a bike."
http://blogs.channel4.com/gurublog/poacher-turn-gamekeeper-car-to-bike/3146
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Commuting
"I found cyclists rude, aggressive, selfish and self righteous Then I bought ...
(21 posts)-
Posted 11 years ago #
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I popped that into the PoP FB page last night. It's a telling, and I reckon would be a common, change of view. Still noting that, really, cyclists shouldn't run red lights or ride on pavements, but at the same time understanding why many do.
My other half didn't 'hate' cyclists, but would complain about them much more before she started cycling more and saw what you face on a daily basis on the bike. Any ardent cyclist-hating motorist put onto a bike for a couple of weeks will change their mind completely, I honestly believe that.
Posted 11 years ago # -
I watched a short thing that was made by Confused.com on their youtoobs last night. It was about one chap who drove to work and had agreed to cycle for a week.
Before he was "annoyed" at cyclists - and described why - but in reality it just seemed that he was pissed off at being stuck in traffic all the time, but was taking this out on pavement cyclists and red light jumpers etc.
Cycling of course proved faster etc... .oh and lots of near misses! But I think that's because he wasn't used to having to look so far forward.
Posted 11 years ago # -
Which given the relative (potential) speeds of cars and bikes is a little worrying. You're right though, folk driving often look simply at the next 'obstruction' in the road, hence so many passes just before a queue at red lights.
Posted 11 years ago # -
I remember a friend of mine taking a IAM course which was designed to teach him how to drive better or soemthing, but I think that he actually took because he wanted to reduce the cost of his insurance. One of the major things he took away from it was looking at the 10-20 cars in front and seeing whats happening on the road/street/motorway - not just being in his little microcosm.
He was telling me how amazing this was and how much better he was as a driver because of it - while I sat horrified thinking "PEOPLE DON'T AUTOMATICALLY DO THAT?!?"
I realised that as a cyclist I'm just so used to the road as a dynamic flowing environment rather than just the 10 metres around my bike. Bit of a shock that that is considered "Advanced driving"
Posted 11 years ago # -
I've got some marvelous school-run footage of a driver doing just that.
Their normal route would have been up a hill in their own lane, then halfway up, pull out into the oncoming lane to pass parked cars, before turning at the junction at the top.
Except on this day, the boys and I were heading down the hill. The driver continued to pull out to pass the parked cars and it was only when I shouted, that they raised their eyes from the end of the bonnet and stopped, rather sheepishly.
I'd seen the conflict building from the moment they approached the hill, but left them to see how long it would take for them to realise that we were in the gap they needed to use...
Much too long was the answer!
However, I think that cycling has improved my driving too - my use of mirrors and general observation has come on greatly. But then, I'm in the 5% of drivers that are of below average ability...
Robert
Posted 11 years ago # -
One of the major things he took away from it was looking at the 10-20 cars in front and seeing whats happening on the road/street/motorway - not just being in his little microcosm.
I did come a cropper from that type of driving once. Generally its a much more relaxed way to drive.
I was watching the traffic slowly flow from a few cars in front on Gorgie Road when a fire engine came down the bus lane out side Chesser House with full blues and twos, didn't seem to bother any one except the guy directly in front of me who performed an emergency stop and I drove through him. Little modern clio vs Old Sierra, I only stopped when I hit his rear tyre. Completely my fault but at the same time the guy in front completely over reacted.
Posted 11 years ago # -
Whilst the good side is that half the drivers, and cyclists, you meet will be above average, it naturally follows that half will be substandard (given that the average standard appears to be so low in traffic, for both groups!).
"Advanced" driving, or riding, is imho well worthwhile, even though at times the largest part of the task is to teach things which really should be core skills :-(
People don't automatically do things that often seem commonsense (to the more experienced) because in the case of cars they've only been taught the minimum required to pass a test and have not actually been taught how to drive particularly safely, in the case of bicycles, they have sometimes never had any tuition and had to learn by experience/accident.
Motorcycle training can often be a slight exception as much of the tuition is given by enthusiasts who make a serious effort to pass on good riding skills rather than just test techniques.One of the lessons often missed is that we all, whatever our level or experience, should be prepared to, indeed keen to take further instruction. As we gain experience and skills we may cherry pick items from a course/lesson, but there is almost always something of use! On passing a driving test my late father took me aside and said something along the lines of
"Well done, but remember, you have now reached the absolute minimum standard required to be allowed to continue learning to drive unsupervised, it doesn't make you a "driver" and it doesn't make you safe, you've got a lot to learn, go canny".
