"More than 10,000 people have signed LCC's petition calling for all London councils to provide cyclist-awareness training for their lorry drivers."
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Cycling News
Call for council driver training
(9 posts)-
Posted 13 years ago #
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as you know, I drive a lorry. I ride a bike. Re the post about cyclist crushed, elswhere on this forum.
How many people would sign a petition calling for cycling organisations to provide lorry awareness training for cyclists ? I like to think of myself as open minded and fair. So why is just one group of road users that have to consider others ? I understand the vulnabillity of cyclists, but pedestrians are also vulnerable.The infirm and the handicapped. Surely a better approach is to all understand everyone else has as much right to be considered as every one else. Please dont think that I am suggesting that lorry drivers, or van ,or bus, or car,or tractors ,or any drivers are at great risk from cyclists, but just that if ( I know its a big If ! )everyone was a little more considerate and understanding of everyone else then MAYBE we could get on a bit better. Again in no way trying to underestimate the danger that is posed by a badly driven wagon,just trying to preach understanding !
Training for ALL road users should be on going.Posted 13 years ago # -
driver, cyclist, and hippy. ;)
I agree tho, more awareness of large vehicles and their blindspots would be a good idea too.
Posted 13 years ago # -
From looking at some of the videos going around, some cyclists could definately do with more awareness of large vehicles, pedestrians and everyone else. However you only have to look at the difference between First Bus and Lothian to see the huge difference that driver training makes to our safety.
I was pretty dissapointed to see that this referred to London and not Edinburgh as I generally find that council vehicles are driven rather badly and aggressively.
Posted 13 years ago # -
splitshift - presumably the reason goods vehicles are being targeted in London is that a high proportion of all deaths are the result of goods vehicle collisions (80% of women cyclists who are killed in London are killed by the driver of a goods vehicle).
I quite agree that, for example, cyclists should be made aware of situations where they are more likely to be hit and taught things like riding more centrally to prevent a large vehicle trying to squeeze past, as well as obvious stuff like not trying to ride up the inside of something that is already halfway through turning left!
Pragmatically though, there are only a small number of people driving large vehicles (only ~3% of traffic in London) while there are a very large number of people riding bikes (more than 50% of vehicle movements across the Thames bridges in rush hour are now made by cyclists).
Anyone trying to identify the best way to intervene in fatal goods vehicle incidents would choose to target the tiny minority, from an cost/benefit perspective if nothing else.
Posted 13 years ago # -
Beware of things with more wheels than you, watch out for those with fewer.
I tend to forget that not everyone received cycling proficiency training in primary school, even though there are limits to the relevance of on-the-road training to modern city cycling when the training was provided down a cul-de-sac outside a primary school in a small village well before school-finish time. Paying attention to reports of initiatives or accidents and so on counts as ongoing training, but not everyone does that. Addressing "all cyclists" to supply information or training is next to impossible whereas targeting "all drivers employed by X" for training specific to the weapons they wield is reasonably simple.
As not every cyclist reads the news another place to warn cyclists to stay away from large vehicles' blind-spots and swipe-zones is the vehicles themselves, which a few construction-trucks are now doing, though even the allegedly-trained-and-cycle-friendly LRT still only have the "please let me pull out" sticker on the right and lack a "no sneaking down my left-hand-side" sticker on the left (or preferably all over the entire rear of the bus to leave no space for Grant Stott's face).
Ensuring that no cycle is sold without checking that the buyer or recipient is competent and careful would be about as policeable as the current law banning the serving of inebriating substances to the already-inebriated.
Posted 13 years ago # -
Also, in 2008 VOSA reported that over 37% of HGVs tested were not roadworthy. Perhaps we have a better quality of HGV in Edinburgh but it does make you think. 37%!
I actually find the drivers of big trucks to be quite agreeable, it's the ones in middle-sized things (where I suspect you don't have to have much of a licence) like bin lorries, concrete & tippers, etc that are more often fear-inducing.
Posted 13 years ago # -
In fairness when they say "not roadworthy" VOSA will issue prohibitions for relatively minor defects, that's not to say it is defensible but it doesn't mean 37% of trucks have no brakes and the doors hanging off!
To use a VERY broad brush and therefore invite abuse, most of the largest trucks are driven by drivers whose profession is driving, many of the smaller wagons (and I'm thinking here mainly of the council) are driven by workers who the company put through their C licence years ago and for whom driving is an extra not a core skill, hence the difference in attitude imho.
I also wonder if oor cooncil manage any continuation training at all as the standards of driving I witness (especially from their bin lorries) reminds me more of a 17 year old in a hot hatch with his mates rather than any sort of professional, certainly if my fleet manager (or a traffic Policeman) saw me driving one of our wagons that way I'd expect a one way chat with threats of disciplinary action!
and don't even start me on the Post Office!!Posted 13 years ago # -
kinda thought I might get replies about this ! Yes, lower weight class c etc drivers are indeed driving as an addon to their work, minority is easiest target and therefore better to "retrain ". As a professional driver I see it as my duty to be better than most. Might not actually be true but I try !Vehicle defects, unroadworthy ? Does anone have the figures for private cars, or busses or.......bicycles ! As HGV are vocational then they do tend to be taregeted, quite rightly ! Vosa now have a whole raft of new powers, ( I know , they are not new, just the way that they are capable of being implemented ! )I dont think that many hgv drivers are evil cycle hating, baddies but they do have to be more carefull , every time they do anything at all ! esp turning left ! Just keep an eye out, be safe, and keep on trukin safe !
As for royal mail, bigger is best, ther artic drivers are amongst the most courteous out there ! And they seem unlimited ........zoooooooooooom !Posted 13 years ago #
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