I have tried it this morning for the first time. All in all is not bad, but I felt confused at each junction. At least a bit of uniformity would have helped.
I wonder, why paint a narrow bidirectional cycle track when they could have used the full lane for a comfortable dutch style width? there is a full meter next to the parking spaces completely unused. Would have been nice to ride two abreast on a dedicated infrastructure for once.
Also why installing signs on the tarmac? parking spots are diagonal, so there is much space in the triangular bit between cars and tarmac.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
George Street Improvements
(1175 posts)-
Posted 9 years ago #
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"there is a full meter next to the parking spaces completely unused."
I'm going to try and charitably pretend that this is there as a buffer, to accommodate people walking to/from parked cars or using the middle bit as an extra footway, as they tended to prior to the experiment.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Boyfriend and I duly had our meal in George Street (see "George Street eateries" thread) and got to sit out and watch the world go by. So: quite a few cyclists, (but not massively busy), some using the path to go the "wrong way" and some on the road to go the same direction; most pedestrians walked across the cycle space, not along it, but there were a few that did walk along it; there was a traffic warden going up and down the parked cars the whole time we were there; and one car drove along the cycle space (I assume that it had come in from the roundabout at the far end).
If faced with a car in the cycle space, would the panel be awkward and force the driver to reverse, or politely inform them that they were driving in a place they were not supposed to drive?
Posted 9 years ago # -
@fimm
GF and I were stopped at the lights mid-way along when a motorcyclist unparked his vehicle from the cobbled parking area and nudged it round so he was alongside me in the cycle path. So: a motorbike, on the cycle path, facing oncoming cycle traffic (because of course the path isn't wide enough to contain a bike and motorbike side by side without this). I informed the guy of his mistake, initially assuming that he was as confused by the road layout as everyone else.
Well he started giving me the "oh sorry I can't hear you" treatment followed by the "how could I possibly get over there?" treatment and finally the "this is perfectly normal" treatment before reversing and crossing to the motor side of the route.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I tried out the route again this afternoon, this time with No.2 daughter on the back as we were heading for the Girl Guides shop in the west end.
Now that I'm used to the layout, i have to say I enjoyed cycling on George Street. The only bits where I felt unsafe were at Hanover Street lights coming back (eastward) and at St Andrew Square eatward: very confusing this latter bit. Hanover St doesn't look quite finished? No traffic signal visible at junction, crowd barriers with 'ROAD CLOSED' signs on pullede across the path at that point.
Otherwise, really it was fine. I'll definitely be using this again.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I walked by yesterday. Barriers still there as you say. I counted around six bikes on Princes St route but none on George St so the only way is up in terms of usage.
My shot of the schematic. Know Chdot posted one but that was while back...
George Street New Bike Lanes inc Pedestrianised Zone by LaidBackBikes, on FlickrPosted 9 years ago # -
@LaidBack
I hope you noticed the You Are Here indicator for that sign is in fact at the wrong end of block three! Talk about "only having one job to do"...
Posted 9 years ago # -
Then there must be another that's wrong too? (!)
Sadly quite funny...
Did notice at time...
Posted 9 years ago # -
That schematic is the original James Craig design for the Newtown. I am till thinking I will stay on the north side travelling east. Not sure about going west.
Posted 9 years ago # -
First of many no doubt -
Pretty solid "road closed" barriers on this section (left out of shot) this guy decided that this was the way to go!
Meanwhile in StASq -
No doubt it will get sorted soon.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Boyfriend and I did exactly what that cyclist did...
Posted 9 years ago # -
Chap watering plants on Frederick st junction declining to get lorry out of the way for car stuck in bike lane. Bikes could get around
Posted 9 years ago # -
"
A reconfigured George Street was officially opened today
"
Posted 9 years ago # -
Cycled it for the first time - both ways - today. Shocking.
Posted 9 years ago # -
"Shocking"
Longer version?
Posted 9 years ago # -
Shooooooocking
Posted 9 years ago # -
Will cycle it this afternoon, bracing myself for the shock of my life.
Posted 9 years ago # -
It's both ends of the road/lane cause me the most problems.
At the Charlotte Square end, the lane ends at a large rectangular manhole cover that is raised above the tarmac, which is crumbling around it. A bit dicey.
At the St Andrew's end, if you are heading East-wards, you end up in the middle of a pedestrian island with nowhere to go!
--
I don't bother going westerly on George Street, as Princes St is bearable for me in the morning.
At home time, I go easterly alone the new lane for the first half, but carry on the actual traffic-side once past Hanover Street.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Normally, I'm Haymarket, Shandwick Pl, Princes Street, Waverly Bridge.
Can't see how George Street is going to fit neatly in there bar via South Charlotte Street/George Street/South St David Street. Bit of a lengthy detour, no?
