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"Great Ideas and Initiatives for the Borders Railway"

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  1. Tulyar
    Member

    The law of unintended consequences showed the folly of considering separate infrastructure projects as separate entities with the rather spectacular demolition of a bus by a train at Pooley Green LC near Staines. Fortunately the bus driver had the sense to evacuate the bus when the error of pulling on to the crossing in the queuing traffic with no space to continue before the train arrived.

    The queueing traffic was a result of the opening of the M25 having an impact on local roads, with said M25 delivering a long bridge (more like a tunnel) over the railway barely 150 metres from the level crossing, a bridge which with a little forethought could have been extended by around 8 metres to enable the elimination of the level crossing, by routeing the road over the railway.

    Hence a strong case to press for inclusion of a cycle route but sadly I fear that by the time the contract is signed Network Rail's clear policy on not allowing any changes to the agreed works will scupper any 11th hour action (this is how they manage to deliver projects like Airdrie-Bathgate, Paisley Canal and Alloa-Stirling within schedule and budget - making absolutely no comment about the Edinburgh tram at this point). Worth looking though to see how generous the maintenance/widening allowances are in that structure, in case there are ways to consider retrofitting a path alongside the tracks.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  2. chdot
    Admin

    "
    The latest analysis of the business case for the £300 million project to reopen the Waverley route from Edinburgh to Tweedbank, near Galashiels, calculated the rail link will boost tourism and cut road accidents due to fewer car journeys.

    "

    http://m.scotsman.com/edinburgh-evening-news/transport/borders-rail-link-could-cut-530-000-road-trips-1-2820819

    Posted 11 years ago #
  3. chdot
    Admin

  4. Rabid Hamster
    Member

    @chdot me matey, Trying desperately to find the planning submission for 'Sheriffhall Tunnel', to no avail on SBC or Midlothian planning websites. Need a construction plan/drawing to discover whether a parallel cycle path through tunnel has been thoughtfully included, to save cyclists negotiating the baro-trauma of Sheriffhall boundarout! Can u help (link)?

    Posted 11 years ago #
  5. chdot
    Admin

    "Trying desperately to find the planning submission for 'Sheriffhall Tunnel', to no avail"

    Must say I had assumed it was 'all sorted in Parliament' - like the tram.

    If not, there's incremental hope - though more cycle access through the bypass would probably be a stepchange.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  6. Arellcat
    Moderator

    "ONE of Scotland's biggest transport projects is no longer economically viable due to the failure of a local property boom and steep drop in projected passenger numbers…"

    "Ernst & Young has warned that the proposed £350 million Borders Railway scheme is unlikely to provide a return on investment. Plans to build hundreds of houses along the route have been scrapped and so the passenger demand has fallen considerably."

    http://www.ciltuk.org.uk/ExploreCILT/News/LatestNews/tabid/235/ctl/NewsItem/mid/589/Id/1220/Default.aspx

    http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/transport/warning-350m-rail-link-not-economically-viable.20368527

    Posted 11 years ago #
  7. crowriver
    Member

    Right. So I suppose the £1 billion/£2 billion white elephant Forth Resilience Crossing is economically viable and will provide a return on investment? Or will it just keep costing, year after year, on maintenance?

    Other rail line openings have proved that business plans consistently underestimate demand for new rail services. No doubt the Borders railway will be the same...

    Posted 11 years ago #
  8. Rabid Hamster
    Member

    There's a wadge of plannings apps been streaming in from BAM to Borders Cooncil to rebuild bridges, culverts etc. but Midlothian Ancient Cooncil sh!tey website has nothing on it for Borders Railway works except a notice about shutting cycleways (which sadly use old railway bed!).
    Mibbe I should interrogate BAM/NetworkRail?
    Beeching would be turning in his grave if he read Ernst & Young reports!

    Posted 11 years ago #
  9. chdot
    Admin

    Notes from a conversation -

    '
    plans for the railway were approved as part of the Parliamentary process

    only any changes from those plans that need planning permission eg some changes to station parking and access.

    probably too late to get any changes to the tunnel/overbridge for the railway, without causing extra delay and cost for the rail project.

    some think you couldn't have cyclists sharing a tunnel with trains because the noise and wind from trains going past would be bad for cycling.

    it's been difficult for the rail project to sort out the problems for cyclists it is causing by re-using the railway paths, so it would be even harder to get it to tackle problems like making a new route for cyclists past the bypass.

