CityCyclingEdinburgh was launched on the 27th of October 2009 as "an experiment".
IT’S TRUE!
CCE is 15years old!
Well done to ALL posters
It soon became useful and entertaining. There are regular posters, people who add useful info occasionally and plenty more who drop by to watch. That's fine. If you want to add news/comments it's easy to register and become a member.
RULES No personal insults. No swearing.
...because after an hours searching on the Stagecoach website, your unlikely to have found out how:
...much a standard return is.
...to get a travel pass.
...to.find your local routes.
Crikey, I thought the Scotrail website was bad, but at least you can get times and fares etc within minutes, and without having to drill down through layers and layers of menus which seem to take you no where, but to sample fares. I just want to know how much a standard return is, meh.
Stagecoach East Scotlands website is pretty hard to navigate. I've abandoned it and instead use google to search for direct links. Plus http://www.transportdirect.info/Web2/JourneyPlanning/JourneyPlannerInput.aspx?&repeatingloop=Y is a good public transport planner.
Josie gave up searching for the bus prices on their website and phoned them up in the end. They still chsrge more for me to travel from our house in Dalgety Bay on the number 7 bus to Dunfermline thann they charge me to travel to Edinburgh!!
They appear to have some sort of electronic pass on their busses but I have never been able to find anything other than Senior Citizens cards!
Their site really is too complex, they really need a more simple local website structure.
Every bus website sucks except Lothian Buses.
Traveline Scotland is reasonable for getting timetables (don't think it tells you the fares though). It's major advantage is that it lists all operators so can handle connections between modes.
It could still be a LOT simpler, particularly with regards to choosing your location of choice. And it's fugly.
Please read from the bottom up:
Stagecoach East Scot@StagecoachEScot
@davecrampton Hi Dave, please see here for ticketing information> http://ow.ly/hsHi2 You're comments will be passed to our web developers
David Crampton@DaveCrampton
@StagecoachEScot Online? Pls send a link as I have never been able to find any fare info on your site.
Stagecoach East Scot@StagecoachEScot
@davecrampton ... to buy online. Thanks for your feedback, this will be passed on for review.
Stagecoach East Scot@StagecoachEScot
@davecrampton ..on our bus routes we are unable to show all single & return fares but do offer a wide range of period tickets available...
Stagecoach East Scot@StagecoachEScot
@davecrampton Hi Dave. We appreciate you bringing this to our attention. Unfortunately due to the vast amount of journey options available..
Unfortunately due to the vast amount of journey options available.. ..on our bus routes we are unable to show all single & return fares
Nothing like a massive range of choice and pptions to obfuscate the actual cost of something (c.f. electricity/gas bills)
@Baldcyclist, point taken.
However navigating a web site, however chuff the design, then purchasing a ticket / hopping on a bus is a lot simpler than:
1. Applying for a provisional driving licence.
2. Learning how to drive.
3. Taking a driving test.
4. Applying for a full driving licence.
5. Purchasing a motor vehicle, including possibly HP/credit deals of labyrinthine complexity.
6. Arranging insurance.
7. Paying VED.
8. Buying fuel.
9. Keeping motor vehicle secure and maintained.
10. Navigating to travel destination.
11. Avoiding collisions with other motor vehicles, dealing with speed limits, etc.
12. Finding somewhere to park.
Given all that hassle, it's a wonder anyone drives at all!
Oh, I forgot. It's all about FREEDUM. Or something.
By that argument its a wonder people get out of bed...
Part of it is 'feeling valued'. In a car you are 'mainstream' (albeit a sluggish stream at peak times). Media is also directed towards you. Many travel reports just ignore train cancellations. I've never heard any bus news on the BBC. Buses are generally not used by business people (except in Edinburgh).
Of course cars 'out comfort' many other forms of transport - so much money has been used to improve interior comfort and ride quality that a 2012 vehicle is superior to one from twenty years ago (I'm not an owner but notice when I get a lift or a Skoda taxi in Perthshire).
Contrast with the noise levels on many trains and the inconvenience of changing trains which have poor luggage space.
I think though that the future for public transport is good as roads are bound to become busier and slower here. This is why high speed rail is maybe not required. All that matters surely is that you can get to places faster by public transport. Time on a comfortable train (or bus) can be used to work.
to be continued....
My boyfriend and I were just discussing a visit to my parents (near Newcastle upon Tyne) for a weekend soon.
A couple of minutes on the East Coast website and I find that the cheapest tickets left cost £68 return for the two of us.
We don't own a car, so b/f does some searching and tells me that the cheapest car is £52 plus petrol - so approaching £80 total.
Advantage of train - we can relax, use laptop, read, whatever. If we drive, someone has to give driving their full and undivided attention, and there are limits to what the other person can do.
Time - 2 hours in the car. 1h40ish on the train, plus some time to get to Waverley. It is the last 9 miles at the Newcastle end that is the problem - we can get the metro so far out but it is still 3 miles at the end, so someone has to come to get us in the car. (There's a bus that gets you closer, but it is infrequent and doesn't run late at night, so is no use if I'm going down after work for example.)
A lot of times the train wins for pleasantness of journey and cost. However this time we're talking about taking our road bikes, and if we do do that, then it will be in the car. (We have actually done it by train, but getting the bikes to my parents then involves someone coming into town to get at least one of us and the luggage - 9 miles with a rucksack of clothes on my back isn't my idea of fun...)
