CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure

Edinburgh Cycle Hire Scheme

(1600 posts)
  • Started 7 years ago by Harts Cyclery
  • Latest reply from bakky

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  1. LaidBack
    Member

    Manchester already powering ahead with EU backed schemes for cargo bikes.
    This way you can get the carrying capacity of an Urban Arrow without buying one. Excellent idea - unfortunately it means tiny dealers like LB can't get new ones while Cargoroo orders are getting built.
    https://cargoroo.nl/en/how-does-it-work/

    Cargoroo bikes at UA last Monday.
    Urban Arrow 3rd IDC at new HQ

    Urban Arrow 3rd IDC at new HQ

    Yesterday one of our potential customers said that without JustEat he would never have cycled in city for transport. Had zero interest till pandemic gave him chance with quiet roads. Now he's bought an e-bike and looking at a UA for family use with small child Maxi Cosi adaptor.

    https://electrictravel.tfgm.com/ehubs/

    Posted 3 years ago #

  2. chdot
    Admin

    “

    Council has now discussed range of options with relevant groups

    Report+decision promised March 2022 but implementation time unknown

    “

    https://twitter.com/spokeslothian/status/1488829406621614083

    Posted 2 years ago #

  3. Morningsider
    Member

    A quick read of the report. Three things stand out:

    1. The SERCO scheme fell down for want of a couple of million quid.
    2. 18-24 months to get a replacement up and running.
    3. The Council are pursuing some weird interim "city bike club" measure - no real details, but I take it to be a low cost bike rental scheme.

    Given the Scottish Government boasts of many millions being invested in active travel, letting the original scheme die for want of a couple of million seems ridiculous. Any interim measure is no replacement for putting bikes right under people's noses and giving them the opportunity to try cycling on a whim. 18-24 months?! (Well - if it is measured in Edinburgh cycle project time, that will be around 2035).

    Posted 2 years ago #

  4. steveo
    Member

    The serco system was flawed though, the bikes were frequently lost and the docks were made of cheese.

    Not sure pouring more money in would have resolved that.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  5. Morningsider
    Member

    @steveo - good point. Think most of the cash was for new tougher docks and better locks. The big mistake was the Council expecting the scheme to run at no cost to itself. That was never going to happen.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  6. ejstubbs
    Member

    @Morningsider: From the report:

    [Serco] sought to move to a Managed Service Model, thereby transferring financial and delivery risk to TfE. The refreshed service would have required a security upgrade to the fleet and docking infrastructure to ensure additional and improved security against theft and vandalism.

    and

    ...to continue with the former scheme would have required a subsidy of approximately £500,000 per annum and this assumes over £1m of income per annum, through ridership fees and sponsorship, would be generated. Further, one- off investment of £1.172m was required to upgrade security for the fleet.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  7. chdot
    Admin

    “
    one- off investment of £1.172m was required to upgrade security for the fleet.

    “

    Presumably from CEC/‘us’?

    For equipment they (Serco/CEC?) had specified.

    Which they (Serco presumably?) hadn’t secured/maintained properly?

    Posted 2 years ago #

  8. steveo
    Member

    Wasn't there meant to be deal with the advertising company for bike hire in return for tarting out all the bus stops with relentless marketing?

    Posted 2 years ago #

  9. Morningsider
    Member

    Edinburgh Council running a consultation on people's experience of the Cycle Hire scheme:

    https://consultationhub.edinburgh.gov.uk/sfc/echs-user-survey-2022/

    Closing date 27 February.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  10. chdot
    Admin

    “

    Cycle hire scheme

    Edinburgh's bike hire initiative ended in September when operator Serco said it would not agree to an extension of the original contract. All parties said they wanted to start a new one.

    Cllr Arthur said: “With the previous scheme, we seemed to want one for the sake of having one and we didn’t know what to do with it. I want us to use it get people who are not currently cycling to think about cycling and bring it into their daily lives. That's about reaching people who are car-owners but also people in more deprived neighbourhoods. With both the cycle hire scheme and the cycle storage scheme, I’m really keen we think about the bigger picture and use them as a way of getting more people into cycling and make it more attractive to them.

