Once it’s actually complete later this year I think it’ll be quite good for most. Depressing yes, but useable. Most routes are logical, the main issue is probably York Place - Broughton Street which will be very awkward unless there’s some sort of two stage right turn added.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
Picardy Place lanes taking shape
(527 posts)-
Posted 2 years ago #
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I've felt okay doing it lycra-ed up on a road bike, but you really have to be confident, assertive and take primary
I think part of the problem is that I've done almost no city riding, my utility riding is limited to places with some infrastructure beyond that it's been mtb and thanks to the limited lanark road lanes I can get into the hills with virtually no exposure to busy roads.
I may have lost the thick skin required to get round in Edinburgh.
Posted 2 years ago # -
I purchased a second hand Dutch bike a few years ago. The sellers had moved here from the Netherlands, where they naturally cycled everywhere. They brought their bikes with them, presumably hoping to do the same in Edinburgh. Despite living in Bruntsfield, within easy reach of the canal, Meadows, etc. they sold their bikes....and bought a car.
Says everything about the state of cycling infrastructure in this city really. Also maybe that people tend to do what their neighbours do, unless very strong willed and/or eccentric.
(I'm aware that Dutch bikes are not ideal for Edinburgh's hilly terrain, but they are still usable).
Posted 2 years ago # -
I cycle it down from John Lewis quite regularly - both going down Broughton or further down Leith / London Rd. It's not pleasant but taking primary I've never had any real issues.
Coming the other way is totally different. Not easy to maintain primary up passed Playhouse and then down Broughton. Refuse to use the cyclelanes as have to beg to get out again.
The people who signed it off should be made to cycle it twice a day, both ways at rushhour for eternity.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Not sure about “eternity”.
If they did it a couple of times, might demand a redesign…
(Though they might have to wait a long time for action!)
Posted 2 years ago # -
The people who signed it off should be made to cycle it twice a day, both ways at rushhour for eternity.
They can be observed by the muppets who signed up the tram stop shelter design who should be standing beside their masterpiece until the devil himself gets bored.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Not sure about “eternity”.
If they did it a couple of times, might demand a redesign…
not nearly enough for the misery they have inflicted upon a significant number of people and will continue to inflict as they continue to implement design such as this.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Tried to go up Broughton and turn right along York Place the other day. Gave up and walked it over the junction. Such a nonsense.
Eternity still feels about right.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Worry not because it'll be entirely different tomorrow anyway... https://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/tramstonewhaven/downloads/file/533/stead-s-place-to-springfield-street-traffic-management-plan
Posted 2 years ago # -
Posted 2 years ago #
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This sounds like old plans!??
“
They show the island re-imagined as a new public realm space with landscaping, trees, a water fountain and access for pedestrians and cyclists.
The blueprint also includes proposals for several bike stands and a ‘cycle hire location’.
“
Posted 2 years ago # -
I'm relieved that they're considering a water fountain rather than, for example, a sherbet fountain - that could get messy.
Claire Miller urged officials to engage with the stakeholders before plans are finalised.
She added they are “aware we are working to quite tight time-scales to deliver this” and noted there has been “a bit of frustration in the past” over the level of engagement from the council.
No kidding. Spring 2023? I think there is plentiful evidence of what happens to timescales when "stakeholders" become "engaged" (see e.g. http://citycyclingedinburgh.info/bbpress/topic.php?id=15762&page=17).
Posted 2 years ago # -
Went down Leith Walk yesterday evening. Used the lanes going downhill. They are just about OK if you are going slowly and there are not many people around. I thought pedestrians were being pretty good at staying off the cycle lane. However the lane is too narrow and the pedestrian space is too narrow. I think that once the whole thing is open again, I'd probably use the road downhill or the very rare occasion I go that way. Uphill I don't know (I didn't come back that way).
Posted 2 years ago # -
I went down Leith Walk last week,and I know that in theory, the bike lanes aren't open yet (har har), but they seem to be a nightmare waiting to take off.
loads of people going the wrong way, but then signage painted on the path that seemed to suggest that this was intended? but only, not consistently? Like, for a while the signage points downhill, then up, then down... and if you join from a side road, it's not always clear which way you'd be encountering.
I also thought pedestrians were really consistent about not walking in the cycle lanes. i think over the course of an hour, I only saw two people walking in them. one moved as soon as he saw me, and the other moved after his wife saw me to told him to move.
