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Majors cycling and walking projects

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  1. SRD
    Moderator

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/meetings/id/43371/item_78_-_development_of_major_cycling_and_walking_projects

    "ATAP sets out priorities for developing the family network. These seek to fill gaps in the city’s existing off-road network, which is largely based around former railways, and to create connections to key destinations, most importantly the city centre. "

    "Two of the most important gaps in the network are:
    • west to east across the city centre from Roseburn to Leith Walk, via George Street; and
    • between Roseburn and easternmost section of the Union Canal.
    This report recommends taking forward work aimed towards filling these gaps, both of which have the potential to contribute significantly towards achieving the ATAP cycling and walking targets."

    Posted 11 years ago #

  2. SRD
    Moderator

    3.9. Roseburn to canal

    "This project involves the creation of an almost totally traffic-free connection in Edinburgh's proposed family cycle network between the North Edinburgh Path Network and the Union Canal, currently separated by an area of busy streets. A link would also be created along the north side of the West Approach Road as far as Morrison Crescent, allowing safer and more convenient access to the Morrison Street area avoiding the Haymarket junction."

    Posted 11 years ago #

  3. SRD
    Moderator

    Roseburn to Leith

    2.8 "The Council is about to invest in a significant upgrade of provision for both cyclists and pedestrians on Leith Walk, and options for a similar redesign of Picardy Place are being considered. However there is a need to link from these to the George Street/Princes Street area or to Waverley Station"

    Posted 11 years ago #

  4. chdot
    Admin

    "
    The Council does not currently have the capacity, or for some aspects the necessary skills base, to develop these projects internally in 2014/15. It is for this reason that appointment of consultancy support, via a competitive tendering process, is recommended.

    "

    There must come a point where there is enough work to actually employ the right people.

    I think that point came some years ago.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  5. SRD
    Moderator

    yes. i wish I knew what the politics of tendering for these was. are there people who specialise in this sort of work? is there competitive bidding? etc.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  6. cb
    Member

    Roseburn to canal

    "A link would also be created along the north side of the West Approach Road as far as Morrison"

    I'd heard someone (SRD?) suggest that the Telfer subway might be part of the Roseburn to canal link, but the bit above might suggest that the route will use the WAR crossing, the horrible zigzag and then Melvin Walk/Gilmore Park.

    Also, did somewhere else (Spokes bulletin?) hint that a continutation of the Roseburn path over the railway might be a possible option, or was it just a Spokes preferred option?

    Or, is the route still completely up for grabs? It's just that the quoted bit above suggests that some kind of routing options have already been done.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  7. Instography
    Member

    You'd expect to see any invitations to tender (or pre-qualification stages) appear on Public Contracts Scotland. Anyone can register and get email alerts sent to them with key words like "research", "consultancy". It's how I start my day sifting through the new ones.

    You'd expect anything that required specialist skills to probably have a pre-qualification stage where you need to show you have the skills they need. Otherwise it can be an open tender - anyone can bid.

    The only way you might not see it is if it is let through an established framework agreement where suppliers have been pre-qualified and buyers can go straight to a mini-tendering competition among a smaller number of bidders. Those generally aren't publicised.

    The politics are a different matter and you learn to read which ones have been created with a particular supplier in mind.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  8. neddie
    Member

    The Council does not currently have the capacity...

    This is because the Council is too busy dicking about trying to make changes to already good cycle routes. Like on the Meadows in order to satisfy the calls to do something about conflict with pedestrians.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  9. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Like on the Meadows in order to satisfy the calls to do something about conflict with pedestrians

    The "calls" are the imagined ones that they hear in their heads.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  10. SRD
    Moderator

    i don't agree on this. everyday I see cyclists absolutely bombing down MMW oblivious to other users. the other day I was going south then turning right onto NMW when some idiot dinged at me, presumable cause he thought i was going too slow?

    It also is very unpleasant to walk along jawbone walk and have bikes zooming in and out around you.

