CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure

More not so new trains for Scotrail?

(50 posts)
  • Started 8 months ago by Tulyar
  • Latest reply from crowriver

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  1. crowriver
    Member

    "It was triggered by one of the class 385 trains suffering a brake fault on the line at Winchburgh yesterday, which blocked the line and caused significant disruption."

    Aha! This was passed off as vague "signalling problems in the Dalmeny area" yesterday. I was an hour late as a result. Or maybe they had "signalling problems" AND a stuck train?

    Posted 2 months ago #
  2. Klaxon
    Member

    There was also separate signalling problems at Dalmeny

    Posted 2 months ago #
  3. crowriver
    Member

    Oh well, just a bad day on the railways all round then.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  4. crowriver
    Member

    I'm much more excited about this than I probably ought to be.

    ---

    First refurbished high-speed train starts on Aberdeen-Edinburgh line next week

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-45800463

    Posted 2 months ago #
  5. chdot
    Admin

  6. gembo
    Member

    That is unfortunate although Mr Husskisson of Liverpool was the first fatality on a train journey which occurred on the err, inaugural Liverpool Manchester jaunt of The Rocket. He had been on the train on the other track but had alighted to repair his damaged relationship with the Duke of Wellington. The Rocket came up the other line and walloped him. 1830.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  7. jonty
    Member

    Mr Husskisson was actually an MP! Yet the line was a roaring success within a month. I wonder if today's operating companies wish that they could kill senior parliamentarians with similar impunity today.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  8. crowriver
    Member

    Train derailed at Stonehaven means no trains to Aberdeen from central belt today, all stopping at Dundee. Class 170, looks like a pretty bad one judging by photos online. Luckily no passengers aboard.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  9. gembo
    Member

    @Jonty, my pal Big Davie used to live in Husskisson St in Liverpool. Taxis would go no further than the top of the road as that was deemed Toxteth.

    The death of Husskisson was seen as an added bonus to the train route being created.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  10. Tulyar
    Member

    A major shortage of 125mph trains is causing all sorts of problems. Scotrail cannot get modified carriages through Wabtec in Doncaster, and LNER cannot run their new electric trains over much of the electric route because the power electronics start sending false information to the signalling... oh and ORR has not approved the trains because train surfers could climb up exposed cables between the carriages - something that was found out 20 years ago on new trains for WCML...

    But pragmatic as ever Scotrail is going to use unmodified slam door HST carriages, and because there are no bike spaces on these, there should be Coach A's with van space in the interim.

    There will only be 2 spaces reservable, whilst the services are 'floating' between Class 170 and HST operation, as they have (sensibly) done before Scotrail and Transport Scotland are delivering the new services in steady stages rather than a big bang, which means that when the glitches do happen, the service doesn't totally collapse.

    I suspect that the special run problem might be linked to the fact that a special braking system for GWR only had to be taken out for running in Scotland, but was (on the new train) still in place and possibly being used for a speedometer signal.

    Other news is that further meetings have taken place on the bikes & backpacks carriages (again introduced in stages, 1-2 by summer next year) for the West Highland line. Not much can be reported yet as details may still change. It does however look as though the service will have capacity to accommodate groups on the classic tours up the Western Isles, usually a ferry out from Oban and back via Uig or Ullapool, avoiding the logistics headache of having a support road vehicle to one ferry pier and back from another.

    There is a quiet collation of data that can ensure the initial delivery goes on to the services where it will be most needed. Given that I was putting cyclists on the 08.30 Citylink coach (976) to Oban because every space on the 08.21 train to Oban on Saturdays was solidly booked in May I suspect I know where this capacity is going to be most needed. Any other thoughts on which current trains need that extra space?

    Posted 2 months ago #
  11. LaidBack
    Member

    @Tulyar - thanks for that detailled overview.

    I had insider say same thing about the new HSTs initially having manual doors as unable to convert enough in time. Seems that all rail projects run late!

    I'm really excited by prospect of the 'outdoor activity equipment coach' proposal.
    You say... "further meetings have taken place on the bikes & backpacks carriages (again introduced in stages, 1-2 by summer next year) for the West Highland line."

    Bearing in mind the delays common with matters rail, this sounds very hopeful.
    Assuming they can only attach one extra coach to trains that split at Crianlarich, is the choice either Oban or Fort William? Assume they should have more than one of these coaches. If so they should allocate one on a return train from FW. Last train south capacity is always a worry.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  12. Tulyar
    Member

    Last train from FW is Serco - current trains have 31-seat BSC with awkward to access van space - 6 hooks but room for more - new stock will have larger space.

