CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Commuting

"Expensive for a commuting bike"

(25 posts)
  • Started 12 years ago by Smudge
  • Latest reply from crowriver

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  1. Smudge
    Member

    "Expensive for a commuting bike", it's a phrase I've often heard, and I *sort* of understand the desire to keep a "special" bike all lovely and clean.

    But... surely the commuting bike (assuming one commutes most working days) is the most important one in many ways, surely it is the one you will ride, rain or shine, happy or sad, your travelling companion through the best and worst that life chucks at you.
    Surely your commuting bike should be the nicest bike you can afford?
    But wait, I hear you cry... "the good parts will be wasted".., but no, surely they are more wasted if they sit unused as an art object to only enjoy on a few select days of the year? Surely to have them wear out through constant use, while you enjoy the pleasure of using good quality parts is the opposite of waste?

    It's why my LHT has been built with what some would call wildly overspecced parts for a commuter, it's why I've ridden it for well over a thousand miles of mainly hideous Edinburgh roads so far and just oiled the chain now and again and changed brake pads. (ok, I'll admit it, I wiped the worst of the mud off with a rag recently). It's wy I anticipate thousands more miles on it.
    It still is lovely, it's ride just gets better and it brightens my mornings in a way a BSO simply couldnt.
    (As does the Dahon folder which I spent more than I could afford on. Don't regret it for an instant! ("was right about that saddle though"))

    Don't waste your "best" bikes years sat in a garage/on a plinth waiting for the "right" time to ride it. Make your everyday bike your best bike and ride it as often as possible I say.

    So that's my point. I think the thread title is wrong, what we should say is "it's not very expensive for a commuting bike"

    But what do you ladies and gents think...?

    Posted 12 years ago #
  2. chdot
    Admin

    Yeah good piece.

    "Don't waste your "best" bikes years sat in a garage/on a plinth waiting for the "right" time to ride it. Make your everyday bike your best bike and ride it as often as possible I say."

    Well my current "best bike" is white and doesn't take mudguards, so doesn't go out in the rain.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  3. Dave
    Member

    @OP: Yes and no.

    In some ways I agree - my current commuting bike is dedicated to all-weather utility trips and is the second-most expensive I've owned.

    But, what most club riders mean by a 'best' bike is a bike that wouldn't stand up to daily duty anyway (or at least, not cost effectively). For example a 'best' bike might be very light and fragile, on the understanding that you don't take it out on potholed roads or in the rain, so what does it matter?

    Sure, you *could* commute on carbon tubular wheels (and I've done so, just to say I did) and it was nice, and if I was made of money I might even have kept on doing so, but I'm not (and not that wasteful in truth I hope!)

    The economics of reality mean that a commuter bike is one of the only ones you can own that are truly inexpensive, perhaps even saving you money, which is something that can never be said of any recreational bike.

    Mine cost me the equivalent of 80 weeks travel on Lothian Buses (in 80 weeks, travelling by bus will be significantly more expensive, but that may just cancel out periodic expenses on the bike).

    If the White Fright falls apart after only 80 weeks/4000 miles I will be astonished. By then I'll be about ready to check for the first signs of chain stretch!

    (If you have a slightly more ambitious commute you can really clean up. My first "serious" bike offset a £1520-a-year train fare, so it actually broke even by the end of the first summer, and paid for itself twice over before I moved back into Edinburgh.)

    Posted 12 years ago #
  4. wingpig
    Member

    I have been irked in the past by references to 'only' commuting or 'just' a commuter. Same reasons, really - daily/frequently benefits from comfort/reliability, though I can see how someone who then uses a different bike to take themselves fifty miles from home on evenings and weekends might view that as requiring more reliable/fancy/weightless components, but it doesn't mean that commuting/utility usage is of less importance than audax/sportive usage, just that different people's primary usages vary.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  5. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Smudge,

    couldn't agree more.

    But also guilty of relegating the road bike to club run duties (although it gets plenty of miles in doing that). I just dont think it's an appropriate commuting machine with the "severe" saddle and riding position and not-so-easy-to-clip-in-and-out-of-all-the-time Look pedals. I also think it's going to fall apart or shed a tyre every time it gets a bad pothole.

    But my everyday bike is definitely my "best" bike, favourite bike and most practical bike. That is my "transport" the others are my leisure / recreation bikes. I suppose I'm like the petrol head with a garage full of cars. The road bike is my sports car for sunny summer days, the touring bike is my Winebago for the holidays and the singlespeed is that old classic car that sits in the corner that I'm always tinkering with and is a perma-project that is never quite right...

    But I have deliberately kept the components on the everydaybike lower spec than I might as I go through them at a much higher rate. I'm not tempted to upgrade from 8 speed so long as the setup continues to work, as the consumables are relatively that much cheaper. Bits are replaced as and when they break or wear out. I put fancy GP4000 shoes on when I built it and they were great, but when I came to replace them I went for Gatorskins at half the price.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  6. steveo
    Member

    My "best" bike gets the most use, I've now used it for commuting for 2.5 years with my mountain bike only doing the duty when the roadies been ill, the snow is up to my hubs or I need to carry the coxwain. I've very recently got a single speed though this is more to save the relatively expensive drive trains on the mtb and the roadie from the salt. I'll probably continue to rotate depending on mood, whimsy, weather and post work distance.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  7. I had a bike shop chap express astonishment just a few weeks back that my commuter was ten-speed. "That's extravagant for a commuter". Might seem overly geared given I hopped between that and a fixed wheel. But extravagant?

