CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure

This is a joke right?

(30 posts)

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  1. chdot
    Admin

    It's 2012.

    This is world class cycle friendly Edinburgh.

    It's not possible that CEC can be employing people who would imagine such infrastructure(?)

    There can't be a budget that would pay for this to be made and installed(?)

    Today I went to Edinburgh Park to see how things were. Tram works not finished (obviously) - not at all clear how the cycle related infrastructure will look around the tram stop when it is finished.

    There are actually buses on the road outside EP station and also all sorts of vehicles going both ways. Don't know how long that's been the case.

    It's still far from clear what this sign is for - previously this was a proper shared path (check Google).

    Of course it might be possible that this is a friendly notice meaning 'if you plan to go east why not cross the road and join the path on the other side?'

    But what if you're planning to go south in Bankhead Drive?

    Oh, and if you're coming the other way does this really mean "and bicycles"??

    Posted 12 years ago #

  2. kaputnik
    Moderator

    I mean who would want to cycle to one of the largest areas of employment in Edinburgh?! Our buildings probably have 5,000 people alone in them. 10% of that is?...

    It's truly a complete mess round here. Someone has done a prize job in designing pedestrians and cyclists OUT.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  3. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Oh, your photos 60-62 on Everytrail. I noticed last few days that the pointless loop to nowhere had been fenced off. On Monday it had a flatbed lorry parked in it dropping off precast concrete pipe sections.

    It looks like they're building on it now, or at least very close to it. I assume that means I'm officially expected to dismount at this section and walk around the obstruction?

    Posted 12 years ago #

  4. chdot
    Admin

    "I assume that means I'm officially expected to dismount at this section and walk around the obstruction?"

    Probably!

    60, 61, 62

    Posted 12 years ago #

  5. Nelly
    Member

    This is the spot Gembo had his run in with the law a month or so back.

    Its a treat turning up every day to see what new tricks they have dropped into 'the game' of Negotiate Edinburgh Park. This week has seen many contractors parking on the verge opposite the 5aside football - reducing sightlines even more.

    Dont think all the crap on the path is doing much for my drivetrain/tyres either.

    Once they complete the station work, the path will be much better - still wont help if you need to turn right up bankhead, mind you!

    Posted 12 years ago #

  6. Arellcat
    Moderator

    I had much the same thoughts as chdot when I had a poke around Sighthill post-gembo:

    And, even better, when I last visited not long ago that pedestrian crossing itself was blocked with crowd barriers. Only the dropped kerb areas were blocked, which made a mockery of the off-road cycle lane approach that was blocked before you got to EDP.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  7. Uberuce
    Member

    It's the civil engineering equivalent of a chauvinist throwback husband on the 23rd of December trying to find a present for the wife. "Urmm...what is it they like doing again...?"

    Posted 12 years ago #

  8. Nelly
    Member

    Arellcat - it is not actually possible to access EP from the east on the bike path without flouting the 'Local Buses Only' sign.

    While the crowd barrier you refer to is away, the one at the far end is blocked, which means you HAVE to go onto a bit of road marked as above - bonkers.

    I now have an almost Pavlovian response to these advisory bike signage - they rarely enter into my consciousness.

    Dont imagine I am the only one.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  9. friskiffla
    Member

    My journey home takes me past EP station and up Cultins Rd - I've been doing it for quite a while now but I still don't know what I'm supposed to do to remain the good law-abiding citizen that I am. I recently contacted the council about it, and then a few things happened that seemed positive (although I have my doubts that these two events were connected). It used to annoy me every day but now I think I am just in a state of resigned acceptance.

    Btw I'm new on here so 'hi'.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  10. chdot
    Admin

    Welcome

    "but I still don't know what I'm supposed to do to remain the good law-abiding citizen that I am"

    The fact that you are able to write that shows there is a problem!

    Posted 12 years ago #

  11. Morningsider
    Member

    Okay - I might have found a way round all this nonsense. Looking at the CEC core paths plan, it seems Cultins Road and Bankhead Drive are designated as part of a core path (CEC13 - Sighthill to Carrick Knowe):

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/file/3007/core_path_plan_map

    Section 7(1) of the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 specifically prevents any other enactment from preventing the exercise of responsible access rights by pedestrians and cyclists over a core path. This means it should be legally possible to cycle along the "bus only" section. Now, someone who actually uses this route and wants to confirm this could contact the Council's access officer:

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/495/parks_gardens_and_open_spaces/1251/accessing_our_parks_and_greenspaces/3

    Posted 12 years ago #

  12. Uberuce
    Member

    Does that mean the chaps doing the works in photos 60-62 on chdot are all criminals?

    Posted 12 years ago #

  13. chdot
    Admin

    "I might have found a way round all this nonsense"

    That might make a sound defence in the event of any legal problems.

    Might even indicate that the 'dismount' signs have no authority at all.

    Unfortunately doesn't deal with the CEC mindset that made it the way it is!