    Ticketing & seat reservations on Fort William-Edinburgh a bit messy, but if you have all services, all routes ticket, you can use it Train arrives Glasgow QS 00.15, and Edinburgh 01.15-ish. Northbound service departs Edinburgh 04.50 & Glasgow QS 05.48.

    Strictly you won't be allowed to catch 00.15 Glasgow-Edinburgh, unless you work for Serco, or we press that Serco is allowed to pick-up passengers here.

    1 complete anonymous (purple) 5+2 HST with slam doors & coach A at Perth on Saturday.

    Detail varies one source says train length limit is 6 x 23m coaches, another says 7 can fit in the platforms/loops. The clearances for the new carriages have also to be signed-off for each route, so the first services might be restricted to Glasgow-Oban as a fall-back. Current t/t has 2 coach Oban only 05.20/10.37/... and 2 Oban + 4 Fort/Mallaig(2) 0821/18.12 (or 16.12?) if only 6 coaches a challenge as 08.21 often has fully booked Oban & only 25-50% of FW space taken.

    Discussions with 2 Scottish-based cycle tour operators providing essential detail on how to make maximum use of the added capacity on the trains, and using Citylink coaches (914/915/916 - 976 -926 & 961 plus other routes) Anyone remember Bespoke Bicycle Tours? (late Ian Pragnall & Bill Owen) thus worked with the Booking Office staff at Fort William to organise group travel on West Highland Line with bikes.

    I'm pulling in this detail for the marketing/management input to the West Highland Line project.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  13. LaidBack
    Member

    Good info. I remember how complicated and unwelcoming using the sleeper to Edinburgh was so had gone off that as viable option.
    Mrs LB and I use a folding tandem. This item is actively targeted as it can't hang up easily. Some WH guards go crazy if bikes aren't hung by back wheel and guy said 29'ers were something he disliked too. All with the best of west coast humour of course.
    I've seen tourists told off for trying to hang from front wheel.

    Would be nice if some bike space (or space) could be horizontal. Our bike is under 150cm long when folded but wider of course.
    It fits 170s ok and on fold up seat electrics even allows space for a pram. Last time we went WH the guard insisted we break it into two to hang up or face getting thrown off train. This was the only one other bike in alloted area, but rules are rules. Another passenger thought we should complain.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  14. crowriver
    Member

    This evening I glided home from Dundee aboard a newly refurbished ScotRail HST.

    Wonderful. Quiet, comfortable, loads of seats and space. A buffet car too if you like that sort of thing. Only slight niggle was unable to connect to wi-fi. No biggie.

    I disembarked at Waverley in a very good mood indeed. Felt like a proper train journey. Looking forward to more of the same...

    Posted 1 month ago #
  15. chdot
    Admin

    Problems even included the wrong type of thread being used in their new carpets.

    https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/best-railway-scotland-s-ever-had-delayed-by-wrong-type-of-thread-1-4820045

    Posted 1 month ago #
  16. acsimpson
    Member

    After CCE provided yet another useful function I was at https://scotrail.delayrepaycompensation.com/

    There image of choice is of a refurbished HST train running in snowy conditions. Perhaps not the best choice given the introduction of the trains but it was only after a few minutes that it struck me how false it is given the lack of snow since their refurbishment.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  17. ejstubbs
    Member

    A source tells me that there will be six refurbished sets and four "classic" sets operating once the new timetable comes in to force in December.

    @acsimpson: "HST train" is a redundant acronym phrase. Like "PIN number" and "ATM machine". See RAS Syndrome.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  18. crowriver
    Member

    'six refurbished sets and four "classic" sets'

    Presume "classic" means slam doors? Not a huge issue except the old leaning out of the window to open the door (as I did recently on LNER). If from Great Western then the interiors have had a refurb anyway, unlike the 1970s era carriages being towed by huge DB diesels on the Fife peak time services - which in fairness, are very comfy.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  19. ejstubbs
    Member

    @crowriver: Presume "classic" means slam doors? Not a huge issue except the old leaning out of the window to open the door

    I believe it also means that the toilets will empty straight on to the track, as retention tanks will not have been retro-fitted. Not so much of an issue for passengers but definitely not popular with permanent way workers.

    I believe some, if not all, of the class 158s currently in use Edinburgh-Aberdeen do have retention tanks, so in that sense switching to unrefurbished mark 3 stock is a step backwards.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  20. crowriver
    Member

    "the toilets will empty straight on to the track"

    There were signs in the loos of the LNER service we were on asking not to flush the toilet in stations, presumably for the same reason.

    It's a pity they've hit production snags with refurbishing these carriages, as once done they're really very pleasant to travel in.

    Posted 1 month ago #

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