CityCyclingEdinburgh was launched on the 27th of October 2009 as "an experiment".
IT’S TRUE!
CCE is 15years old!
Well done to ALL posters
It soon became useful and entertaining. There are regular posters, people who add useful info occasionally and plenty more who drop by to watch. That's fine. If you want to add news/comments it's easy to register and become a member.
RULES No personal insults. No swearing.
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We make better drivers and riders
Everyone at IAM RoadSmart shares this mission. Our amazing volunteer group network, our professional trainers, our Examiners, our Driver Retraining Academy team, all of us want to help you to become a better driver or rider.
We aim to inspire all road users to be the best they can be. We develop the skills of all licence holders through our advanced courses, business programmes and introductory sessions.
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'We also have views on which laws to obey'
Not directly related, but -
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Across Edinburgh and Midlothian there will be a mix of new camera types in areas where there has been a concerning number of injury collisions with excessive speed a contributory factor.
The first three sites have been identified on the A701 Liberton Gardens, Edinburgh; the A768 Lasswade Road, Lasswade; and the A6094 Salters Road, Dalkeith. Enforcement will be carried out by mobile camera vans which will regularly be at each of the locations to check the speed of vehicles.
Another three locations are currently under review and will become active in early 2017. Details of all six new locations will be will be updated on the website http://www.safetycameras.gov.scot as they become live.
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"...a concerning number of injury collisions with excessive speed a contributory factor."
Were they having a jargon competition when they wrote that or are they deliberately trying to hide behind a smokescreen of little activity.
Is one injury not concerning?
Is it less concerning if "excessive speed" isn't a contributory factor?
Is there a level of speeding which is considered to be non-excessive, if they simply mean speeding why not use plain language?
"Enforcement will be carried out by mobile camera vans which will regularly be at each of the locations..."
Is this the same regular as I get paid (monthly) or perhaps quarterly? Presumably it's not frequently though or they would have said so.
Why even tell people which areas? Will the vans also be clearly marked so drivers can know when they can and can't speed?
"Why even tell people which areas?"
I presume it's illegal not to.
"Will the vans also be clearly marked so drivers can know when they can and can't speed?"
See above.
Yes I think legislation (or guidelines) were changed to make sure speed cameras are all prominently positioned in Hi-viz cladding, and all the locations of fixed and mobile cameras are publicly available. Tomtom-type things even update you with the locations of fixed and mobile cameras.
This is ostensibly so that tickets cant be challenged as entrapment or whatever of the otherwise law abiding motorist (OLAM) but personally I believe it's a load of Rocky mountain oysters.
Why even tell people which areas?
Local residents will be pleased that action is being taken. Not effective action, but action all the same.
"Why even tell people which areas?"
"Will the vans also be clearly marked so drivers can know when they can and can't speed?"
It is not a legal requirement to tell people where the cameras are or to use marked vehicles. It is Government policy, in an attempt to head off criticism from some of the 'motoring lobby', and ignores the high level of support for camera enforcement found in proper surveys. Telling people which areas have cameras might increase the effect in those areas, but might (probably will, imho) reduce any effect elsewhere.
Not directly related, but a question of priorities and what the Police think the public regard as 'acceptable enforcement'
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ScotGov Justice (@ScotGovJustice)
02/12/2016, 12:10
@policescotland stop a driver on average every 2 minutes #dontriskit - don't drink & drive @MathesonMichael @ScotGovJustice @RoadSafetyScot
http://pic.twitter.com/yNf0f0cQAv
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in response to previous page: "It's an astonishingly poor rate of detection."
"Give me a speed detector and I will find you hundreds of drivers on London Road going over 30mph."
Published government data from 2011 showed that vehicles were exceeding the speed limit 38,000 times per day at camera sites in Edinburgh. This included 1300 per day on London Road.
"This included 1300 per day on London Road."
So, we have 'facts' about a problem that could be dealt with by a bit of engineering - plenty room for some segregated bike lanes - and/or a bit of enforcement.
And?
London Road camera is currently non-operational. It certainly hasn't been flashing at the midnight boy racers in months. Used to be a veritable paparazzi show from it each night.
@slowcoach
"Published government data from 2011 showed that vehicles were exceeding the speed limit 38,000 times per day at camera sites in Edinburgh. This included 1300 per day on London Road."
That's more believable.
Police saw 642 in 6 months - approx 5 a day.
If they'd bothered to look at London Road for 12 hours, they could have registered 642 in half a day... then taken the next 5 months 29.5 days off...
