They've finally finished the two new play parks and have added cyclist slow markings by the new speed bumps they've fitted the length of the path from The Range to Duddingston Park South.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
Magdalene Glen
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Posted 7 years ago #
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I reported the 'speed bumps' to Clarence as damage to the carriageway. Interesting that they haven't been mended - they don't meet the guidelines at all.
Posted 7 years ago # -
What are the guidelines?
Posted 7 years ago # -
@Boab08
I keep Googling up the wrong document, but I think it's 'Cycling By Design'.
Nothing I've seen on that path appears anywhere in that document, so I suspect there has been improvisation.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Negotiated that last week with visitor to city. He thought it was pretty pointless. Bollards and railings - a submarine net level of barrier. Road crossing at lights behind is badly aligned too.
New improved obstacle to cycling by LaidBackBikes, on Flickr
Posted 7 years ago # -
I just noised up the Council about my original Clarence of the 22nd Feb. They'll be sending an agent to examine the monoblock obstacle.
D'you reckon the chicane meets the 3m/1.5m minimum size?
Posted 7 years ago # -
I dont know what the regulations are but it just seems to me that the speed bumps are very poorly laid. It does look as if any frost will burst the joints wide open and we will be left with something pretty dangerous. I usually go pretty carefully down that stretch anyway as there are often a variety of threatening looking uncontrolled dogs.
Posted 7 years ago # -
@GDR I made that exact point in February. Got the standards docs wrong - @Morningsider will quite rightly be sniggering at me.
Just to let you know that the surface of NCR1 has been damaged. I don't know if it's locals taking matters into their own hands or some creative work on the part of the contractors building the nearby play park, but some mono-block has been crudely inserted into the asphalt surface at Magdalene - nearest lamp post is MVC05.
The work has been poorly done - a channel has been cut which is too wide, mono-blocks of poor quality have been dropped in without mortar and loose tarmac or possibly even Quick Mac patted in below the level of either asphalt or the blocks to 'seal' the gap. See attached photo for an idea of the workmanship involved. This work won't last the course of next winter and will quickly become dangerous to cycles and their riders as the blocks come loose.
The correct design of cycle infrastructure is set out in Local Transport Note 2/08 (the Scottish Government were contributors) and the correct use of tactile paving to warn of hazards is set out in Section 4.2 of the DoT document Inclusive Mobility. Whether this is guerrilla engineering or a botch job this is a hazard in the making and should be removed from this busy cycle highway.
Thanks in advance,
IWRATS
Posted 7 years ago # -
I've changed my commute to avoid this, I now use the A1 to get to Milton Rd East - pointless waste of money - some of the blocks in the speed-strips are already loose (the ones near the chicane in the pic).
Shall we start a pool on when the first fire damage will appear in one of the play parks ? I'm taking b4 end of April.
Posted 7 years ago # -
A bit of guerrilla removal of the loose bits wouldn't go amiss
Posted 7 years ago # -
Also spotted the loose bricks mentioned above this afternoon.
More alarmingly young girl (around 6-8 ish) was in the hammock in the "climbing play area". She was being swung violently from side to side to quite some height by several slightly older boys. She was clearly upset and crying, but that was encouraging them to continue.
There were a few adults around. None intervening. I thought my interest would be unwelcome so passed on by, but hoped one of those adults would step in. I am a coward.
Posted 7 years ago # -
A Cycling Officer has been despatched to investigate. Council operative on the phones most genial. Informed me that he was too fat and old to cycle but he'd get on it right away all the same.
Posted 7 years ago # -
I cycled through here with my son this week, and noticed that the fork in the path which leads to the lowest point had large white-painted NO CYCLING at the top of the downhill path.
It was my understanding that this has no legal standing...is that right?
Posted 7 years ago # -
Yes, council has said this will be removed, although they've been saying that for a couple of months now...
Posted 7 years ago # -
Now the council are saying "all removed as soon as is reasonably possible", in the "next few weeks" as the markings are illegal.
Sorry to say this is just the markings though, not the bricks...
Robert
Posted 7 years ago # -
...or the chicanes...
Posted 7 years ago # -
Me: Did you consider people with trailers, tandems, handcycles etc. when designing the chicanes?
Council officer (paraphrasing): If we made the spacing between barriers too big, then cyclists wouldn't be forced to come to a complete stop. The park has to be usable by everyone.
...except those with trailers, tandems and handcycles, apparently.
I borrowed a friend's trailer this afternoon, took it down to Magdalene. The chicane at the top was more easily navigated than I was expecting, but the one further east was impossible without dismounting and lifting the trailer up to get it round the corner.
Posted 7 years ago # -
The park has to be usable by everyone.
That's a funny point - no one uses this as a park. The only users are people (cyclists and peds) on the path transiting the park and dog users using it as a dog toilet.
for 'park' think stretch of waste-ground with no other use.
Posted 7 years ago # -
To be fair, the play park was being well used when I was there. Kids very interested in the trailer, and I got high fives off all of them.
