPerhaps it's time to turf the car park, and ask people to park outside??
Posted 7 years ago # -
There is a little residents group for Maidencraig Crescent, though they are usually more concerned about crime.
Posted 7 years ago # -
The one insurance claim ever made against me was because of a scrape in a car park in a commercial vehicle, the one time I didn't follow my ADI's advice of 'always always park at the back over 4 spaces in a vehicle this size, you might be able to park between the lines but if someone parks beside you you can't get out'
Posted 7 years ago # -
In response to a Sainsbury's customer feedback form, in which I said my loyalty for Sainsbury's Craigleith was in serious jeopardy, I received the following today:
"
DearThanks for getting in touch with us via our Tell Sainsbury's survey.
I can see that you've spoken with Michael, the Deputy Manager, who has advised that they're currently meeting with the Council on an on-going basis to rectify this matter. They're currently researching the safest route for cyclists with Ian and Robert from the council who suggested as a temporary measure, signage alerting the public about the cyclists route would be appropriate due to concerns and complaints from the wider community.
They're trying to find a way in which they can link the cyclists route to the road and vice versa to avoid stress and hazard for you, pedestrians and motorists. Michael explained they're all meeting in the store on 25/11/16 at 18:00pm, which you are more than welcome to join the meeting if you would like to contribute to this matter.
Thanks again for getting in touch with us and I hope this information was helpful.
Kind regards
Erin McEvoy | Sainsbury's Careline
Sainsbury's Supermarkets Ltd | 33 Holborn, London | EC1N 2HT
customer.service@sainsburys.co.uk | 0800 636 262
twitter.com/sainsburys | facebook.com/sainsburys
"I can't make the invitation for 25th November but I'm more than happy for someone to act as proxy if you want to pm me, and I'll contact Sainsbury's to tell them who will go.
For accuracy, it's probably @Duncan who contacted the deputy store manager, not me.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Hope someone can go to meeting. I've been going via road of late*, and don't feel very safe. The wide lanes seem to offer encouragement to MGIF drivers both on way in and way out.
It is also difficult to turn left from road onto cycle path.
Firstly (some) cars aren't very patient as one slows down to turn left at the crossing lights.
Secondly having to negotiate that ziggy zaggy gate immediately after turning left is awkward. I am novice cyclist so perhaps the more experienced amongst you don't find this awkward. But if "we" are trying to encourage more people onto bikes and to shop by bike then there will be others who have even less experience than me! They will also find this turn very awkward.
* I do still visit this store, but far fewer visits since change introduced because of the above reasons.
Posted 7 years ago # -
"if "we" are trying to encourage more people onto bikes and to shop by bike then there will be others who have even less experience than me! They will also find this turn very awkward"
Important point.
Even among 'experienced' cyclists slaloming, bunny hops etc. are not necessarily easy OR desirable.
As is said, 'infrastructure for 8-80' (or younger and older).
Posted 7 years ago # -
I'm going to the meeting, along with a rep from Spokes. If forum members have views you would like expressed, put them here and I will try to summarise.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Some progress on the cycle access issue at Craigleith Retail Park:
I met with the deputy manager of Sainbury's (Michael) this evening, along with a rep from Spokes. It felt like a constructive meeting, and I'm encouraged by progress.It seems that they did not anticipate the strength of feeling created by putting up the 'cyclists dismount' signs on the shared-use path. They are taking the issue of cycle access very seriously. Sainsbury's are currently in discussion with the Council about how to improve access for cyclists. "At the very least," the signage on this access route from S Groathill Ave will change to allow cyclists shared use with pedestrians. The wording suggested by the Council is "NARROW PATH [Bike graphic] SLOW" in large letters, and below this "[Pedestrian+Cyclist graphic] Please consider other users."
This seems entirely fair.
The Council are also working with Sainsbury's on tackling the practical issues of making this work as a cycle route. The main issue is how bikes join the road once inside the park. Access inwards can be achieved by dropping the kerb, and removing the sign that obscures the emerging cyclists vision of the traffic approaching from the right. Access leaving the park is more complicated: the bumpy trolley trap on the access road forces bikes against the kerb, just when they need to be positioned centrally on the road, to turn right onto the shared use path. The Council are looking at various solutions.
I left the meeting feeling confident that Sainsbury's are committed to improving cycle access, and are even a little apologetic about the current 'dismount' signs. In response to the initial complaints they had about irresponsible cyclists from local residents, these signs were all their facilities people had at their disposal. I am also encouraged that the Council are already working on a solution.
In some ways it's a small thing, but perhaps the strength of feeling generated by this one path is symbolic of the wider frustration that many cyclists feel about poor planning and poor cycle infrastructure. Hopefully this is a small step in the right direction.
Posted 7 years ago # -
"I left the meeting feeling confident that Sainsbury's are committed to improving cycle access"
Thank you for getting a meeting and going.
