CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure

Edinburgh: Street Design Guidance Consultation

(42 posts)

12

  1. PS
    Member

    The Council's consultation on its new street design guidance (as mentioned by Cllr Andrew Burns at the recent Spokes meeting) seems to have passed the forum by. It's a big old document and certainly worthy of a topic of its own. So here it is.

    Edinburgh Street Design Guidance

    The Council is now seeking your views on new guidance for street design - the Edinburgh Street Design Guidance. The guidance sets out how we can design street to make them better places, while improving how people get around.

    These details will be added to during the consultation period so can sign up to the Planning Twitter account to receive information on when new details are available. The draft design guidance was approved by the Planning Committee in February 2014.

    A 12 week consultation will run from 7 April to 30 June and we would like your views on the draft guidance and the design of streets in the City.

    In the coming week we will have an online survey to complete or you can now e-mail us directly with your comments.

    We will be holding a workshop in May and if you would like to attend please get in touch. We are looking for a wide range of people with different interests, from families, to businesses to help us understand better the issues that you have when using City's streets.

    Linkity-link

    Posted 10 years ago #

  2. chdot
    Admin

    "sign up to the Planning Twitter account to receive information on when new details are available"

    I think they mean "follow"!

    Have been some useful exchanges -

    https://twitter.com/planningedin

    Posted 10 years ago #

  3. fimm
    Member

    Well from the twitter link I learned that there are some specific policies about "Gorgie-Dalry town centre" - which turn out to be about retaining shops as shops and not allowing them to be converted to non-shop use.

    Where was that policy which had all the stuff about cycling in it?

    Posted 10 years ago #

  4. chdot
    Admin

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/4409/active_travel_action_plan

    Posted 10 years ago #

  5. fimm
    Member

    Thank you.
    Also this
    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/file/12323/the_new_local_transport_strategy_2014-2019
    which is more recent.
    Apologies for the diversion!

    Posted 10 years ago #

  6. chdot
    Admin

    Don't forget this one -

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/411/transport_2030_vision

    !

    P6 -

    "

    Vision outcome 2: By 2030 Edinburgh’s transport system will:
    be healthy - promoting Active Travel with streets appropriately designed for their functions, with an emphasis on encouraging walking, cycling and public transport use and a high quality public realm; improving local air quality.

    "

    Posted 10 years ago #

  7. PS
    Member

    From the Executive Summary:
    Changes in how we do things
    - We will follow a design process that
    starts by considering the street as a
    place

    Changes in what we do
    - We will recognise that streets have an
    important non-transport role
    - Street design will prioritise improving
    conditions for pedestrians, cyclists and
    public transport users in most streets
    - We will provide integrated design
    solutions for more than one mode of
    transport
    - We will use signs, markings and street
    furniture in a balanced way, providing
    them where they provide a positive
    function for street users

    Posted 10 years ago #

  8. chdot
    Admin

    @ PS

    All good.

    'Now let's write another report, there's still room on the shelf'.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  9. PS
    Member

    As ever, implementation is key. But at the very least it looks like a good thick report to hit them over the head with every time they screw up. ;-)

    Posted 10 years ago #

  10. PS
    Member

    page 31
    Tight corners (i.e. small RADIUSES) will be used to
    help pedestrians follow DESIRE LINES and calm the
    speeds of turning traffic.
    ...
    Crossing points will be located on desire lines
    ...
    The design of public transport facilities will be integrated with other modes of transport
    including facilities for cyclists

    Posted 10 years ago #

  11. chdot
    Admin

    "But at the very least it looks like a good thick report to hit them over the head with"

    Yeah, but the point is - the bit of the council that does stuff ought to do what the bit of council that decides what should be done says.

    Unless of course it's 'stupid' - in which case the bit that does the work should tell the bit that tells it how to do it to stop writing 'rubbish'.

    Or something...

    Posted 10 years ago #

  12. PS
    Member

    That all assumes they talk to each other...

    Posted 10 years ago #

  13. chdot
    Admin

    True!

    Posted 10 years ago #

  14. PS
    Member

    I'm seeing a lot of the following in the 'Basic principles for each street type' pages in respect of cycling layout:
    Desirable Minimum = Advisory Carriageway
    Recommended = Mandatory lanes or Separated Lanes where appropriate/feasible

    The recommended approach looks good, but clearly the devil is going to be ensuring that the get out of "it's not appropriate/feasible" isn't constantly evoked...

    Posted 10 years ago #

  15. kaputnik
    Moderator

    page 31
    Tight corners (i.e. small RADIUSES) will be used to
    help pedestrians follow DESIRE LINES and calm the
    speeds of turning traffic.
    ...
    Crossing points will be located on desire lines

    I think this every morning when using the Broomhouse Path.

    My pessimistic inner voice then appends "where it wouldn't hinder motor traffic" to the end of such warm statements.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  16. chdot
    Admin

    All the links above no longer work.

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk//download/downloads/id/1892/edinburgh_street_design_guidance

    The first part is at

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/1893/edinburgh_waterfront_promenade_design_code

    Which must be some sort of mistake as it has replaced what was/should be there!

