CityCyclingEdinburgh was launched on the 27th of October 2009 as "an experiment".
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I've always ridden with flat bars, the BMX/MTB thing happened when I was younger, so I never had a 'racer'.
Question now with the single lever brakes is, how do you actually brake when you are riding on the hoods, can you get enough pressure with two fingers at the top of the lever, or do you have to drop your hand down?
Three fingers.
Stupid compact geometry means that it's only comfortable to ride on the hoods, but seeing as the gears can only be safely operated from on top of the hoods and I change gear more often than I brake I don't mind. I'd need to look to see if I start at the top of the lever and slide down as the lever is pulled in. Don't think I do. I perhaps shift my hands slightly and grab the lever lower if I know I'll be crash-stopping rather than merely slowing. I never have to move my hands so much that I can't still flick the thumb lever, not that I generally need to after braking.
You can brake easily from the hoods. You can apply more braking pressure from the drops but this is only really needed if you are going fast downhill (or if your brakes are not very good).
When I was young I really wanted a chopper or grifter but fortunately I got a racer. I always preferred using the suicide brakes even though they were rubbish.
Braking on the hoods is nae bother, no need to go down to drops. Even for emergency braking you can get enough leverage on the brake.
"Stupid compact geometry means that it's only comfortable to ride on the hoods"
I have found it a lot easier to ride on the drops on my new bike, which although it has compact geometry, it also has a long head tube (a la sportif).
That's a fair point Amir, can't think of the last time I used the drops, always on the hoods.
I can brake from the hoods fine under most circumstances but I go on to the drops if I think I may need to brake more firmly. I don't know that you actually get more leverage but it is certainly more comfortable as I have quite small hands.
I think there probably is a leverage benefit from the drops. In effect, having moved to mousetache bars on the Kaff, I'm braking all the time as if on the hoods. Definitely seems to stop more sharply.
But on the hoods, with my gigantic hands, I've got no problem braking.
"(or if your brakes are not very good)"
These days dual-pivot brakes tend to be very good so that most people/hands can brake well riding on the hoods.
I have one bike with good quality side-pulls and these are fine for hood braking.
I suspect that 'in the old days' the levers and brake mechs weren't optimally designed to work together well. In the olden days most bikes had steel wheels - so the brakes didn't work when it rained!
On the tourer (fitted with V's) I almost always brake from the hoods. When I got a "road" bike I couldn't believe how poor dual pivot brakes seemed in comparison*, hence on that I mostly use the hoods but the drops if I need actually brake hard.
(I've small hands but years of pulling heavy motorcycle levers so I'm probably average power/leverage overall!)
*Will experiment with other pad compounds when the current set wear out
If you set the levers too high (a la Lance Armstrong) it can be hard to reach them from the drops. So the best position is a compromise between the two. But the effectiveness of dual pivots depends a lot on the quality of the components. Dura Ace and some nice wheels will work a lot better than Sora for example whether operated from the hoods or the drops.
Yeah i noticed a big improvement going from the no name oem callipers to 105.
Definite leverage advantage on the drops but I still get a fright when i go from disks back to dp.
I think there is a slight advantage when braking on the drops, but I almost always have my hands on the hoods and have no real problems. You just develop a different braking style - start braking earlier and roll to a stop.
Anyone know why road bikes still use dual pivot calipers, as their performance is pretty poor - especially in the wet. Although I shudder to think how bad the caliper brakes on my Raleigh Super Equipe (my first brand new road bike, bought from Thomas Piper at Church Hill) must have been.
"Anyone know why road bikes still use dual pivot calipers?"
Lowness of profile?
[notaserioussuggestionsotrynottotakeitasone*]Because they're for use on things intended to travel at speed, perhaps it's to ensure that easily-featherable smoothly gradually increasing braking force application is available to prevent millions of accidents through front-wheel-lock skids?[/notaserioussuggestionsotrynottotakeitasone]
*As might be expected, I am aware of disc brakes and their wheel-locking potential, that disc brakes can be fitted to either wheel and that the bicycles attached to such wheels can be propelled at speeds similar to the speeds at which caliper-braked road bicycles are propelled without widespread calamity.
My theory is that road bikes development is still driven by the pros and one doesn't brake in the peleton.
@Steveo I think you have it there.
Imho the idea that brakes can be too powerful is a complete red herring. On powered cycles we're at the stage of front brakes which will, depending on the road surface, lock up the wheel or stand the bike on its front wheel with only two finger pressure. Millions of accidents caused by powerful brakes are conspicuous by their abscence... in fact i feel a *lot* safer with modern brakes than I did with many earlier bikes!
I've got 1990 Campag Cd'A Delta brakes on my racing bike.
They can be entertaining in action and replacing the cable requires a 3.5mm allen key which is hard to find. I think there is one in this desk drawer.
One of my bikes has 105 brakes and is remarkably effective. The bike with Sora/Tektro is okay by not as good.
I love my discs. Saved me so many times already. I agree with smudge.
The 105 brakes I have on 2 bikes are very good. I have one with 105 levers and the other with Sora levers. The 105 levers are better (there's a little bit of flex in the Sora) but both provide more than adequate stopping power. I've never been impressed with the cheapo Tektro brakes that came as standard on my first road bike and singlespeed. Far too much bend in them.
Doesn't answer the question as to "why" road bikes come with dual-pivots. I guess they just do. And they work...
Discs on my new build (which I'd hoped to finish last night, but last parts haven't arrived - and Kappers, yes, gone with the orange cables to give them a try!).
I find dual pivot calipers far superior to cantilevers. I have Shimano R650 (a caliper with a long drop to accomodate mudguards) and find them excellent in terms of modulation and stopping power.
In comparison the Tektro (CR720) cantis I have on my tourer are pretty spongey and these are the supposedly more powerful cyclocross ones.
canti's for the fail, unless its direct pull.
I have to agree with Ruggtomcat. Although I think dual pivot are adequate, disk brakes are amazing.
My pet hate are v-brakes. I can never centre them because they don't clear the tops of the mudguards.
@Cyclingmollie, what frame/guards/tyres are you using? I've got V's on the LHT which has MASSES of tyre clearance and the v's still (just) clear the mudguards.
Braking on the hoods on my cheapo Revolution tourer is OK, but the brakes have to be fairly well adjusted (which, becuase it's my bike, they're usually not).
/Much/ better performance when on the drops, but that's to be expected as it's basic physics, innit.
Also have chicken levers which are very effective.
Memo to self: need to get new brake blocks.
@Smudge, I'm using Specialized "The Captain" 2.2" knobblies on an EBC Courier. The tyres are about as big as they come - for getting through the mud on the Newhailes/Brunstane path and jaunts up the Pencaitland Railway path. I've had to cut a clearance hole in the rear guard to let the v-brake run freely.
Interesting thanks, I wonder if there is a way round it without resorting to a hacksaw. Hmm will have to have a think! :-)
never had a road bike but I have the yearning
the brakes/drops thing made me wonder too
do i not remember a a lad that racers had a 2nd set of brake levers horizontal to the top of the bars coming from the hoods?
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