Having typed all this (in bits, while doing stuff) I have totally forgotten what my point was going to be, but seeing as I've typed it all you can read it, mwahahaha...
Google maps is quite good for public transport these days, on the routes I've tried anyway - search for a location, click the red balloon, select "directions", type in a start point, click the bus logo.
Fimm....
You could use a Carry Freedom trailer. (sales plug)
Hooks onto the rear drop out very easily. Lets you tow your wheelie suitcase.
The wheels on trailer click off with no tools required to make it a flat load to take in train.
It is the best way to keep a nice road bike un-encumbered by racks. Welcome to borrow LB's one to see if it would work for you. Other forumers have discovered that a trailer works. Only downside is self image of course. Bikes on top of a car are more normal.
I've considered a trailer for touring but never fancied the argument with the conductor that its just luggage.
@Laidback, I'd love a trailer (could the same trailer be towed by both a Brompton and a full sized bike?)
I also like the look of TheBikeChain's "amazing product" if it is what I think it is (boyfriend had a photo a while back of a friend of his using one).
but
1) boyfriend would object to trailer, I think
2) I don't have the money (well, maybe there are other things I want to/"need" to spend my money on)
3) storage (yes I know you just said the wheels come off)
I drive a fair mileage with my job and have to use the car if I have meetings (as opposed to cycling into the office when I don't). I could use public transport to get to town centres such as Glasgow/Aberdeen, but main reason I still drive is convenience. Car journey is much quicker than most trains I can use and often I'm visiting outlying areas which would rely on connections. Downside of course is I pay a huge amount of money to have a hunk of metal sitting on my driveway for 3/4 days of the week!
I think this thread was really aimed at the crap website Stagecoach operate. Very large (as they operate in a large number of areas, but not very helpful for the mobile user who wants to navigate quickly to journey and ticketing and pricing info. Compared to Scotrail its pants. On Scotrail you can (from the front page) click on Start and End points and it lists the next few trains and prices. You can't find this on Stagecoach unless you download a full timetable and they only list prices on Megarider (season type) tickets.
@DaveC and you expect a thread to stay on topic? ;-)
Is it too much to ask? ;-)
Wombats!
Don't they reside in Wimbledon Common?
Marin County, I think, deckard.
Haven't seen JP for yonks now. :-(
@Fimm I've just laid hands on one of the freeload racks, I can stick some pics on twitter later if you want? (Or email, non_phone pics are harder to put online from work)
@Smudge that's very kind of you but to be honest I don't think we're seriously in the market for something like that right now. I would be interested in hearing about it after you've used it in anger, though!
Back on topic, sorry ;-P
I discovered this morning why I think Stagecoach don't advertise their standard fares online!
Left the house at 10 past 7 this morning for the 7.20 bus. Get on, "Return to Edinburgh please", he looks surprised and says "£10.20 please". Once my jaw leaves the ground, I pay rather than say 'Actually, I'll get the train thanks', as I wanted to see what the journey was like. Got into work after a bit of a walk at 9.10.
In fairness the journey was fine, although long, so I can completely understand why there was only 3 people on the bus including me. Why would an occasional user sacrifice over an hour a day to save 80p?
No worries, I probably wont use it properly (ie for camping duties) until the summer but will try to let everyone know how it goes :-)
Lot of Brompton users use Carry Freedom trailers - they tend to have addiction to owning anything which folds up and packs away into a small space.
If you are afflicted by Bromptosis you can find out more on treatment available through Brompton-Talk yahoo group, or join the addicts self-help group Bromptonites (on Meetup)
@Fimm not quite clear where the freeload rack reference came in you don't need a bike rack for a car if carrying 2 bikes, or a tricycle.
Plus £52 for a weekend car hire? Did they see you coming of did you pick one of those hire deals for US tourists?
Enterprise were doing some pretty good offers
Anecdote time.
On the train to Dundee yesterday morning I overheard an oil worker chatting (quietly in a north east of england accent) on his phone. The reason I'm sharing it here is because he was commenting that:
- he preferred the train to driving to Aberdeen.
- he would be saving £50 in petrol.
- he was really tired after driving up last time. He can have a snooze, read, chat on the phone on the train.
I thought that was an interesting snippet to air in this context.
"Brompton users ... tend to have addiction to owning anything which folds up and packs away into a small space" LOL.
The "freeload rack" is "theBikeChain's 'amazing product'" (see other thread), i.e. it is a rack to go on a bike, not a rack to attach a bike to a car.
My b/f does the car hire research, he has some sort of price comparison site that he uses. £52 is roughly what I'd expect to pay.
(and my parents have decided to go away for the weekend, the weekend we were talking about going to see them, so the planning will start all over again...)
Re crowriver's train anecdote. I go to see family in Yorkshire now and then. I used to drive there and back but I've long since given that up in favour of the train - it takes half the time of driving and it's generally far less stressful.
It's a pity the train is so much less usable than it used to be though - my memory of pre-Thatcher British Rail is that you could usually just turn up, buy a ticket and hop on any train you liked, unlike now when you have to either book a particular train several months in advance or pay so much you're practically buying the thing.
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