Pretty comprehensive!
Some people won’t be happy...
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » General Edinburgh
Dundas plaque
(140 posts)-
Posted 3 years ago #
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Some people won’t be happy...
This could go on the list with death and taxes, to be fair.
Posted 3 years ago # -
This may fit here.
Posted 3 years ago # -
Taken today (not by me).
Posted 3 years ago # -
Nice Infographic
no mention of his locking up his wife and taking all her money. Still that was par for the course for many of these statues.
Bit of wiki puts Elizabeth rannie at age 14 when married and had four children. Though the Henry Dundas page on wiki bends it to 16. After their divorce for her adultery (he kept her out at Melville Caslte and rarely visited) he then took all the money, as the law allowed him to, she lived until 98 but in straitened circumstances. Her wiki page says poverty and discovered in Cornwall at age of 98. Dundas website says he paid her a stipend he didn’t need to, this is hilarious, he took all her money. and her son continued the stipend.
These Masons, eh?
Posted 3 years ago # -
“
In the new year, an amended register was published that included missing holdings. Campaigners have demanded that Drax pay reparations to Barbados for the damage inflicted by his ancestors on enslaved people forced to work on their plantations.
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Posted 3 years ago # -
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Sir Geoff, who is leading the Edinburgh Slavery and Colonialism Legacy Review Group, said the silver items were a stark reminder of the 630,000 slaves forced to wait more than a decade for their freedom after the abolition was delayed by controversial Scottish figure Henry Dundas.
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Posted 3 years ago # -
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He was confounded and disappointed to realize that some audiences, particularly in Europe, weren’t fully comprehending the work of what he calls “one of the best, if not the best analyst of what racism is”, believing it to be primarily an American concern.
“I wanted to prove them wrong, that in fact they are the origin story and that United States racism is just the continuation of a long history of Eurocentric domination,”
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Posted 3 years ago # -
Posted 3 years ago #
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That gent certainly has a high opinion of his work. I suspect people 30 or 40 years from now won't be looking back on the Current Year trend with as much reverence and respect as he suspects.
Reading his characterisations of people, I think he's labouring under the common burden of most intellectuals - he believes most people either don't know or don't understand what he knows, when in reality most are perfectly aware and comprehending at least in a general sense, they simply place less importance on it in their day-to-day lives, and don't agree with every political conclusion the intellectual draws from their own understanding. And to briefly circumvent the inevitable; my personal views are broadly in the same vein as Peck, I just try very hard not to think of people who disagree with me in such dismissive and patronising terms as he.
Posted 3 years ago # -
I’ve lost the thread. Which gent are you referring to Yodrin?
Posted 3 years ago # -
Aye on rereading it's not very clear - I was referring to Raoul Peck, the filmmaker from the Guardian article a couple of posts(and six months, apparently - didn't clock that before) ago.
Posted 3 years ago # -
Got it! I’ve met Geoff Palmer a few times (before he became famous!) and your take didn’t sound much like him! Although I have seen him stick quite stubbornly to his guns against sympathetic historians who don’t think he’s got his facts/analysis quite right.
Posted 3 years ago # -
That campaign's been going a lot longer than 2 years.
Posted 3 years ago # -
Here we go again: https://citydev-portal.edinburgh.gov.uk/idoxpa-web/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=RHVRK6EWFSB00
Posted 2 years ago # -
At Development Management sub-committee next week (Agenda):
Melville Statue, St Andrew Square, Edinburgh - Removal of plaque - application no. 22/04496/LBC - Report by the Chief Planning Officer pdf icon PDF 91 KB
It is recommended that this application be GRANTED.
EDIT: Worth noting that this is the listed building consent; there is a separate "full" planning application in the system somewhere too. The listed building consent application appears to be entirely concerned with "Will removing this plaque damage the building?"
Posted 1 year ago # -
That whole thing is weird and rather sad.
But I do think the council erred badly in not including a professional historian on the committee, if only to protect themselves from such criticism).
Posted 1 year ago # -
From the report:
"It should be noted that assessment of this application is restricted solely to the impact of the proposal on the character of the listed building and no regard can be had to the content of the text that is displayed on the plaque.
In addition, the granting of the listed building consent application does not confer ownership rights to remove the plaque."
Posted 1 year ago # -
One of the quirks of the Scottish planning system is you can apply for permission to do something without actually owning the property, or the ability to deliver the proposals in the application. This power exists for good reason - a developer can hold an option to purchase land subject to securing an award of planning permission.
I see from the application documents that the applicants don't actually own the monument, so would need the agreement of all its owners to remove the plaque, even if they get permission.
Planners had to recommend approval of this proposal, as it meets all the relevant policy requirements - which do not include the wording on the plaque.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Dundas pursued the gradual abolition of slavery
Aye, just like the fossil fuel industry and its shills pursue the gradual "abolition" of fossil fuel, all while finding and extracting new reserves...
Posted 1 year ago # -
Isn't the point exactly that those kinds of comparisons are still disputed? Cos if Tom Devine is questioning your interpretation of history I dunno, seems like it at least merits a little reflecting.
Posted 1 year ago # -
There is a spat between Sir Geoff and Tam Devine.
Goes like this
Geoff - Dundas delayed the abolition of slavery, this is wrong
Tam - you are not a historian Geoff, you should leave history to the historians.
Geoff - hmm, that doesn’t alter that Dundas delayed the abolition of slavery.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Love it - no-one does petty spats better than senior academics.
Posted 1 year ago # -
@gembo Ahh righto, so it's a creative fiction thread.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Lodge Gorebridge Dundas 1039
Early twentieth century version with the Sir Bobby and the Sir Harry Dundases being the master of this lodge now having to share premises in Newtongrange. SIr Harry even made it as high as Provincial Grand Master of the whole of Midlothian. I will continue my research and be awarded a degree.
Original Delayer of Abolition was I believe the Grand Master of Scotland in the 18th Century.
Posted 1 year ago #
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