CityCyclingEdinburgh was launched on the 27th of October 2009 as "an experiment".
IT’S TRUE!
CCE is 15years old!
Well done to ALL posters
It soon became useful and entertaining. There are regular posters, people who add useful info occasionally and plenty more who drop by to watch. That's fine. If you want to add news/comments it's easy to register and become a member.
RULES No personal insults. No swearing.
closed"trying to keep a flicker going in Westminster"
I think you'll find that with "Yes" or a 'close' "No", there will be a shock at Westminster and more rumblings further away - particularly 'the north' and the 'south west'.
Not quite Revolution though...
a 'close' "No", there will be a shock at Westminster
A close "Yes" in 1979, but didn't count due to rigged rules. Only 'shock' was Thatcher getting in. Surely a "No" this time will boost Cameron's Tories in 2015?
"Surely a "No" this time will boost Cameron's Tories in 2015?"
I'm arguing that that wouldn't happen 'this time round'. There is more 'awareness' of 'Scotland' and less faith in/resignation towards 'the state' - and I don't mean the "British state".
Perhaps we'll never find out...
IF there is a Yes, perhaps the Tories will get a Holyrood boost in 2016?
"
Events in Ukraine and the forthcoming referendum in Scotland have focused attention on deeply felt ideas of nationalism and national sovereignty. Here, Professor David Cannadine dispatches a few myths about nation states - arguing that they a relatively modern inventions and that, in part, the loyalty we owe them was a carefully constructed political strategy.
"
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b040hk4r
Don't remember, but I suspect there wasn't much similar analysis in 1979.
There was an amendment to the devolution bill in 1979 that meant the devolution referendum would require 40% of the electorate. Think they polled 32% of the electorate.
As I said before will still be one million not voting (same as in 1979 but population/ electoral roll somewhat higher, maybe 30per cent of electoral roll)
50.1% of the vote give or take the odd dimpled chad would be enough this time. I cannot be fagged on such a lovely day working it out but that might be 40% of the electorate! or maybe less so maybe same or easier task than in 1979?
Again I could be wrong but unlikely that there will be a majority of the electoral roll voting for indie lite.
Of course even landslide elections do not often return parties with the majority of the vote, never mind the electoral roll. I did not get a pay rise as on a turn out of 30per cent of the union I am in, 60 percent voted to reject, ie 18per cent of membership.
Westminster? Who knows, UKIP could take Tory vote? Cameron is off to church regular, liberals big losers due to the coalition. Their vote went to SNP in 2011 did it? or maybe it went to labour but loads of labour went to SNP? I dinnae ken.
And in Westminster maybe liberal to Tories but then Tories going to UKIP. Unclear?
Obviously first past post versus PR also factor.??
Off to cut grass.
Don't remember, but I suspect there wasn't much similar analysis in 1979.
What I recall was a great deal of anxiety about extreme right wing (British) nationalism in the form of the National Front (NF) who were polling well in by-elections and had some councillors in England.
Some commentators (mainly, but not wholly, of the left) conflated that kind of nationalism with the variety presented by the SNP. Others (mainly Labour) just used the old 'Tartan Tory' jibe.
"Their vote went to SNP in 2011 did it? or maybe it went to labour but loads of labour went to SNP? I dinnae ken."
Insto might know.
Just back from a wee stroll up Arthur's Seat way for egg rolling with the kids. Nice day out, breeze a bit fresh mind.
"Surely a "No" this time will boost Cameron's Tories in 2015?"
"Their vote went to SNP in 2011 did it? or maybe it went to labour but loads of labour went to SNP? I dinnae ken."
Insto might know.
No one paid much attention to the Lib Dems but certainly most of the increase in SNP vote came from labour voters disgruntled about Iraq and just about everything, especially labour.
Better Together are not internationalists.
http://derekbateman.co.uk/2014/04/20/im-a-scottish-internationalist/
Brenda's birthday. One of the days I turn the wireless off for a minute or so.