Posted 7 years ago # -
The 'No Cycling' signs on the ground seem to have been attacked by rats. One just says 'Cycling' now.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Most seem like half finished crossword answers.
"N_ CYC_ING"
Posted 7 years ago # -
My ire at this has been rekindled recently.
I've had a go at analysing Strava data to see if the speed bumps have had any effect on cyclists' speed. Unfortunately, I didn't think of this before the "Strava shows where secret military bases" story earlier this year, which seems to have caused Strava to remove a lot of the functionality in their API...
Anyway...
I have looked up the median all-time segment time for the Magdalene Glen section of the Innocent path, and compared this to the median segment time looking at 2018 only. Both eastbound and westbound.
The median 2018 cyclist is 2s (1.7%) slower going eastbound and 3s (2.3%) faster heading west than the median all-time cyclist.
I looked at some other nearby segments on the Innocent path as well:
From Duddingston Park South to the Hay Av underpass, the median 2018 cyclist is 0.8% slower than the median all-time cyclist.
Between Duddingston Park South and Duddingston Road West, the median 2018 cyclist is 1.0% faster heading east and 0.7% faster heading west.
I conclude that the speed bumps have achieved the square root of nothing.
Any problems with this conclusion before I send more fruitless emails to council officers? Suggestions for improvements? I might try to look at the first decile cyclists, since officers are likely to be most worried about the very fastest cyclists.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Is it possible to see whether numbers of passes have changes compared to nearby alternative routes such as along Duddingston Crescent?
Posted 6 years ago # -
Worth trying to check, but I don't think so. I haven't found a way to break down the days by date beyond "all time" and "this year", which I don't think is enough.
Whether a route is favoured by all year commuters or leisure cyclists is likely to have a bigger effect on the number of passes so far this year.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Response (my questions in italics):
Whether the bricks will be removed?
No the rumble strips will be not removed
During an extensive consultation period which lasted over 2 years . the local residents and other user raised the concern of speeding cyclists and asked for the design to incorporate designs features that would make both the cyclists and pedestrians aware of each other . The residents highlighted the venal as an area that residents walked directly on to the path and that there had been several incidents it was therefore decided to create a chicane to make pedestrians slow down . Your own data highlights that the local residents are correct in their concern about the speed of the bike riders
Whether there are plans to add similar features to any other paths in Edinburgh?
I am not aware of any future works but this type of surface has already been used at several site within Edinburgh and as you will be aware there are guidelines and planning and designing of infrastructure involves developing individual site – specific solutions to issues .The guidelines state that
Measures to slow cyclists down can include rumble surfaces, SLOW markings (Diag
1058.1) or staggered barriers. If staggered (chicane) barriers are used, the arrangement
should be designed to slow cyclists rather than
force them to dismount (refer to Figure 6.14).
Why Sustrans, Spokes and the active travel team were not consulted before the speed bumps were installed?
Sustrans and Active travel made comments on the during construction and these changes were made
Why barriers which are difficult or even impossible for some people to pass were installed at the entrance of a park which "has to be usable for all local and non-local residents"?
During an extensive consultation period which lasted over 2 years . the local residents and other user raised the concern of speeding cyclists and asked for the design to incorporate designs features that would make both the cyclists and pedestrians aware of each other . The residents highlighted the venal as an area that residents walked directly on to the path and that there had been several incidents it was therefore decided to create a chicane to make pedestrians slow down .
Posted 6 years ago # -
Unfortunate spelling mistake -
Posted 6 years ago # -
"I am not aware of any future works but this type of surface has already been used at several site within Edinburgh"
... whereupon it was met with complaints, if he's talking about Craigleith.
Posted 6 years ago # -
whereupon it was met with complaints, if he's talking about Craigleith.
Where about exactly?
I think there are also some on NCN 1 at Barnton.
Posted 6 years ago # -
There's some on the NEPN where the Blackhall Path and the Telford path meet at Craigleith Retail park. They are also horrible & unnecessary.
Posted 6 years ago # -
the newly missing bricks at the back of Magdalene prompted me into action and I finally submitted my complaint to the http://www.spso.org.uk / Ombudsman RE: incorrect/incomplete stakeholder engagement resulting in an inaccurate/incomplete/shewed consultation.
I know I have got the square root of zero chance of them doing something / anything, but gotta try.
In the meantime I'm off to beat my head against a brick wall. At least the pain will make me feel alive, whereas when dealing with CEC & SPSO I think I can actually feel my soul being sucked out, sort of like a Dementor's kiss in Parry Hotter.
When the Dementor's Kiss is performed, the Dementor will pull back its hood, clamp its jaw around the victim's mouth, and consume his or her soul. The Dementor's Kiss is generally considered to be a punishment worse than death. Victims are left in a Persistent Vegetative State: empty shells that are still alive but irretrievably "gone". It is unknown what happens to souls once a Dementor “ingests” them.
I think there's a room under Cicy Chambers full of jars with the souls of people who complain.
NOTE: I am not a Happy Potter fan.
Posted 6 years ago #
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