    Anyway. Smudge. Can I re-use that in citycycling? Love the sentiment!

    Posted 12 years ago #
  8. thebikechain
    Member

    You are in good company Anth. I am 10 sp too.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  9. chdot
    Admin

    "You are in good company Anth. I am 10 sp too."

    There are too issues here.

    More gears means more expensive - in the sense that 6,7,8 etc. always started with more expensive groupsets/bikes.

    On one level it's fashion/marketing, but the purpose is to increase the chance of the 'right' gear (with a small jump to the next one) - important for racing.

    BUT 'too many' gears are perhaps less desirable for urban commuting with junctions and traffic lights.

    Longer commuters will benefit from more gears - having the optimum one for dealing with various wind conditions and gradients. Also there are realiability/longevity factors that should be available with more expensive equipment.

    Around town having fewer gears to change from high gear to low gear can be an advantage.

    Obviously the above refers to derailleur gears. Hubs (available with 3 to 14 gears) are popular for urban riders because they can be changed even when bike is stationary.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  10. Dave
    Member

    I went for a hub so I could have an enclosed chain; and use 1/8th chain and sprockets for greater longevity. I still change down when I'm coming to a stop (old habits die hard?)

    Posted 12 years ago #
  11. chdot
    Admin

    "1/8th chain and sprockets for greater longevity"

    Another disadvantage of multi-geared derailleurs is thinner sprockets and chains, the probability of more frequent gear changes and so (probably) more frequent (and expensive) replacement.

    So it's easy to conclude 'too expensive for commuting'.

    BUT, irrespective of actual economics, there are a lot of factors involved in choosing/using a nice bike(s) that fits YOUR actual requirements.

    Better to 'worry' about people 'stuck' with HEAVY full-sus BSOs!

    Posted 12 years ago #
  12. Dave
    Member

    Yes. I never had to replace the sprocket on my old fixed-wheel, although it did 5-600 miles a month. With an 11-XX 9 speed cassette, 6 months is good going :(

    (Possibly just means I should clean my chain more!)

    Posted 12 years ago #
  13. gembo
    Member

    If I had £300 just there I would have bought the revolution courier [I have been aware of it for years]. It only has 7-8 gears in total. That is enough for commute. It now has disc brakes. It is fast. It has less to wear out. I would use it to commute.

    However, I did not have the cash to splash. I therefore continue to commute on a much better bike - Specialized Tricross that also goes out at the weekend if I have a friend staying who gets my best bike, the one that hangs upside down in garage but is just about to get it's first wheech out in 2012.

    I had hoped my continuing issues with hub gears would be resolved by THe Bike Chain converting my nexus 8 Specialized Crossroads to Sturmey Archer 3 spd. Alas the bike is a little too heavy under load for three gears on way home up the hill and indeed a centimetre too wide for the actual 3 spd [oops]. Should go in a single speed frame, I should have gone for SA 5 spd. I was aiming for simple and went too simple. Still nice to pootle on.

    The trade off is therefore between durability/simplicity on the one hand and speed/comfort on the other.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  14. Baldcyclist
    Member

    I have used my 'best' bike for 3 years now winter and summer, it cost me 250 weeks Lothian bus travel (I like these units of cost). I have mostly loved it, in the summer when it's nice and your doing the full 30 odd miles a day commuting on the lanes, it's fantastic! It's so smooth, and so fast, and so efficient (I love overtaking folks on slight downhills when they are pedalling while I'm free wheeling)!

    The reality in the winter though is slightly different, I don't mind the skinny bald tyres and the directness of the steering. The main issue is what has become affectionately known as 'trench arse', and something which I would rather do without. Unfortunately my 'best' bike will not take mudguards no matter how hard I, or many LBS have tried. It also eats through components in the winter too.

    Another issue with the 'best bike', and despite a bike fit which helped greatly is the stiff neck and tennis elbow which has developed from 2+ hrs a day in the saddle.

    Finally, I seem to have just become a 'commuting' cyclist, I can't remember the last time I went out on a Sunday and just cycled 60 miles to nowhere. Maybe if my 'best' bike was tucked up all warm in the garage all week, I would be more inclined to do those weekend rides so as I could appreciate it again?

    [EDIT] *For the record, there is nothing wrong with only using your bike for commuting! ;)

    Posted 12 years ago #
  15. Smudge
    Member

    @Anth, sure :) most flattered! I hoped it would raise a little debate... ;-)

    In fact if you fancied doing a periodic "readers rides" piece you'd be more than welcome to do my Surly B-)

    (For those motorcyclists who remember "performace bikes" in the 80's (when it still had interesting engineering instead on being a two wheeled top gear/advertising brochure for the big four), I'm thinking of the readers special section they always had on the back two pages!)