    It's also very annoying to have oblivious - or obnoxious - pedestrians occupying the cycle lanes.

    none of which should be taken to mean that i think any of their proposals will make much of a difference.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  11. kaputnik
    Moderator

    @SRD I more had the "obstructions built in as standard" approach in mind. If the council took the same "we imagine that there may be a conflict here in a small number of cases, caused by a small minority of negligent users" approach when it did works on roads, we might end up in a better place.

    I'm not disputing that people take MMW too fast, however the tactile paving does nothing to impede speed (indeed, it's not meant to), and the layout of paint and tiles does not really help the visually impaired, so you have to wonder why they are bothering (unless people really are writing to them demanding we cover the city in useless tactile flags, as current practice seems to be).

    Then there's the mess up at Criagleith junction on the NEPN, £30,000(ish, iirc) spent on nothing short of stupid measures, for all concerned. Broomhouse Path.... Leith Links Path... I could go on.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  12. paulmilne
    Member

    There's so much space all through the Meadows, it's inexplicable why the cooncil doesn't create a proper segregated network of paths throughout. Apart from the expense, of course.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  13. kaputnik
    Moderator

    it's inexplicable

    I refer you to the Friends of the Meadows and Bruntsfield Links, to whom even repairing / widening the current paths was a bit like "tarmaccing the countryside"...

    There's more pressure/campaign forces at work than just Spokes!

    Posted 11 years ago #

  14. kaputnik
    Moderator

    http://edinburgh.stv.tv/articles/1331138-plans-for-edinburghs-9m-missing-link-cycle-path-revealed/?fromstreampost=250913

    Plans for Edinburgh's £9m ‘missing link’ cycle path revealed

    Posted 9 years ago #

  15. Stickman
    Member

    Holy moly: segregated cycle routes on a main road!

    Transport committee report:

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/meetings/id/48629/item_79_-_roseburn_to_leith_walk_cycle_route_public_consultation

    A lot to take in, but plans for "Copenhagen style" interactions with side roads for the segregated route on West Coates. Let's hope the plans don't get watered down. This is a really important route - need to get it right.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  16. PS
    Member

    Cor! This will pretty much be my ride to work if rumours of my office's move to the new Haymarket development are to be believed.

    Only issue I can see with that plan is I don't know how I would get to the Haymarket office site without being forced into the Haymarket mincer. But I'm sure the developers will be keen to secure safe cycle access for their thousands of white collar workers...

    Posted 9 years ago #

  17. wingpig
    Member

    @PS The consultations mentioned some sort of Morrison/Dalry/new-Haymarket-office-stuff package but as there's no mention of it above I suspect it's no longer in the scope of this collection.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  18. kaputnik
    Moderator

    I can't get my head around how they'll fit a proper "2 way segregated cycle track" on Princes Street between S. St. David Street and Waterloo Place.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  19. neddie
    Member

    At first glance, looks great.

    They'll need to sort out the rat run that is Roseburn Place though. And the 2-way segregated route is shown on the South side of York Pl - will be "interesting" to see how it crosses the tram tracks...

    Posted 9 years ago #

  20. Klaxon
    Member

    kaputnik, Google maps measures the pavement to pavement width at 16 metres. This is the same as the Leith Walk ped xing at Tesco Express

    Just needs some ambitious reallocation of space from the Waverley Steps Taxi Rank and Balmoral Hotel VIP zone.

    The continuous route along York Place to the bridges almost looks like it would make up for the gap coming up Leith St (but heavens - why would you not close that final 120 metre gap in the 'box' when the full site is being redeveloped)

    Posted 9 years ago #

  21. Stickman
    Member

    The plan stops traffic going up Roseburn Gardens from Roseburn Place, which will solve the rat-run problem.