"
Yes Scotland chief executive Blair Jenkins said: “The extreme negativity of the ‘no’ campaign is proving a major turn-off for voters, and month by month they are paying the price.”
Blair McDougall, director of Better Together, said his group will also launch an advertising campaign this week.
"
http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/independence-yes-vote-closing-the-gap-1-3382301
@wee folding bike
No need to turn off on either of Brenda's birthdays. Just sing along with the music;
Lord, grant that Marshal Wade,
May by thy mighty aid
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
and like a torrent rush
Rebellious Scots to crush!
God save the Queen!
@chdot
Better Together are launching an advertising campaign because they have money. If they had any people they would launch a campaign of door-to-door visits. People versus money....ooooh, how to decide?
@insto, if you have a moment can you add the liberals vote from previous election to the labour vote in 2011 and see what happens?
@IWRATS, SNP have biggest budget for campaigning of all the parties, according to a BBC website piece last week.
@folds, you did this before with the Mr and. mrs presenter and his pro-independence website and some researchers who watched the telly in a qualitative study - Derek Bateman is not a source of fact he is a pro-independence journalist involved in a straightforward website supporting independence. He is perfectly entitled to denigrate the better together groupings internationalist credentials, some of them are insular for sure. But plenty of internationalists in better together.
Interesting report from Dublin yesterday on radio 6. Dubliners accepting of their insularity as they have fun was the gist.
as I remain hopeful I await any argument put to SNP that they say, actually that is fair enough (surely there must be one?) Everthing must be rebutted instantly, all quite wearing and only likely to get worse.
The million non voters will be so bored and will be hitting the remote whenever Alex's coupon appears on the telly well before September?
"Better Together are launching an advertising campaign because they have money."
But apparently much less than "Yes".
"If they had any people they would launch a campaign of door-to-door visits."
Both 'sides' have done that. (No idea about number of people/doors.)
I get the impression that there have been more (and better attended) Yes meetings.
I think things are getting past the 'give us the facts' stage. People are realising that (in an absolute sense) there are no/few facts. So people are making theirs minds up party/increasingly(?) on the basis of hope(s) and fear(s).
Clearly there are good arguments about being 'better together' - keeping the pound, the queen, making sure the trains and electricity flow both ways across the border. BUT these can be done irrespective of 'nation states'.
The recent royal visit has made me aware that the Australian armed forces are 'loyal to the queen'. Really?! So much for protecting your sovereign state.
Independence is of course a myth in a 'global world'. I doubt if there are many people who imagine/hope for fortress/drawbridge Scotland. I assume some people here (Scotland) are uneasy about the 'Island Britain' that seems to be what UKIP, Tories and (to some extent) Labour want.
IF Scotland becomes independent it might keep the Pound. It might not, and might have to have a different currency. Bit inconvenient - like changing from the franc (etc.) to the Euro(?) - certainly wouldn't happen the day after a Yes vote.
A Scottish economy might be a disaster - like the Darien days, or (more recently) Iceland, Ireland, Greece or Spain. I hope not - and doubt it, but imagining that 'friends in The City' will 'punish' Scotland for leaving the UK are fanciful.
But there's more to country/state than the stupid economy.
It's not about Salmond v Cameron, or the SNP v Westminster and certainly not Scotland v England.
Maybe the new Better Together advertising campaign will come up with good ideas/reasons for staying together and convince people to stay with their (No) voting intention or convert current Yessers or don't knows.
After September (Yes or No) most things will stay the same. If Yes, there will be negotiations to change some things. Other things will change because of many other events and actions throughout the world.
Whether Scotland thrives, survives or 'declines' depends on many factors - bit like now really!
Anyone watch Gogglebox last week?
Amusing to see the views of a (completely unrepresentative) small bunch of English people.
Comedy comment from one woman was (slightly paraphrased) "what do they want? We already let them have their own parliament"
Closely followed by some nonsense about how the largest 6 employers in Scotland would leave following a Yes vote.
Interestingly, none of them seemed to be of the view that separation would be positive.
Currency not like franc to euro. More like pound to what?? Might boil down to this?