    Transport Scotland needs pressured to see the works on the bypass as an opportunity to put in a separate underpass for cyclists and pedestrians.

    When the railway is being built, the bypass is to be temporarily diverted and within the temporarily closed section it might be possible to build a separate underpass without affecting the rail project much

    the reason the tunnel is so long is because Transport Scotland asked for space for slip roads for a potential grade separation/flyover for Sheriffhall roundabout

    so spending extra to allow for possible future changes to the road - maybe they could find (a lot less) money to put in a separate cycle/ped. underpass

    grade separation plan (if it ever happens) might have cycle/ped. facilities.

    one of the 6 roads (the A6106 north) is to be shut, so there should be extra capacity available

    maybe under the Disability Discrimination Act there should be ped facilities(?)

    '

    Posted 11 years ago #
  10. Tulyar
    Member

    @arellcat I would look more to the developers who have been buying land (as they did along the Airdrie to Bathgate route as soon as there was a strong whiff of the line definitely reopening), and cleaning up (with a healthy profit) on sites like that on the old paper mill site at Caldercruix, the site alongside Armadale Station etc. Forget the pasty pen pushers punching theoretical numbers into calculating engines, and look outside the window and see what the guys on the sharp end are thinking.

    Now had we had a canny Council which made sure that they bought the land when it was at a rock bottom value, perhaps through the common good fund as an investment of the money, and then structured the development/disposal of the land to share the gains with a developer, we might then get the model of building a railway and paying for it from the enhanced value of the adjoining land. Remember that running trains - especially passenger trains rarely makes money, and famously the lift in values for land 1Km either side of the Jubilee Line extension would have paid the cost of building it more than twice. http://www.labourland.org/downloads/papers/jle-main-report.pdf

    Suggested reading matter - several C19th economists, Most notably Henry George who debated the equitable use of land through recognising its value by appropriate means http://www.henrygeorgefoundation.org/

    All very much, I suspect in the ethos of a number of figures in Edinburgh's Cycling community.

    But to the task of securing a crossing point, the 11th hour action on the rail accommodation works is a very long shot BUT delivery of enabling works in the process, on adjacent land may be possible. this might be in providing foundations/curtain walls, and approach earthworks in the formation cleared alongside the site of the rail 'tunnel' beneath the road, and I'd hope that in securing the future possibility of growth that Transport Scotland will follow the clear policy of a hard nosed commercial company which built the direct railway from Aviemore to Inverness - a single track main line which given the number of trains planned for has a capacity with passing loops equivalent to a 2 track route at a fraction of the cost to build and maintain BUT with every viaduct built as a 2-track structure, from the start.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  11. chdot
    Admin

    "and then structured the development/disposal of the land to share the gains with a developer, we might then get the model of building a railway and paying for it from the enhanced value of the adjoining land"

    That was what George Hazel was trying to do for the South Sub with E-Rail.

    Still seems to have an interest in the idea.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  12. chdot
    Admin

    "
    The Council has submitted a proposal to build the brand new state-of-the-art facility at Shawfair.

    The centre would provide high quality sports facilities for athletes, with the Scottish Government committing up to £25 million of funding towards the project.

    The proposed site benefits from being close to some of Scotland's premier sporting facilities such as the Commonwealth Pool in Edinburgh.

    "

    http://www.midlothian.gov.uk/press/article/892/midlothian_submits_first_stage_bid_for_national_sports_centre

    Sounds like an alternative to the rundown Meadowbank Stadium.

    Wonder if CEC knows about this, or if MidL knows about the idea of the cheapskate velodrome at the Jack Kane.

    At least MidL is thinking of developing some derelict land (Monktonhall Colliery) next to a new railway station. Close to Queen Margaret University (but that's in East Lothian).

    Don't suppose there is much chance of councils co-operating to produce some real top class East of Scotland sporting/leisure facilities.

    Hillend Ski Slope + potential for some serious Mountain Biking in the area too.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  13. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Same Midlothian Council who couldn't scrape together a few hundred thousand quid for the ski centre a few years back, or a different Midlothian?