    Posted 12 years ago #

  14. SRD
    Moderator

    "Unfortunately doesn't deal with the CEC mindset that made it the way it is!"

    yes, this is what worries me. the total lack of joined-upness - like that bizarre narrow 'shared' footpath on Upper Grover Place. It is so incoherent/impossible as to be nearly credible.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  15. Johnny J
    Member

    Hi folks, first post on here! I regularly cycle to and from Hermiston Gait and it is truly crazy. Took the kids out there last Saturday, they like going along the cycle path from Stenhouse. All fine till we got to HG, then the lovely new smooth path is blocked by a fence and I had to take the kids on the road, which luckily was quiet at the time.

    As someone already mentioned, it seems to be a different challenge each time, as new bollard and fencing configurations appear every couple of days!

    Posted 12 years ago #

  16. chdot
    Admin

    Welcome Johnny J

    I don't go that often, but there have always been questionable, ill considered and even bizarre -

    This seems to just go to a tram stop.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  17. Johnny J
    Member

    Hi, been looking round the forums, some interesting and useful stuff here.

    Yes, good picture that, just round the corner from my house. Strange thing is, there's a similar path going to the other end of the tram stop which is pedestrian only. I presume that path is exclusively for the staff at Saughton House!

    Posted 12 years ago #

  18. chdot
    Admin

    Yeah, that's why I thought the path that was dual use was strange -

    Posted 12 years ago #

  19. steveo
    Member

    I was wondering about that, are the trams going to take cycles or is it going to be a great cycle and tram stop for the 10 minute cycle to town.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  20. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Hi JohnnyJ and friskiffla - amazing how a bit of crap cycle path gets everyone talking!

    Posted 12 years ago #

  21. RJ
    Member

    <quote = kaputnik> It's truly a complete mess round here. Someone has done a prize job in designing pedestrians and cyclists OUT. </quote>

    My impression, gained over the last 18 months, is that that was probably always true of Edinburgh Park. The galling thing is that there's no sign of "planning gain" improvement coming on the back of the tram line, while the works themselves are hideous in their lack of consideration for pedestrians and cyclists (there's currently no footpath leading in a useful direction from the nearest bus-stop to my workplace, should I choose to take the bus: "footpath closed", with no alternative provision)

    Posted 12 years ago #

  22. kaputnik
    Moderator

    South Gyle / Edinburgh park probably one of the biggest areas of employment in Edinburgh, must be at least 10-15,000 workers there. Lots of room. Lots of undeveloped land. Lots of keen people who would rather not drive or take the bus. You really have to scratch your head and wonder why the management companies cannot be forced to improve things.

    You've only got to look at the number of pedestrian crossings (or complete lack of) within the place to see what complete disregard the planners have for the safety of people not in cars.

    There's been at least 1 pedestrian death (right outside our office) and 2 or 3 bad cases of cyclists getting knocked down within last 18 months. And yet there's not even a single pedestrian crossing on South Gyle Crescent, it's nose-to-tail parking and burger vans and there's a constant stream of fast moving courier vans and HGVs.

    0/10

    Posted 12 years ago #

  23. RJ
    Member

    Truly shyte (c) G Chaucer. Forsooth.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  24. chdot
    Admin

    "I will get a response to your query and get back in touch with you."

    Councillor

    "I'm getting this checked out"

    Official

    Might at least get some 'answers' - and maybe some action(?)

    Posted 12 years ago #

  25. chdot
    Admin

    Signs latest -

    Posted 12 years ago #

  26. DaveC
    Member

    Got any T cut?

    What did they used to miss-say?

    Posted 12 years ago #

  27. chdot
    Admin

    Don't think it is "used".

    Think these are new and unrevealed.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  28. Roibeard
    Member

    Looks blue underneath, so not a "no cycling" sign.

    Conceivably it could be a "route for cyclists only", or a shared use pavement, with a "cyclists dismount" below it...

    Or possibly even the mythical mandatory cycle lane with hours of operation!

    Robert

    Posted 12 years ago #

  29. Uberuce
    Member

    It's the shared use symbol.

    The middle sign(furthest back of the three) has an End of Cycle Route dismount sign on the back, so presumably it's still shared use continuing from the section of Cultins Road pavement.

    A few minutes before chdot took this picture, I had a civilised chat with a lady who argued the section from Edinburgh Park to where these signs are isn't shared use.

    She may or may not be right; there's a dismount sign as you turn left coming up from the mouldy underpass, but if you come from the Broomouse path, there's shared use signs with no dismount.

    In both instances, the direction you come from reverses the best guess you'd be able to make.

    To be safe, you could dismount, but the path is already too narrow for shared use, let alone someone pushing anything but a skinny bike.

    Posted 12 years ago #

  30. chdot
    Admin

    "She may or may not be right"

    Which of course is part of the problem - poor infrastructure badly signed.

    Not much chance of a world class cycle/pedestrian city.

    Posted 12 years ago #

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