Conservative councillor John Maclellan has no problem with the plans:
What has been proposed seems like a sensible compromise which at least gets rid of one of the city’s most confusing roundabouts.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
The Sustrans proposals for Picardy Place/Leith Street
(868 posts)-
Posted 7 years ago #
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Well, it's certainly a compromise for cyclists, tram passengers who have to reach a stop located on a traffic island, bus passengers who have to run the gauntlet of multiple lanes of traffic, local residents who fancy some peace and fresh air, visitors who want to linger and anyone with hope that the city takes public realm improvements (and its own policies) seriously.
In fact, there only seems to be one group that doesn't have to compromise. Anyone care to guess who they might be? Here's a clue - they only account for 11% of visitors to the St James Centre.
Posted 7 years ago # -
https://twitter.com/lmacinnessnp/status/921399503466434560
"Some changes on timing and engagement re Picardy Place to follow...More, detailed consultation on design and island site needed."
Sounds like gyratory is not up for debate.
Posted 7 years ago # -
@Frenchy
We need to make it up for debate. The electoral cycle is against us, but Ms MacInnes can be made to feel the consequences of her actions in an STV system if the punters of Liberton and Gilmerton wish it so.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Are we not reading a bit much into the use of the word 'Island'?
Trying to think of another way that it could have been described in a non-gyratory sense and still hit 140 characters...
Posted 7 years ago # -
I don't think we're reading too much. The word "island" needs to be changed to "peninsula" and that's going to take a lot of effort still. But if it isn't, there will be consequences for Edinburgh transport lasting a generation.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Might be useful to point out to councillors that TfL have removed a gyratory at the other end of the A1 (yes, I know Picardy Place isn't quite on the A1). Before and after photos here:
The physical changes were combined with bus route changes and the movement of some bus stops. Despite what some people think, these aren't the subject of some divine plan and can actually be altered. If the tram is extended, significant changes to bus routes would seem to make sense.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Fair point, HankChief, let's hope so.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Spoke today with someone involved with this. They believe there is a "tiny" chance of there not being a gyratory.
Posted 7 years ago # -
"tiny" being resistance stronger than any politicians’ will/demand or just easier to stick to contract/planned timescale?
Posted 7 years ago # -
The latter, mostly. Officers say "deal with government and developer has been agreed; hands are tied."
Posted 7 years ago # -
Hold on. I’m saving my dirty diesel to go rolling coal round that gyration
Posted 7 years ago # -
Posted 7 years ago #
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“
And I have been frustrated by the pervasive excuses that are designed halt progress
“
citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=16085&page=39#post-264049
Posted 7 years ago # -
Frenchy - There is a deal between the council, developer and the Scottish Government. We don't know what it commits each party to do. I would be quite surprised if it absolutely required the Council to build a gyratory sketched out in 2007, particularly given the design is still being worked on.
My gut feeling is the contract is being used as an excuse for inaction. It's just more work to redesign the proposals than push on with what's already there - regardless of how poor the results might be.
Posted 7 years ago # -
"
Ian Mowat, chair of New Town and Broughton community council, said he would prefer the central island shrunk to allow more of the existing public space in front of St Mary’s RC Cathedral to be kept and the Paolozzi sculptures put back there.
“The community would like to see [the island as] public space, but maybe something useful – a cafe for cyclists might be possible,” he said.
"
I presume he's joking about the cafe, but things look better than a few weeks ago.
Posted 7 years ago # -
a cafe for cyclists
I might have boked a little
Posted 7 years ago # -
"Ms MacInnes can be made to feel the consequences of her actions in an STV system if the punters of Liberton and Gilmerton wish it so."
To be fair, it was the last council that made this decision. Or non-decision more like. Also, I fear that "the punters of Liberton and Gilmerton" are less likely to be fussed about Picardy Place than many...
However this really is "a sop":
"THE public are to be asked what should go on the island where the Picardy Place roundabout now sits"
How about a silver turd to echo the nearby bronze one?
Posted 7 years ago # -
Posted 7 years ago #
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How about a silver turd to echo the nearby bronze one?
[IWRATS]I thought the Paolozzis were already going back.[/IWRATS]
Posted 7 years ago # -
@Frenchy
Perfectly channeled there mate.
Posted 7 years ago # -
I wonder, given the TIE and hotel developer involvement, if this situation might be instructive here.
Posted 7 years ago # -
streets, with their rich communities, complex forms and multiple functions, are being reduced to nothing but “conduits for conveying cars and people”.
Quoted without Sheffield at start due to universal application. Deleting "people" also tempting.
Posted 7 years ago # -
@ unhurt
That’s the key bit, but Monbiot’s context worth posting -
“
Sheffield’s streets, with their rich communities, complex forms and multiple functions, are being reduced to nothing but “conduits for conveying cars and people”. Sterilised, featureless streets are the physical embodiment of a rigid and intolerant mindset, which itself arises from a rigid and unassailable contract. The flexibility that capital demands of the workforce cannot be applied to capital.
“
Posted 7 years ago # -
Spurtle plan, v2:
http://www.broughtonspurtle.org.uk/news/picardy-place-counterproposal
"The emphasis in this counter-proposal is on the quality of the Place, not the efficiency with which ever more vehicles could be channelled across town and funnelled in and out ofthe cavernous new St James Quarter car park.
It follows the City of Edinburgh Council’s 2016 Active Transport Plans promoting travel by tram, bus, bicycle and on foot. It adheres to the Scottish Government's Designing Streets policy statement of 2010. It respects the city of Edinburgh.
Posted 7 years ago # -
The latest proposal from Zone published in the Spurtle looks much better.
I still think the cycle lanes should be uni-directional on each side of the road, though. How would bikes access the shops on the north side (Union Pl.), e.g. Tesco Express / Giuliano's?
Posted 7 years ago # -
Nipping across a couple of crossings versus dealing with a gyratory is acceptable enough, I think.
Posted 7 years ago # -
@chdot agreed!
If I ever meet The Spurtle I hope they'll let me buy them a nice drink.
Posted 7 years ago # -
It would provide a public space of which Edinburgh could be proud rather than terrified or ashamed.
The heart of the matter right there.
Also possible that Edinburgh councilors don't want the town to have a public square where crowds can gather for some reason.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Useful advice for campaigning (from Morningsider).
Posted 7 years ago #
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