    Posted 11 years ago #
  14. chdot
    Admin

    "Same Midlothian Council"

    Possibly not - in the sense that there will be some different councillors 'in charge' since last year's election.

    Hillend was created by a previous Edinburgh council.

    "
    Lagganlia Centre was opened by the Duke of Edinburgh on 30th June 1970. The land/original buildings were gifted to the citizens of Edinburgh by the philanthropist George Boyd Anderson as part of his vision to give the young people of the Edinburghl a chance to ski. A vision which included the building of Hillend Dry Ski Slope on the outskirts of Edinburgh (then the longest dry ski slope in Europe).

    "

    http://www.lagganlia.com/pages/Main/aboutUs.html

    Since then we had Lothian Regional Council which built a lot of cyclepaths and took a strategic view of things like transport and education.

    Lagganlia is still owned by CEC - but users are not subsidised as they once were.

    For many Edinburgh children it is their first 'proper' experience of 'country' and mountain biking.

    So now we have two adjacent councils with plans for new sporting facilities a mile apart.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  15. chdot
    Admin

    This is almost a response to the Ernst & Young report - but was published in the Sunday Herald on 24.02.13 - can't find online.

    Extract from below

    "In a paper last December, Flyvbjerg crit-
    icised "garbage" cost-benefit forecasts as
    damaging to public trust
    "

    Business focus

    On the right track... will the Borders Railway be worth it?

    AS WE AWAIT THE FINAL BUSINESS CASE FOR THE LATEST MAJOR CAPITAL PROJECT, COLIN DONALD ASKS HOW MUCH WE CAN TRUST THE FIGURES