    “I'm also open to, rather than bringing in a big company like Serco, looking at co-operative models around cycle hire schemes, maybe a cycle hire scheme built on the network of independent bike shops we have in the city, something that supports small businesses and gets people cycling and maybe even gets them to buy a bike eventually.”

    “

    https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/its-time-to-move-on-from-the-war-between-motorists-and-cyclists-edinburghs-new-transport-convener-wants-to-see-changes-3723359

    Posted 2 years ago #

  11. chdot
    Admin

    “

    Cllr Arthur said there were no plans to backpedal on active travel but he wants a change of emphasis. "Over the last five years there has been a lot of bandwidth consumed about the war between cyclists and motorists and I'm keen we move on from that and talk more about walking and use of public transport. Edinburgh faces huge challenges. We want to increase the number of people cycling, walking and wheeling. But if we want to reduce the number of cars in the city, public transport is there to do the heavy lifting."

    He said the council had an active travel capital investment programme with £100m worth of projects. "I have no intention of changing that. But we do want to change the narrative a little bit, to be much more about working with communities. There are a few consultations which have just gone live over very local active travel improvements in Leith and South Queensferry and other places. I've been double-checking that to ensure it's meaningful engagement and we can use these exercises as an opportunity to engage with the public."

    “

    https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/its-time-to-move-on-from-the-war-between-motorists-and-cyclists-edinburghs-new-transport-convener-wants-to-see-changes-3723359

    Posted 2 years ago #

  12. chdot
    Admin

    Anyone know if CEC is doing anything to get a hire scheme again?

    Posted 2 years ago #

  13. chdot
    Admin

    To answer my own question, - what is public at least - this is last year’s report -

    https://democracy.edinburgh.gov.uk/documents/s40133/7.5%20-%20Edinburgh%20Cycle%20Hire%20Scheme.pdf

    This is in Thursday’s T&E Committee papers

    Click for clearer

    Anyone know anything ‘behind the scenes’? PM if ‘sensitive’.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  14. Tulyar
    Member

    Brompton Hire have returned to offering the original 2009 system of a staffed hire service, with generous opening hours, but not 24/7

    I have the contacts to prompt

    The hire system can operates as an open public operation or a closed pool bike scheme

    Experience from the 2009 system where SW Trains did the transactions using booking office staff and counter, and then issued doquet to collect bike from the Lost Property Office (effectively staffed 24/7) saw around 100 bikes out on long term hire (several weeks at a time) with a waiting list for new hires, until the bikes wore out (BER)

    A new staffed system can use more electronic handshakes, and possibly share with car hire outlets or bus/rail stations where staff and transaction facilities are already in place.

    This would be cheaper and faster to roll out than the automated units if the operating structure can be set up, and could work for larger institutions - eg NHS Lothian & Borders?

    Remember that ERI site is 15 min bike ride from Shawfair / Newcraighall, Borders is 10 min from Tweedbank as is St Johns from Livingston North.....(although the routes could clearly be improved!)

    Posted 2 years ago #

  15. Tulyar
    Member

    PS If CEC doesn't do anything nature abhors a vacuum....

    Salvation Army set up bands to win 'customers' from pubs with music - Church set up Football League, to keep drinking & football separated.....

    Bike hire from bus operator? or train operator?

    Posted 2 years ago #

  16. chdot
    Admin

    Last year’s report was in fact approved and money is being spent.

    The report (noted above) doesn’t mention the NHS, but it is being involved. An update is due in December.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  17. gembo
    Member

    Just Eat bike at Harrison pk Towpath bins dredged out of the canal.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  18. chdot
    Admin

    “

    We have a report on this coming soon, but the cost is high at a time when the Scot Gov is planning to cut Edinburgh's budget by over £60m.

    “

    https://mobile.twitter.com/cllrscottarthur/status/1576897751274913793

    Posted 2 years ago #

  19. chdot
    Admin

    It will be VERY interesting to see what the CEC report says.