Posted 7 years ago # -
"In some ways it's a small thing, but perhaps the strength of feeling generated by this one path is symbolic of the wider frustration that many cyclists feel about poor planning and poor cycle infrastructure. Hopefully this is a small step in the right direction."
Yup.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Yes, thanks very much for going. I would've thought an option would be to cut a path through the existing bank of earth straight into the car park. Thereby eliminating the narrow, almost uncyclable (is that a word) next to the trolley trap.
Posted 7 years ago # -
@Duncan thank you
@Stiltskin, yes, that does seem logical! I suppose it would feed people into the retail park area not the Sainsbury's area, and perhas they have a problem with that. But definitely would have thought that losing scrubby bushes shouldn't be a big challenge.Posted 7 years ago # -
@Duncan Many thanks for pressing for the meeting and getting some progress.
Breaking through the narrow earth bank to the car park is the logical solution, otherwise leaving the path is still dangerous even with a dropped kerb, and returning to the path can be well-nigh impossible when the road is busy.
And @LivD, the route to Sainsburys could go behind KFC through the car park, which would be safe and convenient for trailers etc. I'm sure it would attract more custom both to Sainsburys and the other stores. Maybe the Retail Park owners could get involved?
Posted 7 years ago # -
@Duncan
Many thanks for going along. All sounds positive. I hope the momentum continues to flow!
Posted 7 years ago # -
As others have said, thanks for pushing forward with this Duncan. It is greatly appreciated.
I was at the playpark there with the little ones the other day with the bike and trailer, which I pushed along like a good law abiding citizen. I saw lots of other folk with bikes whilst we were there but not a single one had dismounted.
There has always been a problem with this shared use path (just not the one they are currently focussed on) so it would be fantastic if they plan and build something that actually works for both pedestrians and cyclists.
Posted 7 years ago # -
like a good law abiding citizen.
The point is. It isn't against the law. The signs have no legal standing.
Posted 7 years ago # -
@Stiltskin Indeed!
They have ticked the box by putting them up but the only effect they have had is to have annoyed some of their customers (or ex-customer in my case).
If all of this leads to better cycle access and "safer" access for pedestrians, then that is a good thing. The current path was poorly thought out in terms of how bikes access the road once it is in the retail park and vice versa.
Posted 7 years ago # -
If the problem of the shared path is resolved into Sainsburys/Retail Park. Then the subsequent problem is the whole carpark, traffic flows etc As it currently stands it is a hazard for all users cars, peds, cyclists. My suggestion would be to change the current two-way ring road to one way with a adjacent cycle lane also the same way, ped routes also need to be increased.
Posted 7 years ago # -
I was wondering as I cycled into Craigleith Retail Park last night whether there has been any progress behind the scenes....?
Or was sympathetic meeting simply a way to placate us for a while?
I've shopped here less frequently, but maybe they don't care!
Posted 7 years ago # -
I was wondering as I cycled into Craigleith Retail Park last night whether there has been any progress behind the scenes....?
Has anything changed in the seven months since the main discussion on this thread?
Posted 6 years ago # -
Sainsburys' clearly DGAF - I never shop there as a result of their attitude towards cyclists. My main complaint was lorry parking in Stockbridge but this just tipped me over the edge to boycott them.
Posted 6 years ago # -
I'd be keen to know if there was any movement. Last week I overheard a conflict between a young lady cycling from the retail park to the cycle path and an older man walking a dog: "Can you no' read?" and the lady replied something like: "Give it a rest you grumpy old man".
All avoidable, of course, if Sainsbury's just had a "Please consider other users" sign and just left it shared use.
Posted 6 years ago # -
"The point is. It isn't against the law. The signs have no legal standing."
Presume signs are still there(?)
Posted 6 years ago # -
we've stopped shopping there too. been past several times and couldn't face negotiating the path or the roads.. horrible.
Posted 6 years ago # -
From 7 months ago:
'Some progress on the cycle access issue at Craigleith Retail Park:
I met with the deputy manager of Sainbury's (Michael) this evening, along with a rep from Spokes. It felt like a constructive meeting, and I'm encouraged by progress.It seems that they did not anticipate the strength of feeling created by putting up the 'cyclists dismount' signs on the shared-use path. They are taking the issue of cycle access very seriously. Sainsbury's are currently in discussion with the Council about how to improve access for cyclists. "At the very least," the signage on this access route from S Groathill Ave will change to allow cyclists shared use with pedestrians. The wording suggested by the Council is "NARROW PATH [Bike graphic] SLOW" in large letters, and below this "[Pedestrian+Cyclist graphic] Please consider other users."' http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16940&page=3#post-237461
The signs are still there - nothing done.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Let us not forget that Homebase are also owned by Sainsbury's
Posted 6 years ago # -
"
Bunnings, part of Australia's biggest retail group Wesfarmers Ltd, completed its purchase of the Homebase chain from Home Retail last year.
"
Posted 6 years ago #
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