    IN the ideal world envisaged
    by Professor Bent Flyvbjerg of
    Oxford Business School, next
    week's promised publication of
    the final business case for the
    Borders Railway would launch a
    public debate on the £350 million
    scheme's balance of benefits to Scotland.
    In this scenario, which exists in Flyvb-
    jerg's native Denmark, ministers and
    officials would be standing by to defend
    their claims in open public debate, while
    civil servants staked their careers on
    ensuring the claimed benefits were deliv-
    ered, and for a price in line with similar
    projects the world over.
    Such assumptions and transparency,
    and cost appraisal, have not so far been
    the Scottish way. Just look at our cata-
    logue of mis-sold and over-priced capital
    projects, from the Scottish Parliament to
    the Edinburgh Trams to the M74 and the
    new Forth Crossing, the last two among
    the most expensive structures of their type
    in the world.
    In a paper last December, Flyvbjerg crit-
    icised "garbage" cost-benefit forecasts as
    damaging to public trust, just as the bank-
    ing and food scandals have been. "Merely
    firing the forecaster may be letting them
    off too easily," he wrote. "Some forecasts
    are so grossly misrepresented and have
    such dire consequences that we need to
    consider suing them for the losses incurred
    as a result. In a few cases where forecasters
    foreseeably produce deceptive forecasts,
    criminal penalties may be warranted."
    The Borders Railway is a prime candi-
    date for the up-front appraisal Flyvbjerg
    advocates. Intended to "ensure that for the
    first time in over 40 years, people living in
    the Scottish Borders and Midlothian can
    benefit from a direct rail link to the capital
    city and the wider Scottish rail network",
    the project has both strong local support
    and strong opposition.
    Originally due to open in 2008 for £155m,
    the Borders project has been shunned by
    investors since it was first mooted 20 years
    ago. Plans for a Not for Profit Distribution
    (NPD) model failed as prospective inter-
    national bidders melted away, causing
    ministers to turn to Network Rail, which
    last November engaged BAM Nuttall as
    construction partner Advance work is
    already under way.
    Having slipped a revised reopening
    date of 2011, the rebuilt 35-mile train line
    between Edinburgh and Tweedbank, south
    of Galashiels, now has a start-up date m
    2015. with the all-in headline capital cost
    at £350m, at 2012 prices. Like the dramatic
    increase in the price of the new Forth
    Crossing during its long gestation, such
    rampant price inflation supports Flyvb-
    jerg's case for a rethink in Scotland.
    Not that increased cost is in itself an
    argument against the Borders Railway.
    New rail is nearly always good news.
    Projects like the Airdrie-Bathgate and the
    Stirling-Alloa-Kincardine lines are among
    the most tangible successes of devolved
    Scottish government.
    More in question is the competence,
    transparency and accountability with
    which calculations of economic benefit
    are made. In other words: can Scottish offi-
    cials make a credible case for spending this
    amount of money at this time?
    According to former Borders councillor
    Nick Watson, who launched a local politi-
    cal party to oppose the scheme "Unless
    questions about cost and benefit can be
    clearly answered there is no way such a
    giant project should be advanced, particu-
    larly in times as hard as these."
    Some Borderers agree, seeing the line as
    badly-sited, potentially damaging to the
    environment, lethal to existing bus serv-
    ices, and too slow and infrequent to garner
    the estimated 647.000 annual return ticket
    users A now housing boom along the route
    is even less probable now than at the time
    of the project's conception. Opponents
    have suggested building the line as far as
    the Midlothian village of Newtongrange.
    and assessing demand before proceeding
    to rebuild the rural line
    Peter Smaill. a local venture capitalist
    with experience of the rail industry, claims
    "no reasoned debate has been possible due
    to the emotional power of rail projects
    and the refusal of Transport Scotland to
    respond fully and openly to information
    requests".
    In contrast, Graham Bell, chairman of
    the Federation of Small Businesses in the
    Borders, argues that the case has been
    made, and that the railway would reveal
    the appeal of the area's excellent tourist
    environment, schools and quality of life
    "Too much emphasis is placed on initial
    cost as the only measure of value. Rail
    ways in the UK have always struggled to
    repay their capital investment. Their true
    value has always been as tools of economic
    development and cultural change"
    But Bell concedes that the line ""really
    only makes sense when the route is fully
    restored to Carlisle - reinstating Edin
    burgh's main route south to the west coast
    mainline and beyond"
    TRANSPORT Scot
    land can explain the
    budget increases,
    saving that "the scope
    of the scheme has been
    enhanced to accommo
    date important economic
    • the original propos
    idditional cost for
    future-proofing the track for possible
    electrification, extending platforms to
    accommodate longer trains, "passive
    provision (dual track in places) to allow
    for four trains per hour for Midlothian
    sta ions should demand exceed forecast
    and improved station and park-and-ride
    facilities to improve connections with
    other transport modes."
    Similar to the final business case
    clouds of official-speak have obscured the
    project's risk profile, though the Sunday
    Herald has identified three major "known
    unknowns" that could burst the current
    plans (see panel).
    Transport Scotland has stressed that
    the budget includes a contingency fund
    for things going wrong, or "risk pot"
    as the agency's head of major projects
    Ainslie McLaughlin described it to the
    Scottish Parliament in December.
    Asked, understandably, "What happens
    if we go over budget?". McLaughlin
    responded that the contract "includes I
    provision for risks given the continued j
    uncertainties due to mine and earth- :
    works along the route".
    "There are a lot of old structures and
    there has been quite a lot of investigation
    Into what state they are in but, until the
    construction goes ahead, the entire extent
    of the work required will not he known

    [emphasis added]."
    Transport Scotland has since declined
    to quantify this emergency kitty, but as
    the Scottish Parliament building and
    Edinburgh Tram budgets Included "risk

