Where to begin with the reporting of this tragic accident? Given that the lorry was left-hand drive, does that mean that the 'offside' is the right-hand side? If so, this article seems to be implying that cyclists should choose the side on which to overtake large vehicles based on the driver position rather than the convention of the right-hand side!
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Cycling News
Italian aristocrat riding illegal fixie bicycle no front brakes crushed to death
(21 posts)-
Posted 6 years ago #
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"Reporter" Andy Wells can barely conceal his glee at this tragic death. You can almost hear him rubbing his hands and muttering "Bunch of foreigners, shouldn't be over here in the first place, deserve everything they get".
Having said that, the young man's course of action seems rather high risk, and alas he paid with his life.
Posted 6 years ago # -
I also have an "illegal customised bike" (I admit it, I changed my pedals to SPDs with no built-in reflectors).
Posted 6 years ago # -
@dougal - only if your riding it in the dark of course.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Oh and "he wasn't wearing a helmet". Well that would have stopped the catastrophic injuries from a truck rolling over him, wouldn't it?
Posted 6 years ago # -
@rider73 At about this time of year I've basically forgotten what it's like to ride in daylight...
Posted 6 years ago # -
@dougal aye !
Posted 6 years ago # -
Very sad for Sig. Corsini, his family and friends.
@jdaniekp: Given that the lorry was left-hand drive, does that mean that the 'offside' is the right-hand side?
Offside and nearside are defined by which side of the vehicle the footway/edge of the road is on, based on the side of the carriageway that a vehicle should be driving. Not by the location of the driving seat within the vehicle. In the context of a vehicle being driven (in accordance with the rules of the road) along a normal single carriageway road, the side of the vehicle next to the gutter is the nearside, and the side nearer the middle of the road is the offside.
So for a vehicle being driven in the UK, the offside is the right hand side for someone facing in the direction that the vehicle is facing (ie the starboard side, in nautical terms). For a vehicle being driven on the continent, the offside is the port side.
Most non-single-track motor vehicles have the driver's seat on what is normally the offside of the vehicle, based on the assumption that the country it is sold in will be the country that it is used in. Hence the overwhelming majority of cars sold in the UK are RHD.
(The term "starboard" is supposedly derived from the side that old ships used to have the rudder, in the days when it was just a board or oar hung out the side of the rearmost pointy end of the vessel. This in turn perhaps being determined by the steersman's right arm likely being stronger than his left - see also sword arms, and the sneaky trick of employing left-handed swordsmen to attack fortifications designed to keep a right-handed swordsman's shield away from the defenders. Although it would likely be trivially simple to find etymologists and historians who disagree with the aforegoing.)
Posted 6 years ago # -
I believe the near side off side also relates to context in this case the offside would refer to the outside away from the curb as describing a vehicle in relation to position on the road. If was not describing the vehicle in relation to position in the road then may relate to where steering wheel it may relate to the typical relationship to the road for the vehicle. If someone ordered an American car part for an American imported car which side would it be? What if a vehicle with opposite side steering wheel, some vehicles have gutter side steering wheel so if ordered a part for a right hand drive truck that is designed to be driven on the right from an American supplier the off side would be the left.
A horses is nearside on the left even in America/right hand drive countries the nearside always left.
Think it depends on if describing vehicle on the road, if not on the road the typical side for intended purpose of vehicle and country built for, apart from a horse which is near side left unless describing in relation to position on the road in traffic context then if describing horse in accident the nearside would switch back kerbside even in right hand drive country.
Posted 6 years ago # -
@ejstubbs thank you for the explanation - so conventional wisdom is to pass large vehicles on the offside due to the driver of a right-hand drive vehicle having a better view down that side of their vehicle, yet the inquest focussed on the fact that because Filippo did exactly, he actually put himself in greater danger because it happened to be a left-hand drive lorry. I suppose it might have had a foreign numberplate, which could have provided a warning, but the implication is essentially that he was at fault by making what would usually be considered to be a safe pass.