    Posted 10 years ago #

  17. Calum
    Member

    That says 4% of travel to work in Edinburgh is done by bike (p44). Andrew Burns said it's 8% here. Which is correct? I'd love to think it's the higher figure, but the census shows most Edinburgh wards hovering around the 4% mark.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  18. chdot
    Admin

    "That says 4% of travel to work in Edinburgh is done by bike (p44). Andrew Burns said it's 8%"

    Indeed. Sort of doesn't matter.

    Either means CEC has to do a lot or a LOT TO DO...

    Posted 10 years ago #

  19. Calum
    Member

    "Sort of doesn't matter.

    Either means CEC has to do a lot or a LOT TO DO"

    Ha! Exactly. Though I think it says a lot that they can't even be bothered to be consistent.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  20. chdot
    Admin

    "Though I think it says a lot that they can't even be bothered to be consistent"

    Also - the 15% by 2020 is supposed to mean for all journeys but has been subverted to 'journeys to work'.

    Either way, won't happen, unless...

    Putting wrong tactiles and sub-standard chicanes on Family Network doesn't inspire confidence.

    No chance of target being approached unless CEC accepts that it's going to have to 'reallocate roadspace' (not just Leith Walk and George Street).

    Posted 10 years ago #

  21. chdot
    Admin

    From 2000

    The Council wants to create a city where walking and cycling are safe and attractive travel options for short journeys. Walking and cycling are cheap, quiet, pollution-free, don't contribute to traffic congestion, and are good for our health. The Council will prioritise those who walk and cycle within the city in the future design of its traffic management schemes.

    Since 1991, there has been a 50% increase in the number of people cycling to work. The Council has produced a 'Cycle Friendly Design Guide', including illustration of good practice examples, and has completed much of then National Cycle Network route in the city.

    For pedestrians, the Council will improve pavements and road crossings on main pedestrian routes, increasing the amount of pedestrian space in the city centre and the introduce more traffic calming measures throughout the city. For cyclists, the number of dedicated cycle lanes and cycle paths will increase, there will be more advanced stop lines at traffic lights and secure cycle parking will be provided on-street and at public transport interchanges such as railway stations.

    The City of Edinburgh Council Local Transport Strategy Summary (page 9 + 10)

    Posted 10 years ago #

  22. sallyhinch
    Member

    From what I remember, there are two figures bandied about for 'commuting to work' rates. Cycling Scotland put out a report last year that used the percentage of people in each Local Authority who report cycling to work at least once a week. The census measures those who cycled to work on the day of the census, which is obviously a more demanding measure.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  23. chdot
    Admin

    "which is obviously a more demanding measure"

    Mmm, I think we need a statistical expert to rule on that.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  24. Roibeard
    Member

    IANASE, however...

    Cycle to work at least once a week, presuming 5 day working week, includes all that cycle one or more of those 5 days.

    Whereas cycling on the day of the census only captures those that cycled that day, excluding those that cycled one or more days but just not census day.

    In the worst case, those that cycle just one day a week have only a 20% chance of appearing in the census stats, so assuming a random distribution, the census figures will include only a fifth of the once a week cyclists. The twice a week cyclists have a 40% chance of appearing in the census, etc...

    Fairly safe to say that the census figure will therefore be less for all cases except those that cycle every day without fail.

    Robert

    Posted 10 years ago #

  25. chdot
    Admin

    "Fairly safe to say that the census figure will therefore be less for all cases except those that cycle every day without fail."

    That makes sense, and 'accounts for' the low 'cycle to work' figure.

    BUT if the 'high' figures are based on 'one or two days a week' then that's perhaps more questionable as the basis for the 15% by 2020 target.

    If (on average) people cycle to work 2 1/2 days per week (personal multi-mode choice) that could be 15% of people, but only 7 1/2% of journeys

    Or IF it gets to 15% of work trips, that could mean 30% of people cycle to work regularly.

    Complicated!

    Posted 10 years ago #

  26. acsimpson
    Member

    I'm not sure why that measure is taken for the census. It seems akin to counting part time or shift working employees who happen to be on a day off as unemployed.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  27. Min
    Member

    It also doesn't take into account the effect the weather might have. If it was particularly windy and raining on that one day or particularly nice, it might skew the numbers quite a bit.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  28. sallyhinch
    Member

    The census was only ever intended to be a snapshot of a single day - it's why Emily Wilding Davidson hid herself overnight in the houses of Parliament in order to give her address as the 'House of Commons'. Of course these days you get your census forms way in advance and people don't necessarily fill them in on the day, so if you weren't cycling to work that day you could pick and choose...

    Posted 10 years ago #

  29. Morningsider
    Member

    The census figures provide a nice historic time series, but the travel to work data has really been superseded as a useful resource by the Scottish Household Survey (SHS). SHS travel and transport figures are published every two years and better reflect what happens in practice than the census figures - although it is still subject to various caveats due to sample sizes etc.

    Specifically on travel to work/education people are asked:

    HOW DO YOU USUALLY TRAVEL TO WORK (OR SCHOOL/
    COLLEGE/UNIVERSITY IF IN FULL TIME EDUCATION)?

    I love the fact that one of the list of answers is "Horse riding".

    There are various supplementary questions about alternative modes, reasons for main mode choice and reasons why people don't cycle.

    I'm sure Insto knows far more about this than me.

    Posted 10 years ago #

  30. sallyhinch
    Member

    Bump: closes at the end of this month http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/file/3577/cycle_environment-draft_for_consultation

    Posted 9 years ago #

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