Probably will go along party lines? Not sure how many disgruntled labour voters will return (has always happened after previous flirtations with SNP but obviously current flirtation is a full blown affair possibly leading to rancorous divorce?)
Hard to know what rest of Scotland is really like? Edinburgh not being typical.
hard to know whether polls accurate. The heart says yes, the head says no being a possible factor that might mislead polls. Many other factors out there. The head says No but the Heart says feck it, being another.[center]
"Edinburgh not being typical"
That is very true - not just in indyref terms.
Bit like NY isn't US.
In cycling terms Ed is 'progressive', '20 years behind' or 'stupid'...
'But apparently much less than "Yes".'
I'm not sure how well funded both sides are, but Yes has many, many more punters on the street. It's really quite exciting, with a tonne of wildly divergent pro-Yes websites as well.
Poor old No is largely Labour party members forced to trudge round arguing for royalty, privilege, war, nuclear weapons and undemocracy. I would be delighted to see a popular No movement coming up with new propositions for the Union, but they have mired themselves in horror and gloom. I'm not sure they can turn that round in five months, but we'll see.
How's everyone voting in the Europeans? The Greens' second candidate is both a cyclist and a nice chap.
"The Greens' second candidate is both a cyclist and a nice chap."
Wots rong with 1st 1??
I haven't met the first one!
She's also a cyclist, and a nice chap.
SNP £1.3 m, greens 250k, SSP £50k
LAb £880k, libs £250k, Tories £250k.??
Something like that.
Feels like SNP certainly spending it.
Euro turnout always depressingly low
Will checkout no 2 green
Those look like the official spending figures for the last 16 weeks of the campaign. Recommendations from the Electoral Commission. I think Yes Scotland and Better Together are also limited to £1.5m each.
"If they had any people they would launch a campaign of door-to-door visits."Both 'sides' have done that. (No idea about number of people/doors.)
Some Betterer Togetherators came round my door a few weekends ago. A group of three, as far as I could tell.
Did one have a red duffle coat on? There were three at the Balerno farmers market plus ex councillor and cyclist hanging about. No also had three (one not in SNP) and current councillor. So fairly balanced?
Can't remember what they were wearing and didn't recognise any of them. The man who got my door was in his early forties with possibly reddish hair. Couldn't say whether either of the other two had a red duffel coat on or not.
Looked to me like father and daughter combo at the market, plus young labourite, telling me oxgangs solid No ( he may be biased). Daughter had duffle or if we are being internationalists duffel
The bedroom band I was in started out being called The Duffles, promo for our debut single taken at the Lost Children office down Ayr beach next to the pavilion. fortunately as was very typical summer's day in Ayr with howling wind and atmospheric black clouds, there were no other people on the beach, so black and white stills look Ok and no dodgy connotations. understand the office has been moved. Guy who was at school with me was cycling past and took the shots, which let both band members feature. I have very short suedehead look as we had just been up at Tony''s in River St. the EP was to be titled Lost Children, had all four of our songs on it. the drummer (well drum machine) was called Archie Macduff.
FOLLOWING the total lack of success of the Duffles we moved to the left from indie to punk and rebranded ourselves as The Duffs. equally unsuccessful
"The Duffs. equally unsuccessful"
Sounds like you got what you wished for...
I hanker after a Duff Beer cycling top from Foska, but not as strongly as some other kit.
Whatever you think of Mr. Cameron, his Easter message and the reaction to it -
it was slightly odd (but not unexpected) to hear someone on R4 saying that 'it's a fact that this is a Christian country' - on the basis that 'the Queen is head of the church and there are Bishops in the House of Lords'...
SNP £1.3 m, greens 250k, SSP £50k
LAb £880k, libs £250k, Tories £250k.??
I think these are the upper spending limits as stipulated by the Electoral Commission. Doesn't mean that the parties actually have that much cash to spend! Tories and Lib Dems probably have more, as does probably SNP. Greens? Not sure if we have 1/4 million, but maybe. Labour probably can find nearly a million. SSP might struggle to find 50 grand?
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