At least we can rely on the Tories not to take an decisions that would damage investor confidence or reduce the standing of the entire UK to that of international laughing stock...
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
The Sustrans proposals for Picardy Place/Leith Street
(868 posts)-
Posted 6 years ago #
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Posted 6 years ago #
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Entertaining piece by drarthur.
Hope he says more about this -
https://twitter.com/profscottthinks/status/944863632441184256
Posted 6 years ago # -
Has this been posted before?
Only just noticed, from a couple of weeks ago.
“
PICARDY PLACE: THE NEED FOR A NEW VISION
Stop being traffic planners; become urban designers
Read the full comments of the @thecockburn here: http://www.tinyurl.com/y8aybyv9“
https://twitter.com/thecockburn/status/941342522063966209
Says all the right things, but not proof read properly!
Posted 6 years ago # -
"Says all the right things, but not proof read properly!"
Bit like my response to the consultation then! :-)
Think I have a case of consultation fatigue now...
Posted 6 years ago # -
More seriously, perhaps need for a pause to see if lessons have to be learned -
Posted 6 years ago # -
Thought of the morning
There isn’t space in any iteration of the gyratory design for a cinema. The footprint of the building will be small. The value of the land is in the airspace, which is why commercially it would suit a hotel or offices, or pretty much any use other than a giant empty box with a projector in it.
What if Filmhouse were purely interested in tenancy of office space? And that’s now being spun as a lie-through-omission to put fear, uncertainty and doubt into people’s minds about design changes. Nobody cares where their back-office is.
Never mind that losing 3 lanes of road on one side (per y-design) actually makes the space bigger.
Also thought
It was an accepted fact at the City Chambers stakeholder event that the ‘hotel plans had fallen through and there were no current plans’ and this went unchallenged by either the council and the developer. So again, porkies through omission.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Strange story, BUT, a cinema could be built in the basement of a hotel/office block - like the deal that created the Traverse and made Planning process easier.
Would be very surprised if that's what's going on.
Think Filmhouse needs to say something.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Assuming the claim that the Filmhouse has top-secret plans to move to the middle of a roundabout are true, and this plan is being put in danger by the Council's revised designs is actually a good thing. Everyone campaigning on this issue is asking for reduced carriageway space and more public space - which would solve the problem of too little space for the new stealth Filmhouse.
It's the Council's rubbish design that is the issue, not the machinations of cyclists, pedestrians and people who like the odd breath of clean air.
Posted 6 years ago # -
“It's the Council's rubbish design that is the issue”
That’s the primary problem, but now the bigger problem is revising it with permission/agreement of (or compensation to) the developers.
Allegedly.
Posted 6 years ago # -
I'd see their point if there was planning permission granted for any part the site.
Posted 6 years ago # -
The following members of the Transport & Environment Committee have surgeries between now and the meeting on the 25th January:
Scott Arthur (Fairmilehead/Colinton)
Saturday 20th January: Oxgangs Library by appointment only. No time mentioned on website.Nick Cook (Morningside)
Monday 22nd January, 6pm at the Eric Liddell Centre (15 Morningside Road).Chas Booth (Leith)
Every Tuesday during term time 5.30pm - 6.30pm. Leith Library, Ferry Road.Additionally, the following members don't have set surgery times, but say to get in contact if you want a meeting:
Steve Burgess (Southside/Newington)
"If you would like to speak to me about any issue at any time please phone, email or write to me and we can arrange a convenient time to meet at a local venue, your home or the City Chambers."David Key (Fountainbridge/Craiglockhart)
"Mobile Surgery - Please contact me on 0131 529 3260 to arrange a meeting at a time and place that suits you."Gavin Barrie (Inverleith)
"If you need to meet with me in person, we can arrange a time and place that suits."Finally, the following members do operate set surgery times, but don't have any between now and the 25th. They may well be willing to meet to discuss any issues you have, anyway:
Lesley Macinnes (Liberton/Gilmerton)
Karen Doran (City Centre)
Graeme Bruce (Pentland Hills)
Scott Douglas (Corstorphine/Murrayfield)
Gillian Gloyer (Corstorphine/Murrayfield)
You know, just in case there's anything you want to raise with your local councillors. About anything, really, nothing particular in mind.
Posted 6 years ago # -
The gyratory still lives (Cllr Booth tweets)
"Interesting briefing on revised proposals for #PicardyPlace fr officers. Seems to be some improvement on shared space & public space. Need discuss w colleagues & stakeholders whether sufficient improvement. I suspect not.