    Only complaint from me so far is the glacial timescales to get this done. 2017 for the first stretch from Roseburn to Haymarket.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  22. crowriver
    Member

    Looks good! :-)

    I note the following:

    "Proposed Consultation
    3.10 It is proposed to now undertake a full public and stakeholder consultation on the proposals outlined in this report. The public consultation process will include a series of drop in sessions at venues along the route, briefings to local Council ward members, access groups, resident associations and Community Councils. A website and online survey will also be provided to facilitate the submission of responses.
    3.11 The Council’s website and media will be used to enhance awareness of the consultation with as wide a range of the public as possible. Bodies representing public transport, taxi and road freight operators will also be invited to take part. This phase of the consultation is expected to be concluded by the end of 2015.
    3.12 It is intended to report to the Committee on the outcome of the consultation in early 2016. If the proposed route that emerges from the consultation is approved, a further statutory consultation process will be required as part of the Traffic Regulation Order (TROs) and Redetermination Order (RSOs) requirements. A copy of the proposed programme can be found in Appendix 5."

    So, if this is approved by Councillors, look out for the consultation coming soon!

    In the meantime, if your Councillor sits on the Transport and Environment Committee, why not drop them a line asking them to support this?

    Posted 9 years ago #

  23. kaputnik
    Moderator

    kaputnik, Google maps measures the pavement to pavement width at 16 metres. This is the same as the Leith Walk ped xing at Tesco Express

    does it not have to pick it's way through the trambles tracks somehow?

    Posted 9 years ago #

  24. Klaxon
    Member

    I'll indulge some pie in the sky speculation:

    Princes St was narrowed to 1 lane eastbound at the Waverley Bridge junction. If this lane width was used - from S St David St all the way through to Regent Road, then, along with some VeloStrail gap filling surface for the tram lines you've got a winner. It would mean having to seriously consider entirely removing the right turn into the Waverley Bridge, but this fits in with the MO of Princes St being for through bus traffic and would rather simplify the light sequencing.

    Since my moans about the Meadows route I've actually come round to thinking these two way bike lanes could be a reasonably clever strategy to win more people round, if they wind up popular then half your job is done in making very wide, uni-directional lanes.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  25. acsimpson
    Member

    Normally when I read the words "family friendly cycle facility" alarm bells ring in my head as it conjures up images of a route designed to keep people safe at the expense of journey times. Thankfully, however, the plans don't seem to match up to these fears.

    It's a shame the route winds through the West end rather than continuing down Shandwick Place but that is probably a compromise worth making if it gets the route built.

    I assume George Street is a mistake and they aren't really planning 2 way segregated lanes on both sides of the road.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  26. SRD
    Moderator

    @acsimpson
    the map on page 12 shows 1 way segregated lanes on both sides of George st, i think.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  27. acsimpson
    Member

    so it does ... but you have to zoom in a very long way to see it which I hadn't done previously.

    Melville street on the other hand is clearly 1 way lanes even if you don't zoom in.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  28. wingpig
    Member

    "Canning Street
    • Public realm improvements and provision for Contraflow cycling
    along the 1way street
    Rutland Square
    • Introduction of Contraflow cycle lane between Canning Street and
    Lothian Road."

    They'll go a little way towards sorting the current round-the-houses-ism, as noted a couple of times when people have sought routes from the Lochrin basin to the centre.

    Posted 9 years ago #

  29. cb
    Member

    Cost estimates in Appendix 6 are quite interesting.

    "
    Stage 1 Roseburn Park to Haymarket Terrace £800,000
    Stage 2 Haymarket Terrace to Melville Street £400,000
    Stage 3 Melville Street to Charlotte Square £2,200,000
    Stage 4 St Andrews Square to Picardy Place & Waterloo
    Place £2,000,000
    "

    Not sure what happened to George St. Is that covered elsewhere?

    Posted 9 years ago #

  30. wingpig
    Member

    George Street is a separate project.

    Also:

    "2.4 The ATAP includes a wide range of actions aimed at achieving its targets. A key element is the creation of the ‘Family Network’ of routes suitable for people who are less confident riding a bike. This is now being marketed as 'Edinburgh's QuietRoutes'."

    At least one of the council officers involved is well aware that Family-Friendly isn't the best terminology but that it was convenient/broadly-understood shorthand for not-being-minced-at-junctions-or-having-to-maintain-20mph-in-heavy-motor-traffic.

    Posted 9 years ago #

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