CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure

Commercial attraction plan for Forth Road Bridge

(34 posts)
  • Started 11 years ago by crowriver
  • Latest reply from minus six

12

  1. crowriver
    Member

    IT MAY face early retirement because of the strain of the job, but it now has the prospect of a new lease of life as a tourist attraction. The 49-year-old Forth Road Bridge would be transformed into a commercial Sydney Harbour Bridge-style visitor attraction after traffic is switched to the adjacent Forth Replacement Crossing in three years, under new plans being considered.

    With the removal of most of the 65,000 vehicles a day pounding its deck, the bridge could be opened to tourists to explore the structure, including the top of its 500ft-high towers.

    Local business chiefs hailed the scheme as a “massive opportunity”, which would build on celebrations to mark the bridge’s 50th birthday next year, the Forth Bridge’s 125th in 2015 and the opening of the new road bridge the following year.

    First Minister Alex Salmond is keen to showcase the bridges to the world to highlight Scottish engineering expertise, with the Forth Bridges Forum, which includes transport, heritage and tourism bodies, established to draw up plans.

    The Forth Road Bridge would be reserved for buses and taxis, making the existing foot and cycle paths, segregated from the main carriageways on either side of the bridge, a much more pleasant experience.

    There is also thought to be scope for increasing the number of people able to visit the top of the towers by internal lift, which few have experienced so far.

    Catwalks under the bridge deck could also be opened, although extra safety barriers would be required.

    http://www.scotsman.com/business/media-and-leisure/commercial-attraction-plan-for-forth-road-bridge-1-2795132

    What? You mean it is NOT FALLING DOWN? Then why are you building a 'replacement'?

    Posted 11 years ago #

  2. Cyclops
    Member

    So we may now have hordes of tourists to share the cycle/footpath with? Or they could always let us use the carriageway as it should be pretty quiet if it's just limited to buses and taxis.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  3. LaidBack
    Member

    Going Nowhere - The Forth Bridge Experience ©

    Scotland's new drive on attraction offers a jam-packed day out for all the family.

    • 800 'on bridge' parking spaces with views across Forth
    • Bungee jumping
    • Kite flying
    • Kite Boarding
    • Scattering Ashes
    • Tour the bridge by green powered Segways
    • Take the green energy lift to the green energy tower - home of Scotland's biggest wind turbines (weather permitting).
    • Viewing platform
    • Admire the bridge garden and pitch and putt course

    Re-live the endless queues before the Resilient Bridge was built.

    Actually that all sounds believable. Satire is defenceless against 21st Century marketing.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  4. Nelly
    Member

    Queues in S Queensferry today - doesnt need more traffic

    Posted 11 years ago #

  5. Uberuce
    Member

    Someone call William Gibson. He's got a couple of books set around a similarly retasked Golden Gate. Well, it's not a tourist attraction so much as a favela, but it's not used as transport any more.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  6. amir
    Member

    Also Iain Banks: The Bridge.

    I'd quite fancy a cafe in the middle.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  7. chdot
    Admin

    "I'd quite fancy a cafe in the middle"

    Forth Free State - neither Edinburgh nor Fife?

    Posted 11 years ago #

  8. Wilmington's Cow
    Member

    Less likely to fall down if you take 65,000 vehicles a day off it, so why not use it for something else alongside buses and bike traffic? Genuinely confused as to why there'd be any opposition here to something like this (especially as a 'retasking' would surely make it more difficult for it to revert to 'general traffic' duties).

    Posted 11 years ago #

  9. Morningsider
    Member

    I've been up both the Sydney Harbour Bridge and the Forth Bridge (rail). Both spectacular structures - just the weather was a little better at one. Can you guess which it was?

    Posted 11 years ago #

  10. Wilmington's Cow
    Member

    Is this like an episode of QI and everyone will say 'Sydney' then a klaxon will go off? ;)

    I would definitely be in the queue to go to a viewing platform at the top of the bridge.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  11. steveo
    Member

    Less likely to fall down if you take 65,000 vehicles a day off it, so why not use it for something else alongside buses and bike traffic?

