CityCyclingEdinburgh was launched on the 27th of October 2009 as "an experiment".
IT’S TRUE!
CCE is 15years old!
Well done to ALL posters
It soon became useful and entertaining. There are regular posters, people who add useful info occasionally and plenty more who drop by to watch. That's fine. If you want to add news/comments it's easy to register and become a member.
RULES No personal insults. No swearing.
To describe a Brompton on a cycle forum as 'a wobbly wee folding bike' however is to do them a great disservice. The steering is quick but stable, the frames are very strong and the weight limit is high. There are very few who could not ride one.
Putting aside that it was just a humourous little remark - comeonenow.jpeg, they absolutely are less stable, less comfortable, and less robust than a "proper" bicycle, and frankly I think it's only really the "cachet" of the brand that leads people to argue otherwise. They're neat little machines with a valid niche, but not practical alternatives to a proper transit-oriented cycle hire scheme which is what we really need and this kind of thing is, IMO, a distraction from.
I also suspect you're significantly overestimating how many people could comfortably ride them; plenty of current cyclists could, no doubt, but they're not even remotely as accessible to an everyday train-using person as a normal size robust granny bike would be.
Brompton experience I think we end up chalking up to YMMV. Certainly wouldn’t discourage anyone from trying one for themselves.
Also good to know about the Brompton Hires getting within touching distance of Edinburgh but I don’t think anyone was positing that 9 foldies in a locker is an alternative to the hire scheme still needed in the centre. Pretty sure an update on that is due at TEC in the next few months.
“YMMV“
I’m lucky, I have several bikes to choose from when ‘planning’ a ride/trip.
A Brompton wouldn’t be my first choice unless I needed to get on a train I expected to be busy.
“Wobbly” is of course subjective, but often a ‘first impression’ for people used to a ‘conventional’ bike. A few minutes of perseverance/learning curve is enough to ‘acclimatise’.
I’m used to small wheels (Moultons) and appreciate the ‘nippyness’ - quick acceleration.
I’m also used to hub gears. I really like the Brompton wide ratio hub (BWR). This is usually used with a 2 speed derailleur to produce 6 reasonably spaced gears.
Never actually ridden one. I like the simplicity of 3 speeds and am prepared to deal with the ‘gaps’ - fine for urban stop/start riding with some hillyness.
I have never understood the business model of ‘Bromptons in a cupboard’.
But
Very glad that it works for some people.
Works at Sheriffhall? - no idea.
Why isn’t this option available at Waverley/Haymarket? Indeed!
Obviously not a replacement for a ‘proper’/‘mass’ bike hire scheme.
#ThisIsEdinburgh
#It’sSpecial…
Sheriffhall does seem like an utterly weird choice.
Most of the Brompton hire units in London are next to railway stations, not P&Rs.
Isn't the idea here, to:?
- drive to Sheriffhall
- pick up bike, fold it
- get on bus to city centre
- cycle the last mile to destination
Or am I overthinking it?
I think, technically, according to Lothian Buses’ Conditions of Carriage, folders are only accepted in a ‘suitable’ bag. No idea if that’s enforced, or if a bag comes with the hire.
It’s a weird situation, but one entirely created by CEC’s complete misoversight of cycle hire in Edinburgh rather than by Midlothian or BBH.
An IKEA bag will suffice. You can’t get on a bus with paint. Eg if you carry it by the tin handle or in a B and Q bag now Homebase has gone fut. you cannot get on a bus with a fish supper unless you give the driver a chip. You cant get on a bus if you are pished. This one is harder to police/ define.
@neddie I think you’re right. I more meant weird in the context of having zero city centre locations and making Sheriffhall the first one in the region.
Not Edinburgh of course
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Pashley has announced what it calls “a landmark bike share scheme” at Berkeley Group development, The Green Quarter, which it states will “define the future of micromobility.”
The 100-year-old British bike brand has showcased its smart bike share solution at The Green Quarter, an 88-acre parkland and canal-side residential development in Southall, where the bike share scheme is exclusively for residents – making it the first of its kind in the UK.
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https://bikebiz.com/pashley-announces-landmark-bike-share-scheme-at-berkeley-group-development/amp/
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All-electric bike hire scheme to be launched in Edinburgh by next summer - here's how it would work
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Forest, London’s sustainable shared e-bike company, and Bird, a global leader in micromobility and North America’s largest operator, have announced a major integration, which marks the first ever collaboration between two leading micromobility operators in Europe.
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Interesting workshop to consider a possible new bike hire scheme for Edinburgh today.
Another operator will run a workshop tomorrow, then we’ll get a report to committee in the Spring looking at options.
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https://bsky.app/profile/chasbooth.bsky.social/post/3lj3ujikzb22u
Thread
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City of Edinburgh Council is currently planning to launch a two-year pilot of an all-electric bike hire scheme, run by a private operator.
Robert Armstrong, Deputy Senior Responsible Officer at City of Edinburgh Council’s Transport and Environment Committee, explained: “This pilot will help inform the Council on how to effectively expand the cycle hire scheme in the future. We are exploring various options to support and encourage use throughout the city once the pilot phase is complete.”