    pots", the existence of a fund is not in
    itself much comfort.
    Transport Scotland's revised busi-
    ness case must therefore show that the
    project is not, as previous versions were,
    dependent on heroic predictions of house-
    building along the line. Instead, it will
    emphasise issues of "accessibility, social
    inclusion and regional equity".
    Although Transport Scotland will make
    "redactions" for commercial reasons, the
    document is expected to show the work-
    ings behind its passenger estimates,
    assumptions of £33m of economic bene-
    fits and insistence on the line's eventual
    profitability.
    These will be studied closely by econo-
    mist Tony Mackay. former lecturer in
    econometrics and mathematical econom-
    ics at Aberdeen University, one of very few
    people in Scotland who understands the
    "agglomeration productivity aggregate
    response calculator" (APARC) on which
    Transport Scotland rests its business case.
    He has not been impressed so far.
    "A few years ago I undertook a review of
    |thc Borders Railway project |. concluding
    it would not be economically viable and
    would be a poor use of public funds. Noth-
    iin: lias happened since then to change
    my mind In fact, the project's economics
    have almost certainly got worse.
    "Public funds are very limited They
    should be trying to make the best use
    of their funds but the evidence suggests
    they are not."
    Mackay agrees the railway would benefit
    the Borders, just not enough to merit the
    expenditure of £350m. "I am very surprised
    that Transport Scotland thinks this is a
    viable project. It looks increasingly like the
    next fiasco after the Edinburgh Trams."
    Mackay has broken a taboo of Scottish
    public life, by suggesting - given the sums
    and the opportunity costs involved - that
    well-paid and pensioned civil servants
    advising ministers on spending priorities,
    should have their "ownership" of crucial
    decisions clearly identified.
    Such removal of the frosted glass behind
    which our small country's distant and
    unaccountable cadre of civil servants
    racks up costs seems worth a try. given
    the urgency of ending chronic wasteful
    spending.
    "I was surprised to read on the Transport
    Scotland website that the new director of
    rail. Aidan Grisewood. is an economist
    who previously worked for the Scottish
    Government and the Royal Bank of Scot-
    land." Mackay wrote in a recent report. "Mr
    Grisewood should therefore surely know
    that the economic case for the Borders
    Railway is very weak "
    Grisewood. one of the Scottish Govern-
    ment's high-flying generalists. is unlikely
    to remain accountable for the project
    he has promoted. He declined to answer
    Mackay's points, and declined to be
    interviewed for this article.
    Like Flyvbjerg, former auditor
    general Dr Robert Black wants a more
    rigorous approach to control costs in an
    era of unprecedented pressure on public
    spending. In a paper for the David Hume
    Institute last year, Black proposed a
    technocratic "Scottish Commission on
    Resources and Performance" to test
    the claims of projects like the Borders
    Railway, and assess their outcomes.
    The need for this body. Black
    suggested. was to cure bad habits
    acquired in Scotland's years of plenty
    [when] there was more emphasis on
    the priorities for spending new money
    rather than robust, systematic scrutiny
    of spending and performance".
    Borders Rail could be a test case for
    operating in the new reality Black
    described. Finance Secretary John
    Swinney has dismissed Black's commis-
    sion proposal, but as a body of that sort
    would be vital to the fiscal credibility of
    an independent Scotland, it might make
    sense to be seen getting some practice.
    Increasing bureaucratic accountabil-
    ity has been credited with improving
    the procurement of public projects in
    more reform-minded countries, Denmark
    included. But - as a leaf through recent
    reports of Audit Scotland reveals - respon-
    sibility is no less opaque in straitened
    Scotland than in the lotus-eating years
    Conceived in a boom, the Borders
    Rail may be the first mega project to
    be entirely delivered in an era where
    it is not simply sufficient to invoke the
    so-called Mastermind clause - "We've
    started so we'll finish" - to keen a
    potentially runaway train on track.

    What could go wrong?

    Farebox risk: Income from the Borders Rail-
    way could be less than expected, requiring
    bigger-than-expected subsidies. Scottish
    ministers and the prospective franchisee will
    share this risk. They predict the line to be
    profitable only "on average" over 10 years.
    Transport Scotland has so far declined to
    quantify expectations ot farebox shortfall, but
    may do so in the business case. Passenger
    growth in UK rail projects often exceeds
    expectations.

    Construction risk: Despite spending £54m
    on land purchases and £10m on pre-construc-
    tion Investigations, this risk remains Some
    uncertainty is priced in already but compulsory
    purchase problems, utilities, former mine work-
    ings and old bridges give no solid basis for
    confidence that the (unquantified) contingency
    fund will cover "unknown unknowns".

    Franchise risk: A franchising round looks
    al historic costs, current fares, known assets,
    future investments and profit on known
    services. The Borders Railway has none
    of these. Operating costs include the serv-
    ice itself, taken over by Ihe franchisee, and
    separately the signalling and operational
    cost, including maintenance of the stations
    and track. Expectations of initial losses there
    will be a deficit, so how will this III with the
    existing franchise agreement, especially as
    it will come half-way through the term of the
    existing let?

    Posted 11 years ago #
  16. chdot
    Admin

    Just realised that the Midlothian/Shawfair site 'ought' to be in Edinburgh.