Posted 2 years ago # -
“
#PicardyPlace
#edinwebcastQ: @SanneDD asks re connections #BroughtonStreet<--> island
A: Very difficult junction, walk/cycle/tramlines/car in small area
Direct bike route to Broughton St impossible, but seeking smaller changesCttee approves report, no guarantee re missing cycle links
“
https://mobile.twitter.com/spokeslothian/status/1588180977766916097?
Thread
Posted 2 years ago # -
Yeah, that's not a difficult junction when you apply the hierarchy.
Simply put a bus-gate in at the top of Broughton St. Buses, cycles, pedestrians only. Job done.
Posted 2 years ago # -
It's not a "difficult junction", it's a terrible design. 1960s style gyratories are not simply compatible with walking and cycling.
EDIT - dang, beaten to it by neddie!
Posted 2 years ago # -
“dang, beaten to it by neddie!“
No
Double wisdom
Posted 2 years ago # -
Not mineApparently the ped crossing is open. Will bikes be using it??
Actually that’s Leith Walk (by Gayfield Square), but at least something is happening…
Posted 2 years ago # -
So, this afternoon we were in the car, waiting for the green light in the lane for Broughton Street in front of the cathedral. Green light for the turn left into York Place comes on and the first two cars in the left hand lane (which has a left turn arrow painted on the tarmac) go straight ahead down Broughton Street. I believe at that point in the sequence, traffic exiting York Place has a green light to head towards Leith Walk. Just as well there were no vehicles doing that.
Picardy Place (and all the rest of the new Leith Walk traffic management design, based on evidence at Brunswick Road and London Road) is an accident waiting to happen. Drivers are either too inattentive, too stupid or too ignorant to observe the rules, and there is no enforcement, so they will keep doing it until someone gets hurt.
Posted 1 year ago # -
They'll keep doing it even after someone is hurt. 120 years of motoring have told us that.
Posted 1 year ago # -
It's a pretty sorry patch of grass, isn't it?
Here's a big car junction we* made earlier: https://goo.gl/maps/3wv6etJ8Wxky4ieP6
* well, France
Posted 1 year ago # -
Every aspect of Picardy Place seems to suggest it was modelled to within an inch of its life with perfect model drivers that stick perfectly to narrow lanes, instinctively understand which of the seven(!) traffic lights they can see apply to them and know exactly where they're going.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Well I suppose if you are modelling ’options’ on a computer it’s easy to get drivers to 'behave’…
Posted 1 year ago # -
Grand Theft Auto is 25 years old ;-)
Probably has more influence than we'd like!Posted 1 year ago # -
Additionally I’ve now realised/decided that an increasing number of drivers really don’t care.
This is partly because they know there’s a minimal chance of enforcement/sanction - see also mobile phone use - plus, to some extent, exasperation with the whole LW ever changing ‘rules’.
However I think there are more widespread social changes - call it the ‘post Covid effect’(?)
UPDATE
@ LB - GTA - probably, I’d still argue there are more noticeable changes more recently.
Posted 1 year ago # -
I don't even think it's an issue of not caring - I've noticed a significant spike in petty, spiteful behaviour in the last few weeks. Not an increase in the "I'm glad I wore my brown trousers today"-tier close passes/near-accidents, but just stuff like overtaking just so they can turn off 0.5 seconds quicker, refusing to let me merge with traffic, suddenly deciding they need to be half a metre closer to the kerb/parked cars just as I'm approaching to pass them on the inside in a queue, inching forward into the bike box when they see cyclists coming up behind etc.
We've not quite hit the level of psychotic disregard for non-motorised life forms you get from a lot of American drivers, but it very much does seem like there's a lot more "ROADS are for CARS not PUNY HUMAN FLESHBAGS, and I'm gonna make sure you know it" people on the road these days.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Just realised that flashing ambers at crossings don't exist so much now in city. Pelican crossings on way out? Used to be a thing but many going straight amber then green - or am I mistaken? Was going to ask on twitter / mastodon.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Yes - pelican crossings have been 'deprecated' for some time. New puffins use detection equipment to stay red while pedestrians cross then go green afterwards, and often use 'nearside' instead of 'farside' pedestrian signals. You will rarely see a pelican with LED lights.
Posted 1 year ago #
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