CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure

Things to do on Bank Holiday Monday - redesign your street

(26 posts)

  1. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Took the opportunity of Argyle Place being cleared of cars for road works to redesign the place so that it links onto MMW / towards Leamington Walk much better.

    At the expense of one side of the road losing parking (probably 12-15 cars at most?).

    I've drawn this with the cycle lane at current road level, with a kerb to stop encroachment from parking cars etc.

    Where there is access to sidestreets, this is prioritised in favour of the cycle traffic, with there being the equivalent of a zebra crossing for cars.

    After I drew this I thought about how the kerb would act as a barrier for pedestrians (particularly elderly, partially sighted, mothers with prams etc.) crossing the road, so it would probably be better with either small sections of kerb or even a row of bollards.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  2. Tulyar
    Member

    A sunken slot - or a bauchle as they are called in central Europe might be the solution, with bridge slabs at appropriate spacings/location. Normally bauchles are continuously running with a small stream, keeping the air around fresh and cooled by the continuous evapouration of the water (latent heat and all that). These features mitigate the risk of forming ponds where roads do not drain, and with a water hose - down provide a neat way to clear rubbish down to collect on a grid at the bottom, or dissolve and wash away. There is a feature like this near to City Hall at One London.

    Motor vehicles attempting to cross would drop into the slot - sorting out footway parking.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  3. Zenfrozt
    Member

    Would rumble strips work instead of the curb kaputnik?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  4. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Bollard option, with altered zebra stripes too

    Posted 8 years ago #
  5. kaputnik
    Moderator

    @zenfrozt alas no I think people would drive across a rumble strip if they thought it led to a nice clear bit of smooth tarmac where they could park

    Posted 8 years ago #
  6. sallyhinch
    Member

    Like it.

    My understanding is that blind people prefer kerbs as there's a clear demarcation between the pavement and the road way and it gives them something clear to follow - that's one reason why they dislike shared space. Ridged tiles (I think) let them know when they're encroaching on cycle tracks.

    Having the pavement step down to the cycle track which then steps down to the road means that water won't pool in the bike bit. The usual dropped kerb arrangements can then make it easier for buggies etc. This would also mean that cars coming into and out of the side streets would have humped crossings which would encourage them to slow down and give way to bikes

    I like the way you've retained the statutory pedestrian walking in the bike track...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  7. ExcitableBoy
    Member

    Very nice and surely not too much to ask for, looks low cost to me too. Where else can you sort out? I can see this ending up in the 'fake press story thread' soon.

    How feasible would it be to widen both the footway and cycle lanes, make the road one-way only to cars and replace the bollards with trees?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  8. chdot
    Admin

    Of course the shops would object...

    How do businesses manage elsewhere with similar arrangements??

    In York where the centre is largely pedestrianised, there are a lot of deliveries by cargo bike.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  9. Nelly
    Member

    Now if you could just redesign the Broomhouse bike lane - perhaps to not include plants, clumps of mud, stones, bollards, rubber thingys with screws sticking out of them at Makro, erm have I missed anything ?

    Oh, and I like the Argyle place design - suggest this carries on all the way round the corner (which is of course blocked off to cars - i.e. they cant turn right at the top of Argyle?), up past Earl of Marchmont/Laidback Bikes which, while allowing cars to park is much quieter as its a no thru road - onto Marchmont Road and onward to Kings Buildings - now that would be a decent stab at a QBC.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  10. ExcitableBoy
    Member

    I would not be surprised at shop owners objecting, but surely they would benefit hugely. I don't suppose many people go out of their way to drive that way, but with such a cycle route, cyclist numbers would increase greatly?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  11. chdot
    Admin

    "I would not be surprised at shop owners objecting, but surely they would benefit hugely"

    I was actually think for delivery reasons rather than customers - there is increasing evidence that bikes are good for local shops.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  12. Nelly
    Member

    It does have through traffic - but a line of bollards between the Argyle pub and the Flower shop would soon sort that out !!

    Seriously though, if you drove from corstorphine or wherever to Eddies for your fish, you cant park (except double parking) outside anyway, so pretty much no change there.

    Cant see a downside, well, unless you call a water cannon installation up above the Argyle pub - thats to deal with the speeding traffic / double parkers.

    I am happy to man it evenings and weekends?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  13. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Of course the shops would object...

    Yes, where would they double park all those delivery vans! They leave no space for parking customers anyway so I'm sure it wouldn't impact their business. The cars parked outside there are generally owned by the greengrocers who seem to go through "I picked this one up for a bargain" kind of old cars and wile away the hours tinkering with the stereos.

    I half thought about putting the bike lane on the other side of the road as it doesn't have the shops, but it meant a messy junction at the bottom to connect with MMW. Trees I'm not so sure about as they need those cast-iron cages around them to protect them. Then they grow up big and crack the roadway and drop leafmush all over it...

    Posted 8 years ago #
  14. ExcitableBoy
    Member

    @K you're probably right about the trees, but they're so pretty.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  15. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Plastic treebollards? Or maybe a nice privet hedge :)

    Posted 8 years ago #
  16. Nelly - you missed the new 'rumble strips' across the off-road bike lane, with a short section of bloody 'raised kerb' between each side which is invisible to the eye until you hit it.

    Absolute genius - make the offroad path more dangerous than the road. Someone in the planning dept needs a medal for that one.

    Oh, and we need rising bollards at the 'No entry' junction that leads up to Hermiston Gait / Ed Park Station. Totally ignored for years by motorists who need some kind of instant punishment for breaking the law!

    Posted 8 years ago #
  17. chdot
    Admin

    "need some kind of instant punishment for breaking the law!"

    You mean like this -

    [+] Embed the video | Video DownloadGet the Video Widget

    Posted 8 years ago #
  18. crowriver
    Member

    That video gave me a good laugh. That'll teach 'em!

    Posted 8 years ago #
  19. PS
    Member

    Fake Plastic Trees.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  20. kaputnik
    Moderator

    it would seem that kerbed-off cycle lanes don't always work.... This is why we need ENFORCEMENT!

    Posted 8 years ago #
  21. Kim
    Member

    Something missing? How about some cycle parking?

    Posted 8 years ago #
  22. ExcitableBoy
    Member

    "it would seem that kerbed-off cycle lanes don't always work.... This is why we need ENFORCEMENT! "

    That is quite some photo, typical to the extreme - if you know what I mean. My immediate reaction to that would be to get a hand or two and push it over. I sometimes wish I wasn't so law abiding and such a coward.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  23. gembo
    Member

    Rotting fruit and veg vans could double park on other side next to sick kid staff abusing their parking medic on call stickers

    Posted 8 years ago #
  24. Nelly
    Member

    Ooooh, gembo - controversial (but true).

    If you cycle/walk down Chalmers Crescent in the morning, there are a hefty bunch of 'essential users' - usually parked on the left side after Palmerston Road.

    Although how essential is anyones guess, given that they are usually in the same spot late PM.

    Of course the wardens dont care at this flagrant abuse of the system, they are too busy hanging around the German Church to ticket parents picking their kiddies up from Stepping Stones Nursery.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  25. gembo
    Member

    Yes nelly I felt a bit iffy about typing that but I have colleagues who have admitted to doing this.

    Posted 8 years ago #
  26. SRD
    Moderator

    It's a bit like the blue badged cars that block my view of oncoming traffic on Polwarth gardens every morning. They are right outside a GP's clinic and down the street from dentists, sheltered housing etc, but the fact that they are there EVERY day makes me a bit cynical about it.

    Posted 8 years ago #

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