http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/driver-confusion-over-conflicting-speed-limits-1-4350426
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » General Edinburgh
"Driver confusion over ‘conflicting’ speed limits"
(36 posts)-
Posted 8 years ago #
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The pictured markings are obviously correct.
Reminds me of a smart-alec pub quiz question -- what's the last sign you should see when leaving the motorway?...The 70mph speed limit in your rear view mirror.
Posted 8 years ago # -
I assume it cuts costs, but the council's strategy of putting up repeaters months before they actually come into legal force seems a bit silly and surely just encourages non-compliance from the start.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"The 70mph speed limit in your rear view mirror."
Why would there be a speed limit sign facing the wrong way on the exit slip?
Posted 8 years ago # -
I have had occasion to be a hard pressed motorist round Edinburgh for the last few months and as I don't like speeding I like to pay attention to the speed limit signs and I have found it very confusing indeed. Even in places where the 20 limit has been in force for a while it is hard to work out where it starts and also where it finishes. You just sort of become aware that there are 20 roundels on the road and then that you haven't seen any for a while. The Nicolson/Minto street drag is the worst. I still haven't worked out when it changes exactly.
Plus I no longer remember which are actually in force and which are not
The example in the photo seems pretty clear to me though. It is 30mph when you leave the street and 20mph when you enter it.Posted 8 years ago # -
The Nicolson/Minto street drag is the worst. I still haven't worked out when it changes exactly.
Currently this changes outside Queen's Hall, because this is where the boundary between Phase 1 and Phase 3 is. At the end of February, the stretch from Queen's Hall to Salisbury Road will become 20mph. I wonder if more prominent signage will be put up at Salisbury Road, as this boundary isn't temporary like the Queen's Hall one is.Posted 8 years ago # -
The outbound 30 (and possibly inbound 20) signs on the Bridges/Nicholson St/Minto St corridor are too close to the kerb and so have already been flipped round by buses/lorries knocking them as they go past.
There's probably painted roundels too but without the sign at the side to cue you to actually read them it's easy to assume they're just 20mph repeaters, especially as there's usually plenty of other more important things to concentrate on when driving through there.
When the scheme was announced I assumed the gateways would be far more prominent than just bog-standard 20mph zone signs and paint on the ground. I've seen more obvious gateways for tiny villages on country roads. Perhaps something more substantial is planned for the "permanent" boundaries.
Posted 8 years ago # -
cb is right. I lose the pub quiz. The answer must have been 'no entry sign' in your rear view mirror.
In my defence, I haven't been on a motorway in years.
Posted 8 years ago # -
On Lochend Road (and, I assume others) there are still 30 signs on the back of the "20 when lights flash" school signs. I hope they'll be removed...?
Not that it makes much odds, since most folk currently treat Lochend Road as a 40...
Posted 8 years ago # -
Is Gorgie Road in Gorgie 20? There were 20 repeater signs up and that's what I was doing when a Mercedes overtook and then decided it was maybe 20 after all and slowed right down again!
Posted 8 years ago # -
Gorgie Road doesn't actually change till end of February. Better to go by what the signs say anyway, I think.
Pleasantly surprised that Gorgie Road is included in the 20mph zone, I wouldn't have been surprised if it was left at 30.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Gorgie Road is going to be 20 up to - actually I'm not sure - past where we live anyway.
We've got 20 roundels up our side street - I hadn't noticed anything on the main road yet.
End of Feb, you say? I shall tell BOFFOF, he was wondering.Posted 8 years ago # -
Gorgie Road is going to be 20 up to - actually I'm not sure - past where we live anyway.
20mph from the Dalry Road end to Alexander Drive (where Benson's Beds is, not far from Balgreen Road).Changes on 28th February.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Normally when signs go up that are not yet in effect, they have that grey paint across them. As it is, the limits are a shambles; unless you read the local rag, you wouldn't know that the new limits come into force on 28 Feb, and you'll see a month or more of folk ignoring the unenforceable/unenforced limit.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Is this incomprehensible or am I just prejudiced?