    Assumption is that hire costs ‘don’t pay for themselves’.

    Possibly true if advertising/sponsorship income isn’t high enough.

    And/or theft/vandalism gets out of hand.

    Bigger question is how much would city save on road maintenance etc with a well run hire scheme with high usage due to measures to reduce car use and encourage cycling,?

    Posted 2 years ago #

  20. chdot
    Admin

    Just posted -

    “

    Plus - how does it fit into car reduction km target for the city?

    “

    https://twitter.com/drcarolinebrown/status/1576900284327948289

    Posted 2 years ago #

  21. Morningsider
    Member

    The national active travel budget is increasing annually over the course of this Parliamentary session. This year's national budget stands at £150m. The recently published draft Cycling Framework commits Transport Scotland to supporting fair access to bikes - including support for bike share schemes.

    Yes, Edinburgh City Council's overall budget may be falling (a bad thing), but that does not mean there is no cash to support a new and enhanced public bike hire scheme.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  22. chdot
    Admin

    Quite.

    Also far from clear how much revenue is from ‘sponsorship’ and usage.

    Usage could go up with more bikes, more users & using more!

    PLUS less theft/vandalism.

    The last scheme suffered particularly from unsuitable docks.

    ‘Dockless’ schemes are now common - will that become normal or indeed the only model?

    Will Edinburgh get E-scooters?

    Should it?

    So, wait until December for the CEC report.

    Then, wait until ? for ?

    Posted 2 years ago #

  23. chdot
    Admin

    “

    So, time for congestion charging and workplace parking levy to both act as a 'stick' and generate much-needed revenue to implement sustainable transport policies?

    “

    https://mobile.twitter.com/justacwab/status/1576942076184649730

    Posted 2 years ago #

  24. chdot
    Admin

    “

    Sometimes I think it’s easier to complain about things that can’t be done because EvilSNPGreenScotGov won’t fund them, than to just get on and creatively raise and spend revenue from existing negative externalities.

    “

    https://mobile.twitter.com/alanpaxton/status/1576944818021978122

    Posted 2 years ago #

  25. LaidBack
    Member

    One ray of hope was spotting a UniCycles hire bike parked at West Port. (Maybe someone working at the Western Bar - is it OK to say that moderator :-) ?)

    Continental Powered mid drive model which was launched at Canongate in what seems like only yesterday. Was a car free day when CEC used to do more ambitious ones.
    Continental no longer do e-bike motors which is a shame as it all worked really well with 4 speed hub.

    https://www.ed.ac.uk/transport/cycling/getting-a-bike/unicycles

    Posted 2 years ago #

  26. mcairney
    Member

    The University IT Section are largely based on Argyle House so that's likely to be the reason, of course I couldn't comment on the choice to rent office space at that location nor it's proximity to certain bars :-)

    Posted 2 years ago #

  27. chrisfl
    Member

    I've regularly seen a UniCycle heading into town along the canal. Presumably they are all ex-hire bikes.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  28. Frenchy
    Member

    Suspect the Art College library was the most likely destination. Not that there's anything at all wrong with Western Bar employees cycling to work, of course.

    The bikes are available to students at Pollock Halls and also Pentland House, which is off Chesser Avenue. I assume it's someone living at the latter who is regularly cycling into town on the canal.

    Posted 2 years ago #

  29. Murun Buchstansangur
    Member

    Farcical

    https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/edinburgh-cycle-hire-work-to-bring-back-bike-scheme-should-be-abandoned-council-officials-recommend-3922704

    Posted 2 years ago #

  30. Morningsider
    Member

    The Scottish Government continue to trumpet record spending on active travel. The recently published draft Cycling Framework and Delivery Plan for Active Travel in Scotland 2022-2030, has "Fair access" to bikes as one of its six strategic themes. It even states:

    ...we will expand access to cycles, including adaptive cycles, e-cycles and cycle share.

    What the hell is going on? The policy is there. The cash is there. This should be the easiest of easy wins - no need for TROs, no concerned residents to deal with, established operators who could step in quickly with tried and tested systems.

    Posted 2 years ago #

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