Still need further conversation w colleagues & key stakeholders such as @SpokesLothian & @LivingStreetsEd. Good that more segregated space; not good that gyratory remains & design still seems to be led by traffic modelling, not placemaking."
Posted 6 years ago # -
Posted 6 years ago #
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If you want my more thought/action/progress -
http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=18531#post-272717
Posted 6 years ago # -
Email from Lesley with link to TEC report & drawings & proposed design
"The key changes to this new design include:
* Making the island site public realm
* Increasing the quality of public realm space within the overall layout of Picardy Place, in particular in front of St Mary’s RC Cathedral.
* Provision for funerals and weddings and the increase in disabled parking for St Mary’s RC Cathedral
* Fully segregated cycling lanes, including through crossing areas, between York Place, Leith Walk, Leith Street and Little King Street.
* Improved cycle connections to and from Broughton Street
* Pedestrian crossing outside the Playhouse
* The introduction of a taxi rank outside the Omni Centre"Posted 6 years ago # -
Posted 6 years ago #
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Personal remarks
Best of a bad bunch
What cycle facilities are provided appear to be decent on axis facing Leith Walk, Broughton St to Leith St axis (still) poor
Disappointed that taxi rank moved from Little King St where there would have been room for a huge rank, instead retained at Omni where there isn't enough room and drivers regularly back up into the road.
Bus lanes have reappeared on Leith St?
Glad to see lots of space in front of the Cathedral
Not a fan of the left filter lane towards York Pl (by some margin this is the scariest thing you can make me navigate)Posted 6 years ago # -
I'd say they have managed to make it worse, which I didn't think possible. There seem to be two extreme opposed positions;
1) Traffic good, hotel good.
2) People good, space good.Now there's no hotel and the traffic island will be a bleak no-man's land because they always are. Confident cyclists won't use the cycle lanes, not downhill anyway, so they'll just fall into disuse.
I regularly ride from Broughton Street up the Bridges. It's horrible. I could get off and push now if I wanted to. That seems to be the plan.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Is that four crossings required to get from Leith St cycle path to Broughton St?
EDIT: Three if you go onto the island at the crossing in the northeast corner.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Can anyone see how that design could be tweaked at some indeterminate future date once traffic levels have miraculously dropped to council targets (hopefully while I'm still outside the grave) to allow the island "public realm" to be joined to the pavement in front of the cathedral (as suggested by officials)? Because I can't.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Apparently the central island "has potential to accommodate a pavilion building with cafe, informal seating, street trees, cycle parking and hire, wayfinding and public exhibitions", all of which are things that are greatly enhanced by the diesel fumes of large vehicles idling at traffic lights and the rumble of circling buses, HGVS, cars and vans...
Posted 6 years ago # -
I'm going to have to print that document and rebut it point by point tomorrow despite my desire to get the metaphorical claidheamh-mòr out of the imaginary thatch right now.
Posted 6 years ago # -
My main use is Leith St to Leith Walk. The two way cycle path on the Omni side is going to be walking pace most of the time amidst milling pedestrians, perhaps ok for up hill.
If the downhill cycle path crossing doesn't have very favourable lights timings then it'll be pretty useless, so I'm going to be sticking to the road.
Then I have to make a sharp right turn amidst multiple lanes of traffic across two sets of tram tracks. Currently you only have to worry about errant roundabout joiners from York Place. Not great.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Oh well. We tried.
It's a bit better than it was, but essentially that's polishing a turd.
Let's hope the proposed changes in Holyrood Park bring happier news...
Posted 6 years ago # -
100,000 bus passengers a day and no bus priority measures at all!? The public transport interchange is a tram stop and a nearby bus stop across a 3-lane road.
Just trying to work out the cycle routing makes my head hurt.
Not to mention the "public realm" (they really love that term) will be a fume-swept wasteland.
I really think this has the makings of a scandal. The Growth Accelerator deal, made behind closed doors and principally to the benefit of a hugely rich private developer prevents our Council from producing the best possible design for the city - on pain of some huge financial penalty. Hopefully some Councillors will get their teeth stuck into this one.
Posted 6 years ago # -
“on pain of some huge financial penalty”
It’s time CEC quantified this.
Maybe it’s not as much as implied, and maybe worth paying.
OR, if SG cared more about the development of Edinburgh than Developers, it might call for a pause and a proper assessment of the whole thing.
Posted 6 years ago #
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