Posted 9 years ago # -
Like very much to avoid princes street. Went Haymarket to cathedral, along the side path then up to cut through to Charlotte sq. Then on to George street. Path was dab. At the roundabout crossover everything fine then on to a red light where one oncoming cyclist in the right lane and the other not. But obviously we could avoid each other, don't think he realised he was in the wrong but no big deal. Followed it right to the end where you are directed by drop kerb onto traffic island, which seemed odd. Coming out of St. Andrews sq onto princess street was v. Busy but could make progress. So this all worked for me but it was only 16.00pm
Posted 9 years ago # -
Shocking: Both ends are the pits. Heading west when you get to Charlotte Sq you're dumped on a traffic island - right in to pedestrians (so I got the "you can't be cycling on a pavement"). Do you then press the button and join the road, or just join the road... Or?
Joining at Charlotte Sq you need to cross all the lanes of traffic for the right turn (guess what - horns from cars behind), and then dice yourself over the horrid surface / manhole cover.
St Andrew Sq has probably been brought up many times - "you can't get there from here", the St David St "cycle lane"...
But the worst aspects are the mid-point switch-a-roo and also where you're required to anti-intuitively go around the statues (depending on your direction of travel). Saw a couple of cyclists not doing that, and the reactions from motorists. Even when you do it proper, per the road markings, the motorists aren't expecting it...
It's just all creating needless conflict between motorist & cyclist; pedestrian & cyclist.
And that's ignoring the pedestrians using the space as a nice wide space for walking...
Posted 9 years ago # -
From Charlotte Sq I am coming on at the north side so no problem getting on to it really - some mild peril if not waiting for complete space in cars to get over and an improvement is that no one is turning left now except bikes. I imagine as I have said before I will stay on the north side all the way and not do the switcheroo
Haven't tried it east west
There will be teething problems however we need to support this initiative by writing in as DRIVERS and commending the council for their new traffic initiative on George st making the area lovely for all. As otherwise they will scrap it as drivers will be objecting to it and oh yeah if you look on city cycling Edinburgh they are slagging it off anyway
Posted 9 years ago # -
how dim do you have to be to drive along the cycle lane. I appreciate that it is new but seriously....
Posted 9 years ago # -
I am guessing they followed the lorry going to water the plants? Otherwise they may have driven over the rubber barriers at the parking spaces instead of reversing?
Posted 9 years ago # -
I didn't realise the corporate marquees on the garden decking bases were part of the design. I'm not sure how they're meant to fit with the Georgian splendour of the World Heritage site, faux-Georgian round-topped window or not.
The first winds of Autumn should sort them out and right this particular wrong..
Posted 9 years ago # -
Going east the other day, I forgot to try out the cycle lane on the eastern half so just kept on the road. As I waited at the ASL for St Andrew Square, a cyclist who had been going east along the lane along the southern side went onto what had been the pedestrian island (as directed by the path) but then rolled off the other side, having gone through a red light in spirit but without having technically rolled across the stop line.
I remembered to try the cycle lane the next day, encountered the same lighting situation at the east end but instead rolled off the ped island into the red ASL box, to wait for the green light, rather than attempting to work out the intended route when there were pedestrians about.
On the first go I ended up going along the north side of the square then down the side of the gallery to see if it was worth doing more often. I ended up behind the same car I'd been behind on George Street, presumably due to the greater delay caused at the two-part staggered crossing to Dublin Street compared to the single right-turn light-control at the bottom of North St David Street and the short section of bus lane in which to pass some of the queue.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I've been going along Queen Street in the morning, eas to west, which is pretty unpleasant but a big time saver. I keep thinking to myself "why amn't I up on George Street, it's one block away from being out of this mess". Then I have a think about how I could get from York Place, or Piccardy Place, or Leith Street up to George Street and onto the lane. I guess I'm meant to turn left up North St David Street? Can I get from there into the George Street lane without some sort of teleporting across lanes and kerbs witchcraft?
Posted 9 years ago # -
"Can I get from there into the George Street lane without some sort of teleporting across lanes and kerbs witchcraft?"
YES
Don't forget the cycle/shared path next to the Gallery is downhill only.
So cross the tracks, avoid the taxi rank, cross the tracks to the south side of the Square. Wait for the lights by the demolition hoardings, turn right then left.
EASY...
Posted 9 years ago # -
"Can I get from there into the George Street lane without some sort of teleporting across lanes and kerbs witchcraft?"
You just have to wait for a gap in the cars coming up from Princes Street as previously (making sure you're past the stop line, in case the oncoming traffic is solid, as previously) and then wait for a gap in the peds crossing the end of George Street.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Then I have a think about how I could get from York Place, or Piccardy Place, or Leith Street up to George Street and onto the lane. I guess I'm meant to turn left up North St David Street? Can I get from there into the George Street lane without some sort of teleporting across lanes and kerbs witchcraft?
That's the issue. There is an obvious holistic solution in pedestrianising or at the very least mix-use-ising St Andrew Square. Or, if you only wanted to sort the cycling link, a two-way cycle facility between pavement and parking spaces on the north side of the square would work, and wouldn't hinder car-space as that bit of street is so lightly used.
When you watch St Andrew Sqaure throughout the day it quickly becomes clear that a vast area of prime city centre space is wasted. Swathes of tarmac stand empty - even St David Street can be empty in the middle of rush hour. Big public realm improvements could easily be made and should be, given the impending retail-hub nature of the Square caused by the St James Centre and Scottish Provident building developments.
Posted 9 years ago #
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