    Posted 12 years ago #
  16. Uberuce
    Member

    Am I right in understanding that the top end of components are all designed for sport, with lightness given equal priority to strength, and durability third? They only need to last a season.

    If so, it looks like the industry's missing a trick; just reading this thread it looks like there's a market for parts that have the quality of racing kit but can be heavier and therefore cheaper yet more durable, passing that saving onto the customer?

    Posted 12 years ago #
  17. crowriver
    Member

    @gembo, I used to have a Revolution Courier, 8 speed single chainset, 700c wheels. It was great and perfect for nipping around town, which was all I used it for. It was stolen, and the insurer had a preferred supplier (Wheelies Direct) who replaced it with the Specialized Globe Vienna 2. A significant upgrade, still 8 speed but with 3 chainrings so 24 gears in total.

    The new bike encouraged me to do more leisure riding as well as urban nipping. I bought a child seat for No.1 son, and pretty soon I was teaching myself about all the latest parent-friendly bike gizmos and accessories out there. Two years ago, that was my only bike, it did everything, mostly well.

    Since then I've realised once more (as I did nearly 15 years ago) that having more than one bike is useful. Most of my bikes fit into either utility, urban or touring categories. I don't have a racer (yet) and my rigid fork MTB/Expedition tourer is still 'under construction'.

    For commuting, I use a folder because I have to get the train. Handy for those occasions when the bike rack is full of bikes/golf clubs/oil workers holdalls/baby buggies. I used to use my 'main' bike.

    Personally I think that it is better to have a relatively inexpensive bike for a commute as long as it is comfortable and easy to maintain. If I was commuting a longer distance by bike I'd probably use a hybrid or tourer. 8 speed cog though, for the reasons others have mentioned.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  18. Uberuce
    Member

    My only objection to using a lovely bike for the commute is theft; not from my workplaces, but I'd be inhibited from going for lunchtime shopping trips if I had too much to lose. Maybe if I got a bigger chain...

    Posted 12 years ago #
  19. Dave
    Member

    I think about it a little differently to some of the above. I specifically want things in a 'best' bike that would not be that great for commuting, so if my 'best' bike had to be used to ride to work it would either not be that good at it, or not be that good at recreational duties, or not that good at either!

    For instance, I will never go back to a bike with rim brakes for utility riding. Urgh. I'm also really enjoying the hub dynamo - no more battery lights for me.

    However, to get the 'best' bike I really want, I'll have to fit it with rim brakes. I'd never fit a dynamo to a Saturday morning road club style bike!

    Posted 12 years ago #
  20. Smudge
    Member

    I think perhaps we are focussing a little to hard on "best" bike, (though I grant you I am the one who used the phrase "best bike"! :-o )
    For someone who cycles competitively, their "best" bike may be unsuitable for commuting I grant you, however perhaps if we focus on too expensive, or indeed "not very expensive for a commuting bike".

    I would still suggest that to spend more money on a lesiure bike which is only used on the odd Sunday and to "save" money on a bike used almost daily is a curious choice...

    But that's not to say it's wrong, just curious ;-)

    Posted 12 years ago #
  21. LaidBack
    Member

    In the old days.... pre Laid Back....

    As we didn't have a car we wanted a bike with hub gears, disc brake, hub lights and good enough to do drop offs at school, dance clases etc. Also should be able to go on holiday with and fit on trains. Ability to carry one growing passenger.

    Ended up getting a compact 20" wheeled tandem (by Bernds - German company) with Rohloff and Hope disc. We also looked at the Hase Pino around then too (1999) but wasn't sure how it would be accepted on trains.

    People did say the Bernds was extravagant and a bit 'non-standard' but we used every day, not just weekends.
    Ten years later people may have gone through a car or two but with the right bike you can replace and keep running as long as frame holds. That in many ways was the reason we sell the Helios now. If it keeps more people cycling and commuting doing the kind of drop off tasks they do in a car then it's not extravagant and becomes part of the family.

    Posted 12 years ago #
  22. Dave
    Member

    As soon as you bring non-cyclists into the comparison, all bets are off!

    For example - chap at work spending £70+ a week on fuel who thinks £200 is too much for a commuter bike. He'd be able to save the cost of the bike back six times over in the first year alone if he was driving as far as the park & ride and taking it from there.

    Where else can you get an investment with an annual return of almost 700%?

    Posted 12 years ago #
  23. ruggtomcat
    Member

    I don't really have a worst bike unfortunately, or a best one! One fuego one tricross, two very different bikes and both good at what they do but it really is an either or choice. If I had a bit of spare cash I might get a whippet, but only a cheap one, Id be more inclined to splash on a sit-up city cruiser. Electra style thing. Course I could sell the tricross but...

    Posted 12 years ago #
  24. chdot
    Admin

    "whippet"

    ?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_bicycle

    Posted 12 years ago #
  25. crowriver
    Member

    The first full-sus country lane cruiser?

    Posted 12 years ago #

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