@chdot
So, we have 'facts' about a problem that could be dealt with by a bit of engineering - plenty room for some segregated bike lanes - and/or a bit of enforcement.
We have facts that show that, in one reasonably small space - a straigh road that's 1.4m long - the law is being broken every 71 seconds.
And the police respond to that information by ignoring it.
Tells us everything about Police Scotland.
Received a reply to my objection. I can't copy and paste it, so I'll paraphrase:
Waterfront Avenue and Waterfront Broadway:
Non-residential and have separated walking/cycling provision. Will ease pressure on West Granton Rd.
Balgreen Rd, (part of) Whitson Rd:
Speed is controlled by bends and road width. 20mph speed limit here would simply add unnecessary signage.
Roseburn St:
To ensure that location of 20mph signs is optimal.
Polwarth Terr:
Removes an inconsistency between the originally advertised network and the previous TRO.
Gordon Terr Rd:
This is a non-existent street; fixing a typo.
Bonaly Rd and Swanston Rd:
These weren't included in the original network approved by Transport Committee, but were accidentally included in the previous TRO. Speeding unlikely to be an issue on Bonaly Rd anyway. On Swanston Rd, the change from 20mph to 30mph will be after the point where pedestrians and cyclists can use a separate path.
Balgreen Rd, (part of) Whitson Rd:
Speed is controlled by bends and road width. 20mph speed limit here would simply add unnecessary signage.
I didn't realise Balgreen Road was planned to be 20mph?
The full length of it should be 20mph. There is a primary school on it, nurseries and care homes on side streets, it's residential, there's a park and sports ground, and one of the council's own family friendly cycle routes crosses it. When I requested it be included originally Jeremy Balfour told me he agreed but that the planners saw it as part of the arterial routes.
It's layout certainly doesn't slow people down at the moment.
Not directly related, but a question of priorities and what the Police think the public regard as 'acceptable enforcement'
Echoes of Orwell;
Governments make laws, but whether they are carried out, and how the police behave, depends on the general temper in the country.
Think I Shan't read the comments on that one
Councillor MacInnes is quoted thus;
Calmer speeds not only improve safety and encourage more people - especially young families - to walk and cycle; they also boost local communities and combat loneliness
Councillor Macinnes seems not to have been asked if gyratories have these same benign effects.
...is there any evidence current 20mph zones have
"encourage more people - especially young families - to walk and cycle; they also boost local communities and combat loneliness" ???
not sure i see a mass of cyclists and people out chatting to each other every time i enter and exit 20mph zones.
just another sound-bite politicians and the like can quote when they are asked "what are they doing to promote active travel/active kids/obesity/street pollution/climate change" type question.
apologies but i'm so very cynical about all politicians these days.
Ah, loneliness. The cause du jour. It must be combatted. Presumably 20mph is better for people's mental health too? Cures cancer perhaps?
Why can't Cllr MacInnes just stick the actual. real benefits of lower speeds which are primarily about safety. There may be some benefits to congestion and pollution too as (in theory) traffic is progressing at a steady speed rather than constantly accelerating and decelerating.
Councillor MacInnes walks into haymaker from Councillor Cook shock.
Perhaps they'll patch up their differences to install the anti-loneliness gyratory?
@crowriver:
actually... (this is re: weight of traffic rather than speed per se, but very likely it will have an impact - plus the danger of traffic seems to be a fairly big factor in this effect).
Can't find article right now, but there was, I think, a US bit of work that found similar re: the number of social interactions on otherwise similar residential streets.
Loneliness is no joke re: health outcomes. Human beings are intensely social creatures: this is not a "squishy feeling" that can be ignored.
Loneliness is no joke re: health outcomes.
This. But also loneliness is no joke in just being a human being. To feel lonely is to feel inhuman.
Loneliness in any social animal seems to be devastating. (See e.g. interesting addiction study on rats kept in solitary.) (Don't ask me about my feelings re: solitary confinement in prison (torture, basically).)
Question from Conservative councillor Scott Douglas for next week's council meeting:
"Is the Transport Convener aware of the reports regarding the 20mph scheme that had been introduced in Bath and North East Somerset, where one year on there has been an increase the number of people killed or seriously injured in seven out of the thirteen zones where 20mph was now the standard speed limit?"
Hopefully the response will be "if the Conservatives spent less time trying to appeal to EEN commenters and more time looking at evidence then they would know that the Bath report has already been thoroughly debunked and its conclusions shown to be inaccurate."
Councillor Scott Douglas,has Let himself down badly there
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