"
Neil Greig, director of policy and research at the Institute of Advanced Motorists, said getting the signs right was pivotal to the scheme’s success.
He said: “If the character of the road isn’t being changed in any way, that is the only message drivers will have to let them know.
“The problem is you either have a forest of signs and markings, or do something else to convey the message.
“Signage is important because some locations don’t look like a 20 mile per hour zone.”
"
Posted 8 years ago # -
...it sounds like he's arguing for more speed bumps to be installed.
Posted 8 years ago # -
No, it sounds like he's making excuses for drivers who speed in 20mph zones. They're just "driving to the conditions" apparently, because the road doesn't look like a 20mph zone.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"sounds like he's arguing for more speed bumps"
That's a 'reasonable' interpretation.
Too scared to say so?
Posted 8 years ago # -
This driver does have a point: “When it’s random streets in certain areas it’s just confusing. I think it would have been better if they had done the whole city in one go.”
The list of exceptions to the 20mph limit is causing much of the confusion, I'd dare to suggest. Also the phased rollout. Instead, it would have been much simpler to just make the entire city 20mph, as soon as you're inside the city boundaries...
Posted 8 years ago # -
Well, in the part of Austria where Boyfriend of Fimm's parents live, the signage on entering the villages is the equivalent of "20 mph except the A70" (obviously it is actually 30kmh, in German, and they name their roads differently). It doesn't tell you what the limit is on the main road (which is what the exceptions are). They don't have streetview there, or I'd link. There's one spot in the next village over where there's a narrow bit and that bit is explicitly signed 30 (kmh).
Is that "better"?
What is wrong with driving at 20 if you aren't sure if you are in a 20 or 30 zone?
Posted 8 years ago # -
@fimm, you'd think that would be reasonable behaviour, wouldn't you. Not in this archipelago. As a taxi driver says in the article:
“When the 20mph zone came into the middle of town some people didn’t know it was 20mph and some did. People were blasting their horns at them – they were frustrated. You could see people itching to get on. I think it causes more accidents and more frustration.”
So the assumption among many drivers here seems to be: no signage = drag racing strip; Confusing signage = drag racing strip / "people itching to get on"; Clear signage = frustration.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Fimm What is wrong with driving at 20 if you aren't sure if you are in a 20 or 30 zone?
ANGRY DRIVER RAAAARRRRR!!!!
BEEP BEEEEEEEEPPPPPP!!!!!!!
RAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!
Posted 8 years ago # -
"because the road doesn't look like a 20mph zone"
The 20 signs are up on Strathearn Road already and it will be interesting to see if there is any adherence.
Parked cars seem to work slowing traffic from the western (morningside) end, but many drivers just seem to speed up at the section east of Marchmont Road - and often faster than 40.
To be honest, on these larger roads if the signs keep speeds closer to 30 that might be a good result.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"many drivers just seem to speed up at the section east of Marchmont Road"
That's Beaufort Road, then Grange Road. Anything that slows them down a bit has to be A Good Thing.
Posted 8 years ago # -
I was out and about on Saturday in the car with the little ones, I didn't know when the scheme starts (never paid any attention) where the signs said 20 I did 20 where they didn't I assumed national speed limit (jk) there was no aggro and no one aggressively tailgating etc. Shame really I quite like the "oh no its stalled again" game.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Thankfully my commute is mostly on the canal or through conf square where there are no cars for me to be going faster than and get caught... That and I checked my max speed on my route is not over 21. Have dispensed with the cycle computer and use sportypal on the bike instead
Posted 8 years ago # -
That's Beaufort Road, then Grange Road. Anything that slows them down a bit...
Well they are due to put a series of zebras in there, which should help.
Drivers have to concentrate harder at zebras to watch for peds waiting to cross. A series of zebras has a proven effect of slowing traffic.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"A series of zebras has a proven effect of slowing traffic."
It seems a lot like using pedestrians as fodder though.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"A series of zebras has a proven effect of slowing traffic."
It seems a lot like using pedestrians as fodder though.
Zebras eat human flesh? Who knew? Outrageous that they're even considering using these wild beasts as traffic calming devices.
Posted 8 years ago #
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