    Besides if it has its own revenue stream its much less likely they'll just close it after the new bridge is up and running and it is realised having a bridge for buses is madness.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  12. crowriver
    Member

    For me, the whole thing just smacks of "We can't justify spending money on a bridge that's just for buses, taxis, cyclists and pedestrians. Quick! Think of something else we can do with it!" It is indicative of exactly what is wrong with transport strategy in Scotland. I mean fine, yeah, have some tours, refurb the lifts. But why the big song and dance? Answer: don't upset the drivers!

    The fact that several posters here take a similar view is, frankly, depressing.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  13. steveo
    Member

    Frankly I don't see how we can justify a bridge for buses, there will be, what, a dozen or so an hour? How many active travel users does the bridge see an hour? That's not to say the old bridge should be closed or to say that it should continue to convey all traffic just that the replacement is madness.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  14. kaputnik
    Moderator

    It will be a fantastic monument to the failure of Scottish transport policy.

    "Come see this bridge we build 40 years ago as the bridge to end all bridges. You get fantastic views of the new bridge we've just spent £1.3 billion on because we keep building things to encourage more and more reliance on driving as the only way to move people around the place".

    In another 30 or 40 years time they can do the same when we have to close the Fifth Bridge to traffic and there will be marvellous views of the Sixth Bridge from both the Forth and Fifth bridges.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  15. Wilmington's Cow
    Member

    "The fact that several posters here take a similar view is, frankly, depressing."

    That would be fine if the 'several posters' here were looking at it from the point of view of "We can't justify spending money on a bridge that's just for buses, taxis, cyclists and pedestrians. Quick! Think of something else we can do with it!" whereas it might be the case that they're actually thinking that, with less heavy traffic on the bridge, they can do something else with it... I fail to see the problem, honestly.

    The new bridge is daft, too much money, and with proper investment in alternatives just not necessary. But it is being built, and the current bridge will have lighter traffic, which does open up other opportunities. I don't really see them doing this as a sop to motorists (though I may be wrong), but rather a useful tourism revenue creating option for something that will still cost a lot of money to maintain.

    Fortunately the world isn't so black and white that if you like an option it has to be because you're in the pocket of the motoring lobby - shades of grey allow other considerations.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  16. crowriver
    Member

    I said similar, not the same. Similar: Having a resemblance in appearance, character, or quantity, without being identical.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  17. kaputnik
    Moderator

    The bridge is a fantastic piece of engineering and people should be able to behold it and marvel at it up close, in all its glory.

    I assume that in the name of "resilience" they will maintain the structure as a backup for the new bridge if/when it breaks too, so we can't have any schemes that might infringe on the existing carriageways.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  18. crowriver
    Member

    I assume that in the name of "resilience" they will maintain the structure as a backup for the new bridge if/when it breaks too

    Or indeed if/when the new bridge is completely clogged with traffic. Rush hour congestion alleviation, anyone? Also one can envisage a scheme whereby say, multiple occupancy cars, electric vehicles, City Car club cars, min buses etc. are allowed to use the bridge as a matter of course, in order to justify its upkeep. No doubt this will require a multi-million pound intelligent traffic management scheme (based on license plate recognition, like the London congestion charge) or somesuch.

    Gotta keep that traffic flowing after all.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  19. LaidBack
    Member

    I would definitely be in the queue to go to a viewing platform at the top of the bridge.

    ... The green energy lift to the viewing platform will only work on days when it's too windy to open the platform

    Posted 11 years ago #

  20. chdot
    Admin

    "The green energy lift to the viewing platform will only work on days when it's too windy to open the platform"

    Classic!

    Posted 11 years ago #

  21. Morningsider
    Member

    WC - it's too early on a Monday for such larks. Syndey had far better weather.

    My understanding is that the current FRB is being maintained for cyclists, pedestrians, buses and taxis as doing so allowed the Scottish Government to remove bus lanes and cycle/walkways from the design of the new bridge. This reduced the initial cost of the new bridge by over £1bn.