Posted 6 years ago # -
On the motorway left hand drive lorries can swing out best to check the number plates before passing I was driving through Birmingham motorway and left hand lorry pulled out had to squeeze on centre area no damage. In London with left hand drive lorries being common would be prudent to be aware of drive side. There is a slight problem in that some southern halers have left had drive lorries with uk plates. The plate is non conclusive but its a fairly safe bet if has German plates is left drive
Posted 6 years ago # -
"illegal fixie bicycle no front brakes crushed"
"I also have an "illegal customised bike""
Modifying stuff; whether having a bearing on an accident or not, will always draw perhaps incorrect conclusions about how the accident happened; and also bring views on an individual to the fore too.
I've have modified bikes, and cars, and if I were to have an accident in either it would probably be deemed to be contributory whether it actually was or not.
Stereo types also play a role too, "wasn't wearing a helmet", "had a custom exhaust"; on peoples view of blame.
In this case, tragically the cyclist was probably at fault, but nether his lack of helmet, nor front brake were the cause of his death.
Posted 6 years ago # -
The underlying fault lies with the system we have designed, whereby lorries with huge blind spots are allowed on the same roads as vulnerable road users.
Perhaps lorries with blind spots should be restricted to motorways only - that would help focus the minds of the truck designers...
Posted 6 years ago # -
@nedd1e_h I agree... The argument is usually made that the death of a cyclist is 'their fault' if they have overtaken a large vehicle on the nearside, and yet suddenly, in this case, the argument is conveniently reversed to the offside instead. The only argument that really needs to be made is to not allow larger vehicles to share the road with bikes.
Posted 6 years ago # -
The point is that the poor chap overtook an HGV and then plonked himself in front of it, presumably at a junction while the HGV was stationary, and in the driver's blind spot.
If he had not overtaken at all perhaps he would still be alive and we'd not be debating the dubious "journalism" of Yahoo news.
Yes we can say it's a aystemic issue and cyclists shouldn't have to share the road with HGVs, but in that case then none of us should be cycling until there's total segregation everywhere.....or conversely that HGVs should be banned until there's total segregation everywhere...
Posted 6 years ago # -
@crowriver it would be nice to believe that HGVs could be banned from urban areas regardless of the infrastructure.
Posted 6 years ago # -
@crowriver: The point is that the poor chap overtook an HGV and then plonked himself in front of it, presumably at a junction while the HGV was stationary
From the description of the incident in the report linked in the OP, it sounds more like it happened while both the lorry and the bike were moving:
Shortly after overtaking the HGV, the cyclist then pulled in front of the lorry which was accelerating faster than Mr Corsini.
It sounds like a bad, and ultimately fatal, misjudgement on the part of Sig Corsini - but who knows exactly how accurate the report is?
Posted 6 years ago # -
"It sounds like a bad, and ultimately fatal, misjudgement on the part of Sig Corsini - but who knows exactly how accurate the report is?"
Well indeed. He may have been pootling along minding his own business and then an inattentive HGV driver ran him over.
We can't know, we were not there. Presumably report is based on testimony at inquest? Sounds like a Coroner's Inquest, English equivalent of a Fatal Accident Inquiry here.
Posted 6 years ago # -
@crowdriver
The point is that the poor chap overtook an HGV and then plonked himself in front of it
The problem is, we cannot expect every single human being who might ever ride a bicycle to know that riding directly in front of an HGV is a very bad idea as the driver won't be able to see you.
You, I and I dare say all of CCE know this. But many people around the world do not know this and cannot be expected to know this. So deaths will keep happening needlessly until we change the system.
It is easily possible technically to design a lorry with direct vision out the front and sides, with the rear being covered by cameras / mirrors / autodetector-thingimy-bobbers.
Posted 6 years ago # -
Am I correct to think that all lorries should change the number plate on the trailer to match that on the tractor?
I was almost joined by a left hand drive lorry going through a chicane last week. Thankfully he realised he was an idiot and lent on his horn rather than his accelerator. I stopped briefly in the chicane once I knew he was behind me to give him a long hard stare and pretend I was reading his numberplate. Once it was safe enough for me to let him past I glanced at the back which appeared different.
Posted 6 years ago #
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