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I have been involved in delivery of automated bike hire schemes since 1996, when the 2 schemes in Portsmouth & Rotterdam were part of the EU CIVITAS/VIVALDI programme to deliver a Total Mobility offer, with a single 'account' using an RFID card to hire bikes, use car club cars, use buses, and trains, paying a single monthly bill to a single provider
This was launched in Belgium 16 years ago by the Public Transport operator TEC. Scrap an old car and you got 3 years free bus travel, car club membership, plus a folding bike for €12/month
I was involved with the launch of several schemes including Brompton Hire in 2009, where Brian Souter, whose managers I'd had dealings with to deliver cycle carriage on buses & coaches from 1996 onwards, told his managers at SW Trains that he wanted to hire Bromptons as a way to offer faster door to door journeys for passengers. This was a genius detail as users paid for the hire at the ticket counter in Waterloo, and then went down to Lower Road SE1 (not even known to London taxi drivers!) where the bikes were kept in the lost property store to hanbd out and receive back
Before long there were 100 Bromptons out on near continuous hire with a waiting list, and in 2010 I worked to marry Brompton with a company making automated lockers. With DfT support the first Brompton hire lockers were launched at Guildford, and an early user cut 25 minutes from his morning commute from Guildford to Knightsbridge, plus the added costs of a London Zones supplement with 2 changes of train, by just travelling to Clapham Junction and cycling
From the survey data for the Copenhagen free city bikes (launched 1995) I also assessed the typical patterns for most city bike hires, plus the very different pattern for Brompton hire, which the Barca scheme (Bi-cing) - launched a year before Paris, by Clear Channel, also replicated, with typically 1 bike hired 8 times in a day
The Brompton Hire units now have 8 lockers, which require 1.6m² of space along the face of a wall or free standing, and the lockers can store 8 bikes. From the outset this system was designed to normally operate with no hard wired connections, using solar power to release the locks, and 4g/wifi for the data links. For a well serviced location one unit can support up to 32 bikes out on hire, with typical hires lasting several days or longer. The detail is that users do have to book collection and return slots to ensure there is a bike/space available
In a return to the original deal Brompton now also 'lease' the same bikes with prices starting at £35 per month (for long term leases). Bikes are courier delivered, ready to use, and a regime of bike swap for servicing is used
Frustratingly the bureaucratic inertia of Network Rail means that Brompton Hire units are going in at sites just outside stations, with my long term contacts at Hitrans being early customers, placing hire units just outside Elgin Station (at supermarket?), just outside Inverness (Falcon Square) and just outside Oban (bus stops), the relatively low cost I believe saw these installed to mop up an underspend in the budget, and a further unit went in at Stornoway ferry terminal. The Glasgow unit was installed at Jimmy's (CU site) next door to Buchanan Bus Station, as have the ones near Edinburgh
The success of the Nextbike scheme in Glasgow, has a number of factors behind it
- the local management contract was delivered through Bike for Good, using locally recruited staff, well in tune with cycling culture, who were eventually split from the charity, to operate as a commercial organisation, at first Motion Forward, but now part of the larger Velogik, organisation who have contracts to manage both Nextbike and Beryl bikes in Leeds (& Manchester?)
- the branding paid the base costs for CPH City Bikes in 1995, and continues to provide a core cost base to maintain the service. I base the delivery of bike hire schemes, free pedicabs, and even cycle parking stands on the prices available from media price guides (BRAD or Willeys Guide), and the typical pricing for the industry standard of a 6-sheet illuminated poster (currently c.£1200 per month depending on the location) you can 'buy 40 branded bikes for the price of a single poster, or support a rider with a pedicab offering free rides around the city centre, especially in large pedestrian areas. Cycle parking stands with added value like the Homeport electronic locks on cables that thread through the bike and wheels, with a tamper alarm to alert the bike owner if the lock/cable are interfered with. The electronic locks use a 'handshake' code that makes the lock exclusive to the mobile device or RFID card used
In Manchester the bikes are branded by Starling Bank, In Milton Keynes its Santander (Nextbike) but in London its Santander (Serco). With Glasgow's contract being retendered this year, the OVO contract also ended, so bikes are at present branded 'Glasgow' until the new contract begins
I do note with concern a possible naievete in how a successful bike hire scheme need to be set up, especially the reputation for some of the operators names I hear mentioned
In Scotland we have, to date always used Section 97 (Roads Scotland Act 1984) to require bike hire operators to be licensed as commercial use of the public roads (Street Trading), with the Council having clear T&C & KPI for the operation of the scheme
Glasgow's success has also gained from 'corporate' and user group block memberships with low inertia to join
Asylum seekers, households with transport poverty get free or a 95% discount on membership, to get use of the basic bikes (not EAPC) for up to 1 hour free, and I see these in frequent use. For the UCI races there was also a completely free for all users offer for the regular bikes
Universities also offer free or discounted memberships
Ultimately the bike hire should be a single Total Mobility package, especially for those already using the NEC (Saltire) bus passes, with this providing a great way to promote active travel for older people, which can be measured, through observing how a person making regular bike hires, might have lower heart rate and other common health gains of regular cycle users
If the Heriot-Watt folk see this do get in touch, I've only been working with public bike hire since 1995 ... just 30 years!
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