There really ought to be something along the lines on the test certificate!Posted 11 years ago # -
I had a couple of thoughts on the matter a whiel back, mostly buried in ramblings about fixies.
http://uberuce.wordpress.com/2012/11/29/you-dont-they-tell-you/
Posted 11 years ago # -
I guess the "looking ahead" thing explains why apparently almost all drivers block side streets when queuing. There is no way I can be an above average driver since I hardly ever do it but I find it extremely easy to not do this and yet people who almost certainly drive every day cannot.
???
Posted 11 years ago # -
"Well done, but remember, you have now reached the absolute minimum standard required to be allowed to continue learning to drive unsupervised, it doesn't make you a "driver" and it doesn't make you safe, you've got a lot to learn, go canny".
This is excellent - I genuinely think this SHOULD be something each instructor has to recite at the end - perhaps some sort of "I will do no harm" oath as well....
Posted 11 years ago # -
@ARobComp, thanks :-) he was a good man, and an excellent driver(!)
Posted 11 years ago # -
@Smudge - oddly enough I think this is drilled into other safety critical training...
I've seen this emphasised in diver training, and yet in most cases you're risking yourself by over-confidence/over-extending yourself. (And risking your buddy.)
In driver training you're more of a risk to others, be they passengers or random members of the public.
Yet again, it's a pity that H&S appears not to apply to the road!
Robert
Posted 11 years ago # -
I once hitched a lift with a guy who had been a chauffeur for the royal family. He drove so well that there was no sensation of accelerating, decelerating or cornering. It was a completely different level of driving.
Posted 11 years ago # -
The grandparents have developed/adopted an amazingly smooth driving style that - to everyone's great relief - means that neither of the kids gets travel sick when we visit them.
Posted 11 years ago # -
I remember watching a programme years back about chauffeurs who, when told to drive more quickly by their wealthy occupant, adopted techniques such as letting the clutch back up a little quickly, turning into a corner a smidge later than usual, dabbing the brakes before turns - all to make it seem like they were going more quickly.
Similarly I did a rally driving thing up at Knockhill once. For the fnial run the instructor took over, and what struck me, apart from the awesome speed that I'd come nowhere near to achieving, was just how smooth a run it was.
Posted 11 years ago # -
Good driving = never having to hit the brakes. A bit like good cycling really. ;o)
Posted 11 years ago # -
In my irascible moments I think drivers who get points should be banned until they've done twenty or thirty city commuting miles on a foot-retained fixie with a sensor on the brakes. If they use them going quicker than 5mph, then the mileage is reset.
Posted 11 years ago # -
I am constantly amazed at the number of drivers who overtake me when I am slowing down whilst approaching a red light just to have to brake...had they slowed down this would have been unnecessary in a great many instances, the lights changing to green seconds after they have ground to a halt. When learning to drive anticipation and looking to what was going on as far in front of you as possible was what my instructor insisted on. When I started going through the gears to slow down for cornering he asked me what I was doing, and informed me that should I wish to take the advanced driving test then I was doing the right thing but in order to get through the basic driving test braking before cornering would be fine, and that it was basic driving skills that were needed to get through the test, no more. And so many drivers criticise cyclists for not having formal training...
Posted 11 years ago # -
I filtered up the left hand side of stationary traffic at Chesser unction of A70 tonight. Guy behind me who I recognise from route went round the outside of the right hand lane (for those turning right). He then swung over in the ASL to be level with me. As the lights changed I let him go first. He then went under the bridge and all the way to the next set of lights in the left hand lane (for turning left up to craiglockhart except that he went straight on). I went under the bridge and cut into the right hand lane after the box junctn, as I could do. There was a car well behind me, but I in no way infringed on them. it is a bit of a stretch past domino pizza, ESP into the wind. However, we both made it through the green light, both in the correct lane. As the car overtook me he rolled down the window and shouted at me, Get out the way. I then overtook my route companion and then stopped at the longstone junction, he bumped up onto the pavement at the cross keys pub and cycled through the lights on the pavement and on up the pavement for approx 150 yards. But it was me that got shouted at.
Posted 11 years ago # -
I know we're not supposed to admit this but one of the reasons I like driving a Tranny is the better visibility. Hauling a caravan means you need to look further ahead too.
Posted 11 years ago #
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