    The Scottish Government couldn't afford the cost of the full-spec new bridge (doing away with tolls not such a good idea after all) so decided to go for a cut price version (really). They came up with the wheeze of keeping the old bridge open to non-car traffic to add a "green" spin to the project and leave open the option of re-opening the bridge to cars at some point in the future.

    The saving is a short-sighted one. The cost of maintaining the FRB will mount up over the years and may even reach the saving on the new bridge eventually. However, that's a problem for a different generation of politicians to deal with.

    Scotland alway seems to end up with sub-standard infrastructure due to some short-term, low political machinations.

    Worth pointing out that the second Severn Crossing was built at precisely no cost to the taxpayer - with all costs being footed by bridge users paying tolls.

    Raising a few quid from tourists seems a reasonable idea to me - but it won't come close to covering the costs of running the FRB.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  22. Wilmington's Cow
    Member

    "I said similar, not the same. Similar: Having a resemblance in appearance, character, or quantity, without being identical"

    Which gives a lot of leeway to be made depressed!

    Posted 11 years ago #

  23. LaidBack
    Member

    Ok - I made that up....!

    I do see the whole Forth corridor becoming a bit of a test case for the one car, two votes approach to transport that seems to happen here.

    The increased traffic will no doubt result in more park and rides - possibly another one on the entrance to the old bridge? Stagecoach will benefit greatly if their buses can get a good run into town.

    The re-organisation of roads is massive when you look here. I think there's no reason that bikes + green vehicles (of various types) couldn't be allocated part of the old A90? Segregated but alongside?

    I'd also like to see more rail based commuting using electric trains - there is some signs that this may happen albeit in much longer timescale.

    I take it this map is correct as it's from a few years ago? Has anyone found a better ref?


    New Forth Bridge Road Layouts by LaidBackBikes, on Flickr

    © SABRE The Society for All British and Irish Road Enthusiasts

    Posted 11 years ago #

  24. minus six
    Member

    FRB is already a fun park, and always has been.

    Anyone who regularly cycles over FRB, particularly at weekends, will be familiar with this fact.

    Families allowing their dogs to roam around without leads, kids and toddlers running about unsupervised, gaggles of tourists behind cameras, and lets not forget the charity fun runners.

    None of these groups pay any attention to the cycle lane. To them, the entire bridge length is already a legitimate fun park.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  25. kaputnik
    Moderator

    So it looks like the A90 is pretty much redundant for much of its length on the south of the Forth now, after they just spent a couple of hundred millions upgrading the M9 spur / A8000 route!

    Now there's no excuse not to upgrade and have a properly sized, segregated and grade separated cycle route directly to the "old" bridge from Edinburgh.

    I assume the fact that traffic from Fife will now be arriving into Edinburgh on either M8 or A8 has been taken into account, as that ultimately feeds onto St Johns / Glasgow Road or the Calder Road.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  26. PS
    Member

    Nah, the road from the new bridge will join up with the A90 - take a look at the "key plan" here:
    Plans and stuff

    Posted 11 years ago #

  27. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Ah, so Laidback's map is a drivering forum in-joke?

    Posted 11 years ago #

  28. LaidBack
    Member

    No - I did try and find an accurate plan but this is what kept coming up...

    This is what it should be. Thanks PS.

    Image © Transport Scotland


    Current road plan for new Forth Road Bridge by LaidBackBikes, on Flickr

    Posted 11 years ago #

  29. cb
    Member

    "drivering forum in-joke"

    A drivering forum wish list I think; a bit like when we fantasise about cycling through the Scotland St tunnel.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  30. kaputnik
    Moderator

    That big dog-leg around the Dundas estate makes it look like it was designed by a cycling infrastructure planner! I think my point still stands that the A8000 replacement was a short-sighted waste of money - they must have been thinking about the new bridge at the time and now the route to it is really indirect.

    Shall we start a sweepstake to see how long it will be before a direct motorway link is required from points 4 to 11 on that map as all the traffic has destroyed the A904?

    It should have been obvious to Keith Broon all along that what he really needed to do was to knock down the Forth (rail) bridge and stick an 8-lane motorway down that most direct and straight routes into town.

    Posted 11 years ago #

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