    It should be natural that this chunk inside the bypass should now be part of the City.


    bite out of Edinburgh

    Presumably someone didn't want the industrial bits as part of the Capital!
    .
    Midlothian boundary map

    Posted 11 years ago #
  17. chdot
    Admin

  18. chdot
    Admin

    "Where the new Borders Railway will pass under the A720 City Bypass at Sheriffhall" - Photo.

    More photos.

    From http://www.sesplan.gov.uk/assets/files/docs/proposed-plan/Proposed%20Plan.pdf

    "
    From June, work will begin on building a tunnel beneath the Edinburgh City Bypass, close to one of the busiest roundabouts in the country, at Sheriffhall.It is expected that up to 50,000 motorists will be diverted along a two-lane carriageway during the works, which are due to be completed by May 2014.

    But Simon Walton, head of the main rail supporters group, played down fears that commuting Borderers will suffer significant delays when travelling to the capital and beyond.

    "

    http://www.thesouthernreporter.co.uk/news/business/borders-railway-tunnel-plans-unveiled-1-2790741

    http://archive.scottish.parliament.uk/business/committees/waverlyRB/reports/wrr05-01-vol07-03.htm

    Posted 11 years ago #
  19. chdot
    Admin

    "
    MIDLOTHIAN COUNCIL MEETING – TUESDAY 6 NOVEMBER 2012 QUESTIONS BY GREEN COUNCILLOR IAN BAXTER [also a Spokes member] ON COUNCIL CYCLING POLICY AND ON SHERIFFHALL ROUNDABOUT

    "

    http://www.spokes.org.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/1212-FOR-WEB-Qns-to-council-Cycle-routes-Sheriffhall.pdf

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/meetings/id/31487/report-south_east_edinburgh_transport-economic_potential_study

    (No mention of cycling of course)

    Posted 11 years ago #
  20. kaputnik
    Moderator

    "
    A double track section will be built within the 42-metre wide tunnel, which will be excavated beneath the A720 road, 200 metres east of Sheriffhall Roundabout.
    "
    (Southern Reporter link)

    42m wide tunnel? Wonder how big these trains are going to be that they need all 42m and there's no room for a 3m wide bike lane?

    Posted 11 years ago #
  21. chdot
    Admin

    Good point!

    Can't find a more detailed map of actual rail route in area.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  22. chdot
    Admin

    There are two underpasses further east. One a farm access road the other for the start of the A68 Dalkeith bypass.

    Both without any Edinburgh-Midlothian cycle connectivity.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  23. PS
    Member

    Doubt it'll be a tunnel. Surely it'll be cut and cover?

    Posted 11 years ago #
  24. chdot
    Admin

    "Surely it'll be cut and cover?"

    Yes, but when they re-instate the bypass it becomes a tunnel(?)

    Posted 11 years ago #
  25. kaputnik
    Moderator

    To the railway bods it will be a bridge!

    I assume it will be much like what they did for the trams at Gogar roundabout - build diversion, open diversion, dig under existing road, close diversion, dig under diversion, repeat ad nauseum. Athough at Gogar it took twice as long as the diversions used one half of the underpass at a time, rather than a custom-built section of dual carriageway to prevent TRAFFIC CHAOS.

    They should have put a level crossing in :)

    Posted 11 years ago #
  26. cb
    Member

    Amazingly, at Gogar, the traffic continued to flow (or rather, not flow) as well as it ever did.

    Don't know why they don't run a bus lane through the underpass.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  27. PS
    Member

    An "overbridge".

    Posted 11 years ago #
  28. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Underbridge, overbridge, Bordering free

    Posted 11 years ago #
  29. crowriver
    Member

    A mention for the Borders railway here, apparently the reporter "braved blizzards" to watch Network Rail building it!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21938349

    Posted 11 years ago #
  30. crowriver
    Member

    This unusual piece of kit being used in the Tynehead location is a 'climbing rig' which is used as a platform for drilling bore holes as part of the ground investigation works. The rig allows this work to be carried out safely on slopes without the time and expense of building platforms.

    http://www.bordersrailway.co.uk/news/image-works-at-tynehead.aspx

    Posted 11 years ago #

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